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Author | Topic: Creation | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
NoNukes Inactive Member
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All you need is an assumption that the universe that existed at the point you mentioned and did not exist 1 billionth of a second earlier by some miracle began to exist. I know better than to ask. But do you have any clue what evidence scientist cite for the BBT? I see here that you just label certain concepts assumptions, but do you know what the heck you are talking about? I ask this because you have a track record here of getting science wrong. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
This thread is in the Science Forums. Please refrain from using Thor in this thread. Surely it is okay to cite the Bible for what it says in the Accuracy and Inerrancy thread, particularly when someone claims that the text is in error. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
Non sequitur.
ringo writes:
You have a lot of faith don' you. The Bible is not true. We know that.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
Moses didn't write Genesis.
It seems to me that the man writing about the events of Genesis chapter 1 was above some events looking on what was taking place and at other times standing on the water looking up and eventually on the ground looking up and out He spent 80 days and nights in the mount with God in which God could have showed him the events as they took place.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
I did - the word "firmament". According to Wikipedia:
Could you point out the scriptures that support such an assertion as they thought of it as "a solid dome over the earth"?quote: ICANT writes:
Wikipedia again:
I do find where those who rendered raki'a by firmamentum regarded it as a solid body. That means it came from the Latin Vulgate which did not exist until the 4th century AD and not from the Hebrew text.quote:
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
Plants growing on the third day (Geneis 1:11-13) before the sun was created (Genesis 1:14-19).
ringo writes:
Produce the evidence to support your assertion. We don't have to go beyond page 1 of the Bible to find mistakes.
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
The program had received an update that included a bunch of erroneous information. This information had to be purged and restored to the old version and I have finally got it back to where it should be. Oh dear - glad you got that sorted.
Strong #1507 εἱλίσσω does not appear in the original text regardless of what any program or anyone says it means. I find no definition for this word. quote: That's from Thayer's Greek Lexicon.
quote: From Strong's.
quote: Verbs come in many flavours, they conjugate. The verb 'to run' in the past tense is 'ran' and in the present tense is 'running'. Its somewhat irregular, but not as irregular as 'go' which becomes 'went'. είλισσόμενον is the perfect mediopassive form of εἱλίσσω or ελίσσω - that's what the -μενον suffix is telling us. This form doesn't alter verbs in English as it does in Greek. In any event it is translated in the KJV as
quote: NIV as
quote: Douay-Rheims as
quote: Young's as
quote: So the evidence confirms the verb is as I said.
It makes no difference what anyone says εἱλίσσω is not in the Greek Text. You put a lot of effort into my interesting piece of trivia. Nobody says that word is in the Greek Text in that exact form. It'd be like me saying the sentence 'The evolution of cats is interesting' contains reference to the verb 'evolve' and you arguing that the word 'evolve' is not literally in the sentence. Or 'I went running' and you saying the verb 'go' and 'run' are not in the sentence. It's pretty silly given the triviality of the point, don't you think? Edited by Modulous, : No reason given.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Hi ringo,
ringo writes: Plants growing on the third day (Geneis 1:11-13) before the sun was created (Genesis 1:14-19). Last I heard the sun was part of the universe. Since the Universe existed complete at the end of verse 1 there is no plants before the sun. Either you are mistaken or whoever you are talking behind do not know what they are talking about. God Bless,"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Hi NoNukes,
Did you put me back on your talk to list?
NoNukes writes: I know better than to ask. But do you have any clue what evidence scientist cite for the BBT? But we are not talking about the BBT. It does not start until the universe exists. In other words we are talking about where it came from. Now if you know of any evidence of T=0 I am all ears. The only scientific answer I have been given to date is: "we don't know". To me, "we don't know" translates into we will assume it exists and then go from there. And I nor anyone else should question what the BBT says."John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Hi ringo,
ringo writes: Wikipedia again:
quote: First thing is that Wikipedia is not an authority on Biblical Hebrew. Never the less it does tell you where the domed earth belief came from. It states plainly that it came from the Latin Vulgate which is not the Hebrew text. The Latin Vulgate was translated by the Catholic Church. I like Gods definition of raki'a better than that of any man or woman.
quote: Remember that whatever it is it begins at the surface of the water and extends upwards to wherever water exists. That could mean it is even outside of our milky way. So God called the expanse which is one of the definitions of raki'a, heaven which is the sky, even to where the stars are and including them. God Bless,"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6
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Hi ringo,
ringo writes: Moses didn't write Genesis. And you know that because________________ God Bless,"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
That isn't what it says.
Since the Universe existed complete at the end of verse 1....
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
And neither are you.
First thing is that Wikipedia is not an authority on Biblical Hebrew. ICANT writes:
It says that it came from the Septuagint, which is the closest thing to the "original" Hebrew text that we have.
Never the less it does tell you where the domed earth belief came from. It states plainly that it came from the Latin Vulgate which is not the Hebrew text. ICANT writes:
You're thinking backwards. You're projecting the modern concept of "space" backwards onto the word "heaven".
I like Gods definition of raki'a better than that of any man or woman.
quote: ICANT writes:
Yes, the stars were seen as lamps attached to the firmament (ceiling). There's no reason to think there was any appreciable thickness to the firmament.
So God called the expanse which is one of the definitions of raki'a, heaven which is the sky, even to where the stars are and including them.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
ICANT writes:
The idea that Genesis was written by Moses is just a tradition.
ringo writes:
And you know that because________________ Moses didn't write Genesis.
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ICANT Member Posts: 6769 From: SSC Joined: Member Rating: 1.6 |
Hi ringo,
ringo writes: And neither are you. My Bible Language degrees and further studies would disagree with you.
ringo writes: Yes, the stars were seen as lamps attached to the firmament (ceiling). There's no reason to think there was any appreciable thickness to the firmament. But the nearest stars to Earth are in the Alpha Centauri triple-star system, about 4.37 light years away. The star Deneb is the farthest star that can be easily seen with the naked eye. It is thought to be between 1,400 and 3,000 light years from Earth. So if those are attached to the ceiling as the ancient Greeks believed they are a long way from the earth and therefore a roof over planet earth is nonsense. God Bless,"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."
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