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Author | Topic: REMIX: Who Can Be Saved? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I believe I said the Romans quote was presented as history, a straight statement about the man who disobeyed and the man who obeyed. Two real men.
However if you want to push me I'll say the account in Genesis is also presented as history, because it is. Just because you believe it's impossible doesn't give you a right to force your view on me as the truth to which I am to bow. AND it's science that says it's all impossible that is the fairy tale. Sorrry. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 421 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
ringo writes: Faith writes:
The other problem with that is that there was never a time in history when there was only one man and one woman. It's biologically impossible. Therefore, it's another miracle or another metaphor or another fairy tale. The man is a man and the story in Eden is historical. Or a "Just So" story that was meant to explain why people fear snakes, why we had to farm instead of being hunter/gatherers, why childbirth seemed more painful for humans than other animals, why we wear clothes unlike any other animal, why we have a society based on rules and consequences and most importantly why women must be subject to and inferior to men.
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
Clearly it isn't. There are no talking snakes in history. There is no reasoning at all behind your empty claim.
However if you want to push me I'll say the account in Genesis is also presented as history, because it is. Faith writes:
I'm not forcing anything on you. I'm pointing out your errors. Anybody else who's capable of reading can see that you're wrong. Just because you believe it's impossible doesn't give you a right to force your view on me as the truth to which I am to bow.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
The snake talked. Get over it.
And this is all just a ridiculous distraction from the gospel fact I was trying to present. Adam the first man brought sin into the world, while Jesus the last man paid our sin debt so we can be restored to God's favor. Paul believed the Genesis account, so did Jesus, so did all who wrote books of the Bible, so do all believers in Christ. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
I know the snake talked. So did the Three Bears. It's a clue.
The snake talked. Get over it. Faith writes:
Yes, that's a literary point being made. It's not a fact and it's not history.
Adam the first man brought sin into the world, while Jesus the last man paid our sin debt so we can be restored to God's favor. Faith writes:
I know you believe they believed it. That has no bearing on whether or not it's true. Paul believed the Genesis account, so did Jesus, so did all who wrote books of the Bible, so do all believers in Christ.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
The....Snake....TALKED. Really really truly TALKED. It is history, not fiction.
Adam brought on the Fall from which we've suffered ever since. It's a reality, not a literary point. Jesus died on a real cross and bled real blood and died a real death from which He rose to real life, to save us from the real sin a real Adam brought into the real world. Sorry your imagination is so cramped you can't recognize real reality. And yes it's true that Jesus believed Genesis to be true truth and real reality, as did everybody else I mentioned. What iis SO difficult about the idea of a supernatural reality anyway? Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
I know the snake talked. That's how we know it's fiction, the same as the three talking bears are fiction. If you know of any history that has talking animals, feel free to give examples.
The....Snake....TALKED. Really really truly TALKED. It is history, not fiction. Faith writes:
It isn't that my imagination is cramped. It's that I don't use my imagination to understand reality. I use evidence. Imagination is for watching Star Wars. Sorry your imagination is so cramped you can't recognize real reality. The evidence is that there never was a time when there was only one man and one woman. The evidence is that people have always suffered - there was no magic moment when it began.
Faith writes:
If He did, He was wrong.
And yes it's true that Jesus believed Genesis to be true truth and real reality.... Faith writes:
I didn't say anything about supernatural reality. I'm talking about real reality, evidenced reality. If there is such a thing as supernatural reality, it isn't history. What iis SO difficult about the idea of a supernatural reality anyway?And our geese will blot out the sun.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined:
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I know the snake talked. That's how we know it's fiction, the same as the three talking bears are fiction. If you know of any history that has talking animals, feel free to give examples. Could be that snakes could talk back in the day when they where still walking. Thing is god only mentions cursing them to slither on their belly, not, not being able to talk ever again. Or it happened off screen and a parrot flew to god to tell him what the snake was doing so parrots got the talking ability from the snake. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Only ONE snake/serpent talked ever, that I know of, and it must have been a supernatural event of some sort, though I suppose it could have been a common enough phenomenon since Eve didn't freak out at it. It is just nonsense to claim the Bible says that "snakes" talk since it was that one and only time that a snake talked, and at the other end of the Bible it is revealed that the snake was in fact Satan, a fallen angel, and they DO talk.
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frako Member (Idle past 332 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
Um so if the snake was Satan, why are actual snakes cursed to slither on their belly all their days. Or is Satan slithering on his belly in hell and the snakes are just where god got his idea for a punishment.
Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 761 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
Well, except that neither fallen nor upright angels are any more real than Angus Dumbledore or Aureliano Buendia. Fiction is fiction.
"The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails." H L Mencken
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Well, except that neither fallen nor upright angels are any more real than Angus Dumbledore or Aureliano Buendia. Fiction is fiction. I know you're going to feel really bad when you recognize how wrong you've been about this, wish you could recognize it when it might still do you some good.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
If there is such a thing as supernatural reality, it isn't history. What utter nonsense. If Jesus is both man and God who died and came back to life that is supernatural and it is history. The miracles of the Bible are all supernatural realities that occurred in history. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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ringo Member (Idle past 439 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
There's no historical reason to think it happened, so it ain't history.
If Jesus is both man and God who died and came back to life that is supernatural and it is history. Faith writes:
Supernatural and history are pretty much mutually exclusive. History pretty much has to be natural, with evidence. That's how we distinguish it from myth. The miracles of the Bible are all supernatural realities that occurred in history.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 761 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined:
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Faith, when I die the electrical activity in my brain will cease. The voltages will all go to zero. It’ll be all over for Coragyps. And I won’t be feeling bad, or good, or feeling anything at all. You are more than welcome to disagree with that, and I know that you do disagree. But that doesn’t make my view incorrect.
Living as justly as possible right here is plenty enough for me.
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