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Member (Idle past 1431 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Climate Change Denier comes in from the cold: SCIENCE!!! | |||||||||||||||||||||||
frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Given that there is such a push for change right now how screwed are we really we are at 1.2 + got here from 0.9 + last year. And given that there is a tendency to be less alarmist then you should while doing research in global warming, a tenancy of even the worst models falling off the mark to actual measurements are we done for ?
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
The problem with this topic as always is that the science just isn't clear enough to prove anything. The guy in the video is very convinced that he's arrived at a scientific conclusion from his studies that proves there is global warming (he's using that term instead of the more equivocal "climate change" which is interesting in itself), and that human activity is the cause of it, and he sketches out the theories his study eliminated which leaves this conclusion. But while I'm sure he's sincere it's basically all just his own assertion, his own conclusions, and there's just no way for a person to assess whether his study really did cover all the possibilities, really did include all the relevant information, really did prove what he says. There are others who sound just as sincere and just as aware of all the variables, who disagree with him about such scientific basics. Yea you could have said that 40 years ago but now there is consnsus in the scietific community that there is climate change and mankind is responsible. Sure there are a few on the fence usually paid by the oil industry but the vast majority of scientists agree so your best bet if you dont know anything on the topic is to listen to them.
Isn't Planet Earth subject to long-term cycles of warming and cooling according to current theory? Um yea linked to co2 increases decreases.
Isn't there really just too much input of various kinds to come to any such clear conclusion? The only thing that fits perfectly is co2 increas increases the temperature of the earth. While other ideas like the sun being responcible do not show any correlation.
And given the horrific political consequences of forcing industrialized nations to toe some invented scientific line, how can anybody be eager to see such a solution to what could turn out to be an imaginary problem or at least a problem that has other causes and other possible soilutions if any? At this point thats like saying why would you force me in to a bucket brigade when there is a chance that the fire 5 m from my house wont reach it.
Not that there shouldn't be measures taken to cut down on all kinds of emissions and pollutions, I'm sure there should be, but most recommendations are culture-killers and there just isn't enough scientific evidence to warrant them. Im on the side that thinks its alredy to late the best we can hope for is a +3 degree rise. And that the following turmoil caused by famine, thirst mass migration .... does not push us in to nuclear war and thus nailing the last nail in humanitys coffin rendering ourselves extinct.
Simply because humanity is to greedy to stop pouring more and more co2 every year in to the atmosphere, well at least until the first grate catastrophe that will be linked to global warming. Im talking about something like a grate drought trough the center of america cutting the WORLDS grain supply by 30% but what will a hungry wolrd do will we finaly act or go to ware with people that have food. Edited by frako, : No reason given. Edited by frako, : No reason given.Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Trying to get meat of of peoples tables is even harder then trying to take their gas away. The only real solution would be depopulation there are at least 4 billion to many of us. We are the last generation that parties like there is no tomorrow, the ones that come after us will know only hunger and suffering because we fucked up their planet.
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Here's a thought: Start growing gardens and teaching the next generation to grow gardens. And bring back the God of the Bible. Sure and remember to teach them how to grow food whitout water, and land. A person needs 0,5 Ha of FERTILE land to grow enough food for himself.( not accounting for loss of fertility, bad weather, pests etc...) The world is currently making due with 0,2 Ha of FERTILE land per person, the rest we make up with fishing the oceans barren grazing, starvation and of course farming land that is not very fertile. The math just does not add up there are to many people. It's not even a matter of decreasing the population growth anymore, we could have gotten away with that a few decades ago, now we need to murder 4 billion people if we wish that the 4 billion left have a chance at a decent future. My guess is when the powerful realise that the game is up a highly lethal virus with a very long incubation period, will be released so they can continue to enjoy themselves. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Digesting milk is a super power only 30% of the population have after they reach adulthood. A mutation if you will.
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Someone in one of these films said that if cattle are free to roam and eat grass the e coli isn't a problem the way it is in confined quarters where their hides get splattered with it. And the grass itself plays some role in this though I didn't quite get what. Well duh, in the worst factory farms they have to feed the animals antibiotics just so they can survive the horrible conditions they are put in. Grass does pay a role cows sheep, goats and other grazing animals are built to eat grass, but if you feed them grain they get fatter faster. Thing is we dont have nearly enough grazing land to provide enough meat for everyone, put too many animals on the same pasture and its no different then having them holed up in a pen knee deep in their own shit. probably worse since alot of parasites have a life cycle that makes them go trough dygestive systems to get eaten up again later. I had 3 horses in a 12 000 m2 pasture and it was barely large enough to not get turned in to mud, with the exceptions where the horses hung out most of the time where the pasture was just mud. but there was enough grass to feed them trough the year there, i still had to make 350 square bales of hay for the winter. If we farm that way to get healthy meat you can expect a jucy stake to cost 100$ Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
I think the world will probably adopt the chinese model once climate change really starts to mess with our food production. You know, everything is good to eat, snakes, scorpions, grasshopers....
As for fruits and veggies yea they'r good for you but not the ones from the supermarket, especially the american supermarket. My treas don't produce such shiny and perfect apples that you can get there but i bet my balls that mine are 100X healthier. Tomato's in the supermarket are practically water while home grown ones are so frim you can bight in to them like an apple and you dont have your face covered in its jucies.... But if the food industry switched to this kind of healthy food production the prices would skyrocket and people would starve. Its not just meat production that is killing our planet the whole food industry is. My fruit trees have grass growing underneath them, the treas that put fruits on your supermarket shelves have nothing growing underneath theyr sprayed with weed and insect killers so nothing can interfere with the growth of the fruits or veggies. The same goes for almost everything you find on the supermarket shelves its capitalism baby. Sure there are ways for even city folk to grow their own veggies, put a bag of soil on your balcony punch a few hols in it and place seeds inside it will grow beautifully but noone has a 0.5 ha balcony in the city to have enough space to produce enough food for himself. Such measures will soon be necessary but its just a bandage on an infected wound. There are simply too many of us. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
But you keep totalizing the problem and acting as if we only have five minutes to drastically change our habits. We don't all have to grow all our food all at once, we can do it little by little, whoever can and however we can. and the more of us do it and reject the supermarket offerings the more those offerings are bound to improve too, because they are consumer-driven. Because it is already too late. The way we are farming is ruining the soil, climate change alredy has negative effects on our crop production, it is far to late for any soft solution.
(What does "ha" mean? It's a measurement I guess but how large is it?) Hektar or 10 ars LOL or 0,5 ha is 53819.55 square feet.
HERE'S a page about the new gizmo called the tower garden, that grows fruits and vegetables "aeroponically" in a vertical space. People even have them in their living rooms, but a patio or balcony is better. Better yet is some yard space of course, but we do what we can however we can and figure if it's a good idea it will grow on people over time. Thats the method where you spray roots with nutrient rich water right those plants grow fast but they cant be nearly as healthy for you as those grown the natural way. And given that cities already face problems with water suply if every apartment grew palnts this way there would be too little water to go around in just about every city in the world. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
But what does this have to do with the amount of carbon being released into the atmosphere? One of the negative effects of climate change is a decrease in crop production, i think it is still whitin the lines of the topic at hand. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
The only large impact I am aware of is the clearing of natural habitats to make room for farms. Natural habitats, like prairies or rainforests, are natural carbon sinks since they bury plant matter. That is the irony of Brazilian ethanol production. Ethanol may be a renewable fuel, but they are clearing massive tracts of rainforest to grow crops for ethanol production and this results in a loss of carbon sinks. They will have to grow corn for decades or even centuries (relative to burning fossil fuels) before they break even with respect to their impact on total carbon in the atmosphere. Im guessing its more then just choping down the lungs of our world, if you irrigate you increase the evaporation rate of water in a region and we irrigate so much some grate rivers dont make it to the see anymore. Apart from water vapour being a greenhouse gas that helps increase the temperature of our planet we are probably also changing rainfall patterns this way. Using weed killers on such a scale that everything around your crops is brown earth decreases the albedo of the planet. Warming it further. And of course transportation, we have a law that any food has to have a declaration of its origin, we get food from all over the world essentially brought to our homes, meaning we burn a lot of fosil fuels to get it there warming our planet even further. Edited by frako, : decreases albedo not increases LOLChristianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Evaporation has a cooling effect. Yea as in sweat transfers heat from your body to the atmosphere not out in to space, away from the earth. Think monkey think The problems of both weed killers and transportation costs would be decreased if personal gardening got popular. Sure but not to some high degree.
Long term, with the right planning, even rivers and rainforests can be restored. Sure the right planning would be kill of 4 billion humans and the earth will start to heal itself. Sure we could have taken the soft aproach by limiting births per person or even softer taxing those with more children, but we dont have the time to do it now. We have to produce more and more on an exponential scale to meet the demands of so many people, by the time such measures would have the any effect the world would alredy be 2 degrees warmer and still warming do to the fact that we are increasing the "insulation" of earth faster then it can warm up. Edited by frako, : No reason given. Edited by frako, : No reason given. Edited by frako, : No reason given.Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
your right 100 not 10
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
I think most climate change deniers fail to realise by how much we have increased our co output just the past 30 years.
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that. |
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Yea but there is still the issue of Windmill Cancer.
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
double post
Edited by frako, : No reason given.Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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