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Author | Topic: Executive Pay - Good Capitalism Bad Capitalism? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat's Eye writes:
That's too simplistic. I don't contribute anything directly to the bottom line; I just make a more pleasant environment for the people who do. And they could hire somebody for half what they pay me. From the company's perspective, its how much they contribute to the bottom line. So how do you determine what I "should" be paid?
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Cat's Eye writes:
So it's arbitrary.
The actual contribution to the bottom line is too complicated to calculate. So the company just offers a wage that they know is less than the contribution they figure.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat's Eye writes:
Why not?
ringo writes:
Not at all. So it's arbitrary.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat's Eye writes:
But you said that that "something" is too complicated to calculate. Granted that something is more than nothing but any particular something - such as the actual dollars-and-cents amount on your paycheck - is chosen more-or-less arbitrarily, because your actual contribution is too complicated to calculate.
Because its based on something rather than nothing.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
NoNukes writes:
It all comes down to ownership, which in itself is a feudal term. The individual "owns" what he can grab. What the little guy grabs is grabbed away from him by the big guy. The big guy "owns" it because he had the power to grab it. That still does not explain how we can call someone a thief or an exploiter if he is paid what someone considers to be too much for is his labor. What people "deserve" is what they need, not what they can grab.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
In Canada we get a "basic exemption" on our income tax. That's an attempt to determine what we need. We also have a "poverty line". That's another attempt to determine what we need.
But who determines what you need?
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
NoNukes writes:
I don't think I said you should be limited to what you need. That's the minimum that you "deserve".
Using your definition, no matter how many hours I work, I "deserve" only that which I need. NoNukes writes:
You couldn't have got farther from my position if you worked at it 25 hours a day. The idea that you don't even own, let alone value your own or labor, which is inherent in the position you are pushing.... Of course you own your labour. What you don't own is an infinite amount of resources in exchange for your labour. Even if people are willing to pay, you don't "deserve" more. There ought to be a better way than hoarding to recognize exceptional contributions.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
Customer service.
If you have higher costs than your competitors, how can you sell more widgets than them?
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
Sure. You charge higher prices for better service. You pay your workers better to provide better service. It's a vicious circle.
But if your costs are higher than your competitors and he's doing the same you either take less profit or have higher prices.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
If that was true, there wouldn't be anybody providing better customer service.
People will tell you all sorts of things about being prepared to spend a bit more for great service but the majority will then go out and buy the cheapest.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
You said:
But it doesn't mean that no-one would specialise in a niche where customer service matters.quote:and I replied: quote:You could have just agreed with me from the start.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
Since you're (now) saying the same thing I said, no.
But then I'd have been wrong too.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
And you agreed that there are businesses providing better customer service. That's all I'm saying.
You said If that was true, there wouldn't be anybody providing better customer service.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
Indeed, so you can stop pretending that I'm wrong. Sky is blue, water is wet..... Edited by ringo, : Speling.
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Tangle writes:
And yet you agreed with it in Message 94: "But it doesn't mean that no-one would specialise in a niche where customer service matters."
This..
quote:...is wrong.
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