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Author Topic:   If evolution is wrong, is Creation right?
MPW
Inactive Member


Message 53 of 64 (82165)
02-02-2004 2:28 PM
Reply to: Message 50 by sidelined
02-02-2004 2:12 PM


I saw Dan's post, he gave quotes, but did not falsify them. And I said that , like everyone, Hovind has a few errors. But the bulk of what he says is perfectly logical and scientific. Oh and you guys are WAY off the wall with Hovind. He says all the time "
I did not even know what being a humanist meant. I was only sixteen, and the brain doesn't even start developing until about twenty."
GIVE ME A BREAK that was a JOKE! He was making the crowd laugh! Almost all jokes anyone tell aren't truthful... A couple other of those statements are jokes too I believe, they were taken out of context. That is crooked what you're doing.
Please explain what the gene code would use the information for prior to nylon being first made in 1938.
Flawed reasoning. The bug didn't have to know about nylon. It had the genes to produce the acids or whatever is needed to digest it. I can make a new food that your stomach acids can digest, that doesn't prove evolution.
Pity!
Again, the classic "I'm smart, you're dumb" attitude. Are you saying that my arguments are invalid because of me having no knowlegde? I call that a personal attack and a sign that you are losing the argument.
Also, I have seen people here saying I'm getting this stuff from websites, etc. Where are you getting your information? From the anti-hovind websites and the evolutionist ones!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by sidelined, posted 02-02-2004 2:12 PM sidelined has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 55 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-02-2004 2:34 PM MPW has replied

MPW
Inactive Member


Message 54 of 64 (82167)
02-02-2004 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 52 by MrHambre
02-02-2004 2:28 PM


Would the creation model predict that humans and chimpanzees have nearly identical genomes despite being completely independently created, and that one major difference is a chromosome-fusion mutation in the human genome? Would the creation model predict that both would have the exact same mutation in a gene that creates vitamin-C synthase in other organisms, in the exact same spot in both genomes, despite each species being completely independently created? Does this really, truly constitute evidence of independent creation, or is it stretching the imagination rather egregiously?
Are you supporting creation, or evolution? I didn't get that. What creation model are you talking about? The chromosone numbers between humans and apes are completely different. And if the apes and humans have characteristics in common, that could be interpreted as having a common designer.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by MrHambre, posted 02-02-2004 2:28 PM MrHambre has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by MrHambre, posted 02-02-2004 2:41 PM MPW has replied

MPW
Inactive Member


Message 58 of 64 (82171)
02-02-2004 2:39 PM
Reply to: Message 55 by Dan Carroll
02-02-2004 2:34 PM


So, if I understand you correctly, you are saying that basic grey squirrels, red squirrels, and flying squirrels are all different created kinds, correct? After all, you've been pretty adamant that one cannot change to another, and that they were all created as is, without change.
Actually, they are different kinds, unless you can prove that one changed to the other.
I don't get it. How is it a joke to say that the brain does not begin developing until you're 20?
I could say your sense of humor is sleeping, but I won't. Just that he does more than 100 seminars every year, and every room roars with laughter.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 55 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-02-2004 2:34 PM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 60 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-02-2004 2:45 PM MPW has not replied

MPW
Inactive Member


Message 61 of 64 (82178)
02-02-2004 2:53 PM
Reply to: Message 57 by :æ:
02-02-2004 2:37 PM


Wherever a few are selected out of many, information has increased.
I don't know where you got that from, but common sense tells me it doesn't work. You can lose, but never gain. Information NEVER increases without intelligence, period.
Let me ask you this: What would consititute an information addition in the gene code, according to you? How would you measure it? Do you know? I'll suggest refraining from speculation if you don't.
Do YOU know what genetic information is? Do you know what DNA is? Do you know how it works? If you did, you wouldn't need me to tell you how it is measured. Using the same logic, you also have nothing to say about this because you obviously don't know any more.
The 2ndLoT saying nothing of what you first claimed it did. It does not say things are "running down," nor that things are "getting worse." This is the Creationist definition of the 2ndLoT, and as far as physicists know, it is not valid in this universe.
You have just defied one of the most well known and most vigorously tested laws!!!!!!!!!!!! It is VALID! In a closed system, entropy increases! The universe is a closed system, unless you find something outside of it!!!!
If evolution is true, where did the laws of thermodynamics come from anyway?
Why do you believe that it came from anything at all? It seems from our observations that it simply is.
Everything HAS to come from somewhere. Thats a FACT. What you are saying is fantasy.
Some of your other statements were biased and had nothign to do with fact. They were aimed at me, not creation.
Animals can change and vary and adapt but they can NEVER be something else!
Why not? What is to stop a bunch of little changes adding up to big ones with time?
If I begin piling soil in front of you with a shovel, what is to prevent the slowly forming hill from eventually becoming a mountain?
If I begin walking due westward in St. Louis, MO, what's to stop my little 3-foot steps from eventually adding up to hundreds of miles?
The answer to all of these questions is "Nothing." You've conceded that change happens. As a result, information increases. Over time, little changes can add up to big ones. These are the facts, and I suggest you get used to them.
I have already proved this logic faulty in my second post I believe.
It does not add up. THERE IS A LIMIT! Farmers have bred pigs to get bigger and bigger. But given 400000000000000 years, the pigs will never be as big as Teaxas. Yet another example of LIMITS!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by :æ:, posted 02-02-2004 2:37 PM :æ: has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 63 by Eta_Carinae, posted 02-02-2004 3:01 PM MPW has not replied

MPW
Inactive Member


Message 62 of 64 (82180)
02-02-2004 2:59 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by MrHambre
02-02-2004 2:41 PM


chimpanzees have more chromosomes than humans do. Know why? Because, it seems, a mutation fused one pair long ago in the development of the human genome. These fusions have been observed in other species, too. The creation model can't account for it.
Creation model? God does what he wants! And you said "it seems" thats not a fact.
Common designer? Well, why wouldn't all organisms have identical genomes then?
Again, God does what he feels like.
All I'm saying is that evolution is not scientific?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by MrHambre, posted 02-02-2004 2:41 PM MrHambre has not replied

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