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Author Topic:   Tribute Thread For the Recently Raptured Faith
Hyroglyphx
Member
Posts: 5800
From: Austin, TX
Joined: 05-03-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 241 of 1677 (839843)
09-17-2018 2:00 AM
Reply to: Message 239 by Faith
09-16-2018 11:42 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
You can't compare God's judgments with human transgressions that DESERVE God's judgments.

I don't understand how you can bemoan the tragedy of abortion in one breath and say that God's ordering of infants skulls to be crushed is DESERVED punishment in the next breath. That's quite a feat of mental gymnastics

But I guess you don't see any problems that deserve God's judgments so we don't need to worry, right? Fifty years of abortion with fifty million dead babies, naaa. Oh right legalizing witchcraft is just about ten witches anyway etc etc.

Your whole point was that you know Judgment is nigh because of legalized abortion. I pointed out that it's been nearly fifty years, which hardly seems like swift justice. Then you brought up witchcraft as another obvious sign that the time draw nigh... but there's less "witches" now than there's ever been because modern people know that witchcraft is pure nonsense. To me, neither seem like obvious signs and wonders.

Edited by Hyroglyphx, : No reason given.


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
 Message 239 by Faith, posted 09-16-2018 11:42 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 244 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 7:01 AM Hyroglyphx has responded

    
Hyroglyphx
Member
Posts: 5800
From: Austin, TX
Joined: 05-03-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 242 of 1677 (839844)
09-17-2018 2:04 AM
Reply to: Message 240 by Faith
09-17-2018 12:10 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Remember when God called Jonah to preach to the Ninevites that judgment was coming? He even mentioned that there were I forget how many children who didn't yet "know their left hand from their right" as a case for sparing them; To convince Jonah to preach repentance so He might not have to bring that destruction on them for the sake of those young children. The babies are part of the tribe, there is no way to spare them separately, and it is a punishment to the tribe to do away with their children. The incident described in Psalm 137 by the way is about how the Babylonians had slaughtered the babies of the Israelites so this is vengeance.

... A kind of holy ethnic cleansing. His mercies are enduring!!!

In any case none of that has anything to do with our day when once-Christian nations had eradicated abortion and other evils and are now bringing them back in a full-fledged pagan revival against God's laws. And I ask again: how long do you think He'll put off judgment for what I've listed?

My best guess: forever


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
 Message 240 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 12:10 AM Faith has not yet responded

    
Tangle
Member
Posts: 7066
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 243 of 1677 (839846)
09-17-2018 3:19 AM
Reply to: Message 233 by Faith
09-16-2018 10:33 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
As has been said many times before, you're not unique, every generation of fundie Christian has predicted the end is coming and pretty much always in their own time because they think they're special. Just like you do.

Here's a list of them going back 2,000 years.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...edicted_for_apocalyptic_events

The next one on their list is 9th June 2019, and like all the others it will fail.

Weinland, who previously predicted the world would end in 2011, 2012, and then 2013, predicted in 2018 that Jesus will return on June 9, 2019. He has since expressed some doubts regarding his own prediction.

You'll die waiting Faith.


Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona

"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 233 by Faith, posted 09-16-2018 10:33 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 245 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 7:31 AM Tangle has not yet responded

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 244 of 1677 (839849)
09-17-2018 7:01 AM
Reply to: Message 241 by Hyroglyphx
09-17-2018 2:00 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
As I've pointed out many times, there is always a time lag between offense and judgment. It was some four hundred years before the "fullness of time" was reached for the judgment on Canaan. It was hundreds of years of Israel's transgressions before the Babylonian exile and the carrying away of the northern tribes by Assyria. Sin usually has to accumulate to a certain level before God sends judgment.

Our sin of slavery wasn't punished until the Civil War. If anything fifty years isn't long enough, but our sins have accumulated quite rapidly in recent years so I think that means judgment IS very close.

As a matter of fact we're already under judgment, just not the full brunt of it yet. 9/11 was God's judgment, and the destructive hurricanes over the last decades should also be counted as judgment. I consider the threat of Islam breathing down our necks to be judgment waiting in the wings. Illegal immigration could be counted as judgment.

Which means also that the ascendancy of Leftist politics is itself judgment. The sins that I listed are the result of Leftist politics anyway, so there's a lot of judgment brewing if you understand the times.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-17-2018 2:00 AM Hyroglyphx has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 246 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-17-2018 7:34 AM Faith has responded
 Message 251 by Thugpreacha, posted 09-17-2018 2:02 PM Faith has responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 245 of 1677 (839851)
09-17-2018 7:31 AM
Reply to: Message 243 by Tangle
09-17-2018 3:19 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
You are of course right, it's possible the Rapture won't come in my lifetime, as I acknowledged from the beginning anyway.
This message is a reply to:
 Message 243 by Tangle, posted 09-17-2018 3:19 AM Tangle has not yet responded

    
Hyroglyphx
Member
Posts: 5800
From: Austin, TX
Joined: 05-03-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 246 of 1677 (839852)
09-17-2018 7:34 AM
Reply to: Message 244 by Faith
09-17-2018 7:01 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
9/11 was Gpd's judgment, and the destructive hurricanes over the last decades should also be counted as judgment.

Ah, so God was piloting the planes, not Al Qaeda?

I consider the threat of Islam breathing down our necks to be judgment waiting in the wings. Illegal immigration could be counted as judgment. Which means also that the ascendance of Leftist politics is itself judgment. The sins that I listed are the result of Leftist politics anyway, so there's a lot of judgment brewing if you understand the times.

So in other words, things you deem politically unsavory is a judgment of God. With all of that it leaves little room for Free Will.


"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine

This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 7:01 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 8:07 AM Hyroglyphx has not yet responded

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 247 of 1677 (839855)
09-17-2018 8:07 AM
Reply to: Message 246 by Hyroglyphx
09-17-2018 7:34 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Do you really not understand how God's Providence works?

Also, plenty of free will in the political situation I described, don't see how you think it's lacking.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-17-2018 7:34 AM Hyroglyphx has not yet responded

    
Percy
Member
Posts: 18842
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.5


(1)
Message 248 of 1677 (839863)
09-17-2018 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 219 by Faith
09-16-2018 4:46 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Faith writes:

Yes, faith and works go hand in hand. My "works" here I do as a Christian but Percy thinks they are bad, not good.

Everyone thinks your behavior here is bad. It isn't like it is anything subtle. You're the poster child for how your form of Christianity fosters intolerance, hate, abuse, anger, animosity, indignation, rage, intemperance, petulance, vengefulness, etc.

Phat to Percy writes:

What *would* you do if you found yourself being whisked away from your celestial home? Would it scare you? Anger you? Confuse you? One would think that the travelers would get briefed on what to expect.

As I understand it, nobody is going to be "whisked away" who isn't prepared for it, watching and waiting for it.

Why should any of that matter? The good should be whisked away to heaven, not those who believe the "right" thing. Those intent on doing good by their fellow man should be rewarded, not those who threaten eternal damnation on those who don't believe the "right" things.

The right question for Percy is what would he do if all the Christians he knows (I assume he knows some) suddenly disappeared. Would he consider what has been said about the rapture and the following tribulation and the soon return of Christ to earth, or would he prefer to find some rationalization based on his belief that those who believe as I do are the wicked ones who shouldn't be saved?

The question you (and Phat) are really asking is how would I react if presented with introvertible evidence of the truth of Christian belief. I would examine it, process it, and try to incorporate it compatibly into the fabric of evidence I already know.

Moving on to your Message 220...

ABE: By the way, of course Percy has mischaracterized my "evidence" but there are so many things I say that get mischaracterized I'm just going to let the Lord sort it all out in the end.

This is an example of something that makes you not a good person. You have accused me of mischaracterizing your evidence when all I actually did was say enough to make clear I was referring to it ("'I heard a certain Bible verse on the radio,' and similar stuff etc. etc., is not evidence the rapture is imminent.").

Instead of letting error guide you in adjusting your beliefs (the feedback loop of the scientific method), you're just doubling down on the beliefs that led you to error in the first place.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 219 by Faith, posted 09-16-2018 4:46 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 256 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 4:17 PM Percy has responded

    
ringo
Member
Posts: 17276
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


Message 249 of 1677 (839864)
09-17-2018 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 222 by Faith
09-16-2018 7:43 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Faith writes:

The closer we get to the possible fulfilment of a prophecy the more likely it is we will be getting some signs that it is near, and Jesus himself told us to be aware of those signs when he gave us the parable of the fig tree in Matthew 24.


On the contrary, it says that Jesus will come when you're NOT expecting Him:
quote:
Matthew 24:44 Therefore be ye also ready: for in such an hour as ye think not the Son of man cometh.

The point is to always be ready, to always have your doors locked because you don't know when the thief is coming.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 222 by Faith, posted 09-16-2018 7:43 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 252 by Thugpreacha, posted 09-17-2018 2:07 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply
 Message 253 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 3:47 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 18842
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 2.5


(3)
Message 250 of 1677 (839866)
09-17-2018 12:19 PM
Reply to: Message 232 by Faith
09-16-2018 10:17 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Faith writes:

What if God considers refusing to serve a gay wedding a good work?

Are not gays your fellow men? Would not assisting in a wedding that brings your fellow men great joy be a good thing.

Or fighting to end abortion?

Are not women your fellow men (or fellow women if you prefer to genderize the familiar term)? Would not assisting women in making decisions about their own bodies be a good thing? Why would you want to cause your fellow women pain and anguish and risk to their lives by taking away medically performed abortions?

Your focus is on belief and not on the happiness and wellbeing of your fellow man. You don't really care about your fellow man except to judge their belief.

--Percy


This message is a reply to:
 Message 232 by Faith, posted 09-16-2018 10:17 PM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 255 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 3:56 PM Percy has responded

    
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12787
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 251 of 1677 (839867)
09-17-2018 2:02 PM
Reply to: Message 244 by Faith
09-17-2018 7:01 AM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Faith writes:

As a matter of fact we're already under judgment, just not the full brunt of it yet. 9/11 was God's judgment, and the destructive hurricanes over the last decades should also be counted as judgment.

Woah...wait, let me get this straight...global warming is a manmade hoax yet God directly controls the increasing intensity of the hurricanes? I usually disagree with the critics and agree with some prophetic warnings, but I agree that these obscure commentators on Christian radio are most definitely not the voice of warning...I can't believe that all of the scientific, evidence-based rational minds are wrong. Besides...Gods judgments occurred in the days before Jesus once and for all sacrifice which led to Gods forgiveness. Just because Percy and jar are not huddled around the Christian radio waiting for prophetic voices from on high does not necessarily mean that they are doomed, after all. I agree that it is a combination of belief plus works that lead to salvation from human error caused by Original sin, and I also attempt to imagine a God of forgiveness rather than one who simply waits for sins to accumulate like points on a game show before hurling thunderbolts, plagues, hurricanes, and earthquakes at His hapless human guinea pigs ...Percy actually makes some good points.

And lets talk national judgment. What precisely would America have to do to avoid national judgment? They are all not going to start thinking the way that our conservative radio teachers believe....so I guess according to your belief judgment is ineveitable.


Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 244 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 7:01 AM Faith has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by Faith, posted 09-17-2018 3:53 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 12787
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 252 of 1677 (839868)
09-17-2018 2:07 PM
Reply to: Message 249 by ringo
09-17-2018 12:10 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
The point is to always be ready, to always have your doors locked because you don't know when the thief is coming.
So in other words, guard your heart and mind against snake oil salesmen but keep your heart open while you stay busy doing your best for the least of these....right?

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. –RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." –Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by ringo, posted 09-17-2018 12:10 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

  
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 253 of 1677 (839874)
09-17-2018 3:47 PM
Reply to: Message 249 by ringo
09-17-2018 12:10 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
That may be the correct interpretation, that nobody will know at the time either, but sometimes the context has the people who are not watching as the ones who are surprised by His coming, while those watching are ready for Him and able to read the signs well enough to know the time. That's what I've been going by, but you could be right and there is never any point of trying to pin down the time.

Certainly we will be able to get very close to it though.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 249 by ringo, posted 09-17-2018 12:10 PM ringo has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 254 of 1677 (839875)
09-17-2018 3:53 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by Thugpreacha
09-17-2018 2:02 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
I really can't make a lot of sense out of what you are saying.

And lets talk national judgment. What precisely would America have to do to avoid national judgment?

Repent of the sins I've listed, that's the only thing we could do. And there's not much hope, barring a great revival, that that is going to happen.

They are all not going to start thinking the way that our conservative radio teachers believe....so I guess according to your belief judgment is ineveitable.

Why are you talking about "radio preachers?" I don't listen to "radio preachers." My local station carries the sermons of preachers from churches around the nation and the world; they aren't "radio preachers." But I haven't even mentioned these as a source of anything I've said. I've known we're under judgment for decades and my source is lots and lots of preachers and the Bible itself.

Yes, judgment is inevitable since repentance is not likely. Serious prayer by enough Christians might change that I suppose.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by Thugpreacha, posted 09-17-2018 2:02 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

    
Faith
Member
Posts: 32898
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 255 of 1677 (839876)
09-17-2018 3:56 PM
Reply to: Message 250 by Percy
09-17-2018 12:19 PM


Re: The First Bus never came. Shall we still wait?
Your standards are leftist Political Correctness, not God's standards. (I know you say you are not a liberal/leftist but anyone who thinks the way you are thinking is a leftist to that extent and it's a large extent.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 250 by Percy, posted 09-17-2018 12:19 PM Percy has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 257 by Percy, posted 09-17-2018 4:47 PM Faith has responded

    
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