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Author Topic:   Re-enactments of the Noah's Ark voyage?
Randy
Member (Idle past 6247 days)
Posts: 420
From: Cincinnati OH USA
Joined: 07-19-2002


Message 136 of 204 (83170)
02-04-2004 8:44 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by johnfolton
02-04-2004 8:03 PM


Re: Ventilation and steamed ark soup
quote:
Randy, They probably dumped the waste in the top of the moon pool, just trying to give them running water and a self flushing waste disposal system, etc...
Opening the top of the moon pool to dump in waste will sink the ark as surely as blowing a hole in a row boat with a shotgun that someone mentioned. I think you must be troll. I don't see how anyone could really be as dense as you are pretending to be.
Randy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by johnfolton, posted 02-04-2004 8:03 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by johnfolton, posted 02-04-2004 8:53 PM Randy has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5592 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 137 of 204 (83172)
02-04-2004 8:53 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Randy
02-04-2004 8:44 PM


Re: Ventilation and steamed ark soup
Randy, You must not be a scientist(not that I am either), or you wouldn't say that, if the same atmospheric pressure is inside the ark, the level of the moon pool would be the same as the outside of the ark, etc...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 8:44 PM Randy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 138 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 9:32 PM johnfolton has replied

  
Randy
Member (Idle past 6247 days)
Posts: 420
From: Cincinnati OH USA
Joined: 07-19-2002


Message 138 of 204 (83174)
02-04-2004 9:32 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by johnfolton
02-04-2004 8:53 PM


Re: Ventilation and steamed ark soup
quote:
Randy, You must not be a scientist(not that I am either), or you wouldn't say that, if the same atmospheric pressure is inside the ark, the level of the moon pool would be the same as the outside of the ark, etc...
I understand that but that means you have to have the sides of the moon pool well above the water line ark and this will take up a lot of space. It will also destroy any structural integrity of the ark's hull may have had. The problem you are not seeing is that large wooden ships flex and the tendency of a beam to flex under load depends on the cube of its length. That's why wooden ships were never much over 300 feet long even when braced with iron, which Noah didn't have no matter what you claim. A 500 foot boat would need to be nearly 5 times as strong as a 300 foot boat to flex the same amount.
The moon pool will leak into the ark from the inside while the sides of the ark leak in from the outside. No matter how much pitch you use this boat will sink as soon as any wave action occurs and don't tell us you can have jets of steam shooting out of the ocean without wave action.
The steam cooks the earth to death thousands of times over as I have clearly shown so it doesn't really matter how fast the ark sinks anyway.
Added in Edit: I was wrong about one thing as I think about it. I't won't really matter if you open the "moon pool". The ark will sink about as fast with it open or closed. Of course the door in the side won't help the structural integrety either and "moon pool" is a modern addition to the myth that as far as I know was never used in ancient ships anyway. It is rather amusing how unBibical Young Earth creationism is becoming lately.
Randy
[This message has been edited by Randy, 02-04-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by johnfolton, posted 02-04-2004 8:53 PM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by johnfolton, posted 02-04-2004 10:20 PM Randy has not replied

  
Randy
Member (Idle past 6247 days)
Posts: 420
From: Cincinnati OH USA
Joined: 07-19-2002


Message 139 of 204 (83176)
02-04-2004 9:37 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by NosyNed
02-04-2004 8:05 PM


Re: Ventilation and steamed ark soup
quote:
I've been suggesting Randy, that whatever be held to a narrower scope. That he answer the fossil sorting problem and show that there was a flood before going nuts on ark design. Otherwise he should be ignored.
This problem is that no YEC can explain any part of how a worldwide flood could have created the fossil record but they still believe in the flood. They can't explain biogeography either as that thread clearly shows but they still believe in the flood. They have to believe in the global flood so they will deny or ignore any amount of evidence against it and keep trying to explain how a 600 year old man could have saved the ancestors of all the people and animals on earth in a big wooden boat during a flood that supposedly rearranged all the world'w geology and they are totally immune to all the science and logic that proves how wrong they are.
Randy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 8:05 PM NosyNed has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 9:46 PM Randy has replied

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8996
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 140 of 204 (83177)
02-04-2004 9:46 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by Randy
02-04-2004 9:37 PM


Time wasters
Then why waste time with this particular one who seems worse than most?

Common sense isn't

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 9:37 PM Randy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 141 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 9:52 PM NosyNed has replied

  
Randy
Member (Idle past 6247 days)
Posts: 420
From: Cincinnati OH USA
Joined: 07-19-2002


Message 141 of 204 (83178)
02-04-2004 9:52 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by NosyNed
02-04-2004 9:46 PM


Re: Time wasters
I am not sure why I do it. Why do you? Why do people pick at pimples when they know it just makes them worse? Who know?
Randy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 9:46 PM NosyNed has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 9:59 PM Randy has replied

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 8996
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 142 of 204 (83179)
02-04-2004 9:59 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by Randy
02-04-2004 9:52 PM


Re: Time wasters
I'm trying to learn to judge more quickly which people can actually carry on something like a conversation and which are totally hopeless. I'd at least like to find just those who are capable of listening and reasoning a little bit and do it with less effort.
whatever has demonstrated something which borders on a mental illness. It isn't worth carrying on with him.
I'm hoping to find a sort of acid test to sort out the worst pretty quick.

Common sense isn't

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 9:52 PM Randy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 10:07 PM NosyNed has not replied

  
Randy
Member (Idle past 6247 days)
Posts: 420
From: Cincinnati OH USA
Joined: 07-19-2002


Message 143 of 204 (83181)
02-04-2004 10:07 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by NosyNed
02-04-2004 9:59 PM


Re: Time wasters
quote:
I'm hoping to find a sort of acid test to sort out the worst pretty quick.
Look for reverant references to Kent Hovind, Ron Wyatt or Carl Baugh. Anyone who gives those jokers credibility is likely to be on the far side of wacko.
We used to have some intellegent and half way reasonable YECs around here. True Creation still come around occasionally I see. I wonder what happened to Tranquility Base?
Randy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 9:59 PM NosyNed has not replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5592 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 144 of 204 (83185)
02-04-2004 10:20 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by Randy
02-04-2004 9:32 PM


Randy, You forget that everything grew bigger pre-flood, trees over 500 feet would made it possible for all the boards to be quite thick, no cut an pasting necessary, it was an enclosed vessel, the stresses could be balanced to all outside edges, so the ark wouldn't flex,
likely the sealing pitch increased the tensile strength, deflecting the wave energies, if the ark was 54.72 feet high, and treeding 40 feet into the waters, with water filling the ballast, with the sea anchors it wouldn't be bouncing in the waves, the moon pools would absorb center wave energies, the water would be flowing around the ark, shouldn't be a whole lot of excessive stresses, etc...
P.S. How low is the water line are those long boats that flex excessively, is this being caused because they are bouncing within the waves(taking a pounding), getting hit sideways, taking a pounding, perhaps those boats wouldn't flex excessively, if they just threw out 4 large sea anchors, the boat would then always face into the waves, lots of boat try power into the waves, instead of throwing out the sea anchors, and flowing with the wave, etc...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 138 by Randy, posted 02-04-2004 9:32 PM Randy has not replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5592 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 145 of 204 (83321)
02-05-2004 9:33 AM
Reply to: Message 121 by NosyNed
02-04-2004 1:21 PM


I don't know
I'm not a scientists, I'd have to study up on the fossils, sediments, I already mentioned to mark24 that "I don't know" what fossils are in what imaginary layer, so declined to get into it, sugggest you check out Walts site(liquefication), and apply Hugh Ross mentality to an old earth, young fossil mentality, then it should all fall together like a big jigsaw puzzle, the real issue is likely how long has the sun been shining, how old are the fossils, the rocks would of dated old even before they erupted out of the earth, (helium levels in granites suggesting the sediments were recently laid down), etc...I really don't have the time to get into it, you seem to be wanting answers, perhaps you should research into this, rather than have others research it for you, you would learn more this way, etc...
P.S. I'm more of an Old Earth Young Fossil mentality, because I take kjv genesis 1:1 to literally mean "in the beginning" (how long ago was this beginning?) God created the heaven (the stars, galaxies, etc...) and the earth, so any sediment paleosols without fossils, could of been laid down pre-flood, 10,000 years ago, 20,000 years ago, even 4.6 billion years all the way back to the beginning, agree some of these pre-flood sediments could of been resorted, most fossils are only 4,350 years old, God gave us his Word and it says the creatures that were on the face of the ground were destroyed, only those (on the ark) survived, kjv genesis 7:23, (this means all creatures on dry land, so the fishes, snakes, etc....were not destroyed by the flood, etc...), etc...
[This message has been edited by whatever, 02-05-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 121 by NosyNed, posted 02-04-2004 1:21 PM NosyNed has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 146 by JonF, posted 02-05-2004 9:56 AM johnfolton has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 146 of 204 (83330)
02-05-2004 9:56 AM
Reply to: Message 145 by johnfolton
02-05-2004 9:33 AM


Re: I don't know
then it should all fall together like a big jigsaw puzzle
Yes! It Does! Thank you !
Walt's a loon! The YEC's are all wrong! You are just making stuff up, and you are really bad at it! The Earth is old! Life is old! The Universe is older! There was no global flood! Now it all makes sense!
Thanks again.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by johnfolton, posted 02-05-2004 9:33 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by johnfolton, posted 02-05-2004 10:03 AM JonF has replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5592 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 147 of 204 (83333)
02-05-2004 10:03 AM
Reply to: Message 146 by JonF
02-05-2004 9:56 AM


JonF, Walt brings a lot of the pieces of the puzzle together, if he feel the earth was created 12,000 years ago, then some sediments in question could of easily formed pre-flood, it would help your cause if you didn't have to date a rock to date the fossil, etc...
[This message has been edited by whatever, 02-05-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by JonF, posted 02-05-2004 9:56 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by JonF, posted 02-05-2004 1:36 PM johnfolton has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 148 of 204 (83407)
02-05-2004 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by johnfolton
02-05-2004 10:03 AM


Re:
it would help your cause if you didn't have to date a rock to date the fossil
Perhaps so, but our cause doesn't need much help.
Your/Walt's theory, however, needs lots of help. It would help if it were not internally inconsistent, physically impossible, unable to explain heh evidence, and contradicted by the evidence.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by johnfolton, posted 02-05-2004 10:03 AM johnfolton has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by johnfolton, posted 02-05-2004 6:36 PM JonF has not replied

  
johnfolton 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5592 days)
Posts: 2024
Joined: 12-04-2005


Message 149 of 204 (83564)
02-05-2004 6:36 PM
Reply to: Message 148 by JonF
02-05-2004 1:36 PM


JonF, Well we've already discussed toes inconsistencies, but that why its only a theory, perhaps ID should replace toe, given all them inconsistencies, etc...
P.S. Thanks for your imput on ark design, addressing the vent problem, etc...
[This message has been edited by whatever, 02-05-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by JonF, posted 02-05-2004 1:36 PM JonF has not replied

  
mf
Inactive Member


Message 150 of 204 (94566)
03-24-2004 7:12 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Rrhain
12-26-2003 2:20 PM


Idiot.
Edit: FYI In response to Rrhain's comment in post 9
[your argument is] an idiot. I hate it when people think that they are smart because they take everything super literally. "Oh look at me, I can calculate stuff based on my totally uninformed view of creationism. You guys should think I am smart." If you are so smart, then show me that the Genesis, as a historical reference, says that all the water for a global flood came from rain. Show me. Go on. You calculated it, might as well show me where it came from...
[This message has been edited by mf, 03-24-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Rrhain, posted 12-26-2003 2:20 PM Rrhain has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by crashfrog, posted 03-24-2004 7:18 PM mf has not replied
 Message 152 by RAZD, posted 03-24-2004 7:19 PM mf has replied

  
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