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Author | Topic: Christianity and the End Times | |||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Sure there are more. For example taking the money from the group to use for oils for his hair instead of giving it to the needy and using the excuse that he won't be with them long. Having to be prompted and coerced by his mother to make the beer run at the wedding party. Letting a woman wash his feet and dry them with her hair; the kind of thing you might expect from il Donald. Scaring the shit out of Peter just to make a point.
But the biggest point is that unless Jesus was totally human his message really has little meaning or application to humans.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: I can see the argument over the necessity of Jesus being only human for the story to have any meaning. To merely anthropomorphize God as a God/Man means that His sacrifice was no big deal, according to you. To portray Jesus as a fallible human, however, shows us no standard of perfection which we believe that God demands from humanity. If He couldn't do it, none of us ever will. If, however, God is grading/judging/evaluating us by weighing what we could have done versus what we actually did and do, your argument begins to become more clear. Not saying I agree with it just yet. And that is where the Mat 25 story is important. You cannot earn forgiveness through works but you can loose forgiveness by NOT doing works. I believe that after I die I will be judged and understand I have absolutely no way to know the outcome of such judgement until it happens. That means no matter what I believe, no matter what I profess, no matter what I claim, I will never know beforehand any outcome. So what can I know? I can know that what Jesus (and Buddha and Confucius and Mencius and Lao Tzu and many others) taught, that I should do what I can to help others while I'm alive, is my sole duty. That at least makes life today slightly better for all.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Its all about belief. Forget evidence. And so Coyote and Jesus and Zeus and Satan and Raven and Allah and Ra and Thor and Aphrodite and Ganesha are all equally valid beliefs.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
LOL
But Phat, the Goats were all Jesus followers while the Sheep were all strangers.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat, it was you who said it is belief that counts. And what is promised is of no value unless there is a reason to believe it might get delivered.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
I simply report what the story actually says Faith instead of parroting the Cult Dogma.
quote: Have you ever actually read the Bible Faith?
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: It is important. The original sheep were the created angels, according to dogma. One of them decided he wanted to have his run of the place with no acknowledgment of the host. He ceased following at that point and became a rogue leader. But that is from Dante's Inferno NOT the Bible.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
The Bible as usual differs as being more complex than simply taking one proof text out of context.
Throughout the rest of the Bible Satan is described as the agent og God, doing only what God decides should be done.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: Why do you dismiss the popular Christian belief, as you usually always do? We are not Jews. Remember, Jesus was a Jew not a Christian. It was Jews that wrote the books of the Old Testament and Christianity itself originated as a Jewish sect. Christianity is and always has been a revisionist religion that has changed over time. Christianity, particularly the Biblical Inerrancy cult claim that all of the Bible was directed by God. If that is the case then it is reasonable to look at what the Bible actually says and the VAST majority of what is written in both the Old and New Testaments show Satan an an agent of God doing what God directs. Even in the story of the Temptation of Jesus the Satan character acts only as an assayer, a tester. When the apologists take a single passage out of context and ignore the vast amount of contradictory evidence contained in the stories the question should be "Why don't you dismiss them?"
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: why do you consider yourself more Christian than Jewish? What an utterly stupid question Phat. I am a member of a recognized Christian Sect and not a Jew.
Phat writes: Do you see any Jewish beliefs that you have internalized? How are they similar to your Christian beliefs? Is it all one religion to you? What? Christianity, Judaism and Islam are all based on the same God character, the same set of stories, the same basic morality system. But they are distinct different religions.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: The ongoing question which we may never find an anser to is whether our ideas and beliefs about said "God character" reflect in any way the actual GOD. Does He care what we think and believe or only what we do? Does He(She,It) care about us any more than pond scum? Will we ever know? Certainly not while we are still alive.
Phat writes: Does our obsession with needing to know how GOD thinks indicative of our own need to control things more than finding our Cosmic Daddy? Only those who have such needed need to even wonder about that. Most folk don't have such a need or fill it by creating and worshiping the God they imagine.
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jar Member (Idle past 415 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: You seem to be ok with not knowing. Whether or not I am okay with not knowing really is irrelevant. Just as it's really irrelevant whether or not I am capable of jumping over the moon. The issue is no one has ever explained how it might be possible to know anything about any supernatural thing or event.
Phat writes: I agree that it is more about belief than knowledge. My belief insists upon a God Who cares. You seem to have no such need. You still have it wrong Phat. My beliefs have no control over reality. It does not matter what I need or believe, I accept the reality that I cannot know.
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