Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
4 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,817 Year: 3,074/9,624 Month: 919/1,588 Week: 102/223 Day: 13/17 Hour: 0/1


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 106 of 5796 (843023)
11-11-2018 6:09 PM
Reply to: Message 96 by Faith
11-11-2018 4:44 PM


Re: The attack on Tucker Carlson
Faith writes:
I'm sure many who hate Trump would nevertheless condemn these violent actions, but the fact is it's not much and it's usually late.
You're making things up, e.g., the condemnations from CNN and the Washington Post appeared on their websites within a day. You're complaining just to complain. You're against Antifa tactics, and we're against Antifa tactics. What's the problem?
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 96 by Faith, posted 11-11-2018 4:44 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 107 by Faith, posted 11-11-2018 6:12 PM Percy has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 107 of 5796 (843024)
11-11-2018 6:12 PM
Reply to: Message 106 by Percy
11-11-2018 6:09 PM


Re: The attack on Tucker Carlson
yeah, I'm glad, but there have been lots of acts of violence that have gone unprotested by the liberal left since Trump took office. I'm glad for any little thing but it's little and it's late. And there are loud leftist voices justifying this stuff that are just getting to carry on.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 106 by Percy, posted 11-11-2018 6:09 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 133 by Percy, posted 11-13-2018 12:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 108 of 5796 (843025)
11-11-2018 6:14 PM
Reply to: Message 97 by PaulK
11-11-2018 5:05 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
PaulK writes:
We all know that Trump is pushing nationalism, populism, xenophobia and a good dose of conspiracy theory to boot. That’s a lot more fascist than the demonstration outside Tucker Carlson’s house which seems to have been no more than a nuisance, unpleasant as it might have been.
Can't we condemn both?
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 97 by PaulK, posted 11-11-2018 5:05 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 115 by PaulK, posted 11-12-2018 12:37 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 109 of 5796 (843026)
11-11-2018 6:18 PM
Reply to: Message 89 by PaulK
11-11-2018 8:54 AM


Oh why not. Everybody is upset with Trump according to the news reports everywhere. He's always being criticized for this or that, every single day in news reports everywhere. Just about every headline I see when I get online has somebody saying something against Trump. Gosh you'd think he hadn't a single supporter the way things are portrayed. fake news is what that is.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by PaulK, posted 11-11-2018 8:54 AM PaulK has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 134 by Percy, posted 11-13-2018 2:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 110 of 5796 (843027)
11-11-2018 6:49 PM
Reply to: Message 98 by Faith
11-11-2018 5:13 PM


Re: The attack on Tucker Carlson's house
Faith writes:
Who identified the protest as a antifa, and based on what evidence?
Fox at least said the protesters were Antifa, some other source I saw identified it as an "antifascist" group protesting racism.
CNN, Trump's least favorite news outlet, immediately identified the protestors as Antifa: Police launch investigation after Antifa activists descend on Fox host Tucker Carlson's home
You're a big fan of eyewitness evidence: I was at the protest outside Tucker Carlson’s house. Here’s what actually happened.
Seems to me that the protest was a bit much, but far from the riot portray in the right wing press.
Nobody should ever get away with chanting threats outside anyone's home ever.
I agree.
This isn't just a "bit much" these people should be sitting in jail right now.
Shouldn't that depend upon whether the police had any reason to believe laws were broken?
I didn't say it was a riot, I didn't hear it was a riot, I heard it was loud chanting and loud banging on the door that scared Tucker's wife into hiding in the pantry thinking it was a home invasion. But ANY gathering outside someone's home should get the people arrested.
In order for police to conduct an arrest they must have some indication that laws were broken. Laws vary across jurisdictions, so it would depend upon whether gathering or protesting outside someone's home were illegal in Tucker Carlson's jurisdiction.
Here's the video of the protest but I can barely make out the words they are chanting. I can't find the better ones for some reason though I think they are out there somewhere.
This is true of a lot of your evidence: "I can't find it, but I think it's out there somewhere."
But I don't think where they vandalized the car and cracked the door is on any video.
There could be a couple reasons for that. One is that the video wasn't recorded at the right time. Another is that it didn't happen. But obviously at least some vandalism did occur because the Washington DC Metropolitan Police released this statement, which mentions "defacing private property":
quote:
We welcome those who come here to exercise their First Amendment rights in a safe and peaceful manner; however, we prohibit them from breaking the law. Last night, a group of protestors broke the law by defacing private property at a Northwest, DC residence. MPD takes these violations seriously, and we will work to hold those accountable for their unlawful actions. There is currently an open criminal investigation regarding this matter.
Notice that they say that it's fine for people "to exercise their First Amendment rights in a safe and peaceful manner," but not to deface private property. If the protestors had only protested then they would not have broken any laws, but evidently property defacement occurred, and so arrests could happen. I'm sure we all believe that arresting people for crimes is a good thing. But I don't think vandalizing a car and cracking a door ever happened. That CNN article I linked to above describes the police report this way, and it doesn't mention these things that you claim:
quote:
There was an anarchy symbol spray painted on the driveway. "There were also signs left on the vehicles parked in the driveway as well as a sign left on the front door of the home," according to the police report.
Some of the signs were seized as evidence. The police report describes the incident as a "suspected hate crime" and says the motivation was "anti-political."
Leaving signs on vehicles and doors isn't damaging, but depending upon what they said it could be a hate crime, which is a pretty serious offense. Spray painting the driveway *is* damaging, but I wonder if it wasn't really chalk, which is much more visible than spray paint on an asphalt driveway. Anyway, if it was spray painting then that's permanent and pretty serious, too.
Though you do go overboard on a couple things, I'm pretty much agreeing with you. Arrests should happen if there were hate crimes or property defacement. I am against Antifa tactics, I think due process and fact gathering should be performed, and I don't share your rush to judgment. And I'm guessing most other people here feel the same way.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 98 by Faith, posted 11-11-2018 5:13 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 111 of 5796 (843028)
11-11-2018 7:00 PM
Reply to: Message 90 by Percy
11-11-2018 9:33 AM


Re: Did the intern accost Acosta or did he accost her?
In eight years in office Obama never called the press the enemy of the people or fake news or any other derogatory terms, and he was never rude to reporters.
Cuz they were never rude to him, the leftist press loved him and the right are polite and abide by the rules.
If you watch the entire question period of the press conference you'll see that it was Trump who was repeatedly aggressive, hostile and rude based on whether he liked the question.
I did watch the whole thing, more than once already. Trump was aggressively defending his positions against typical PC attacks on his character. Acosta was the aggressor as were some of the others in the group who asked questions that weren't questions but just opinions disguised as questions that attacked his character. The "questions" were "aggressive, hostile and rude" insinuating and accusatory and he was responding appropriately.
He seemed to have walked into the press conference determined to pick fights, and this is backed up by the fact that he called on both Jim Acosta and Peter Alexander early on, two reporters he's clashed with in the past.
Well, perhaps he should never call on such people ever. But maybe he was trying to be fair since he gets accused so much, that would be a reasonable interpretation as opposed to yours.
...and I think it's interesting that while as far as I've seen all the liberal-leftist opinion is in defense of the brat,...
Jim Acosta and all the other reporters who were abused by Trump (such as PBS's Yamiche Alcindor, a black reporter whose question about Trump declaring himself a nationalist Trump called racist) were just doing their job. Some do it more aggressively than others.
the PBS reporter WAS accusing him of racism in questioning his use of the term "nationalism." he had explained it well enough on other occasions, yes he is a nationalist, he is for American interests above all other interests. No he is not a racist and nationalism is not about racism. He was in the right to call her out on her accusation. He needs to call out all these leftist accusations whenever he can because they are all fake news bullets intended to kill his Presidency.
Acosta has no right to tell Trump he can't call the "caravan" an "invasion" and the whole point of this impertinent accusation is to call him a racist. Just PC and more PC and it is character assassination and it's all the Left ever does. There was no substance in his question. Is his military response appropriate etc etc., no, just in typical leftist fashion it's all about words they can make to mean racism or xenophobia or some other favorite mindless empty politically motivated incendiary character assassination.
Migrants crashing over a wall illustrate what this caravan threatens to do, it's not fake, it's not a lie.
Trump speaks for a lot of us when he says the press is the enemy of the people these days. Sorry, they are. Everything that meets the public eye is leftist and it's leftist spin, I never see my opinion or that of Trump's supporters represented anywhere unless I specifically go looking for it, and there's even a lot of leftist accusation that they are going to censor what there is of it too. This makes the press, and much of the social media too, my enemy and the enemy of the American people.
Acosta said nothing that was hostile or partisan.
Unfortunately I guess you really think that is true, which only shows the depths of the incredible abyss that divides left from right these days. That statement might as well come from a martian, or someone on LSD, it's so absurd I can hardly believe anyone could see it that way. But I know you do, I know many do. It's millions of you against millions of us but it's like two entirely different ... cultures? I don't know. I didn't know it was possible for there ever to be this degree of irreconcilable disagreement on such a scale.
You're blind to the main thing that is going on these days that could become all-out fascist violence from the Left if it isn't opposed by Trump and others. And it may make no difference anyway because everything he says or does or his supporters say or do is just swallowed up by the Leftist Worldview because it's angry and aggressively self-righteous, though against perfectly innocent people.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 90 by Percy, posted 11-11-2018 9:33 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 128 by Percy, posted 11-12-2018 8:10 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 112 of 5796 (843029)
11-11-2018 7:35 PM


An Antifa Supporter speaks
Last night I decided I needed to watch some political stuff that I generally don't follow and it was interesting. I discovered Tucker Carlson for instance, saw a bunch of his interviews, can certainly see why the Left hates him because he's so aggressively critical of their stupidities. Also acquired a few new heroes of sorts. Lindsey Graham was great on the hypocrisy of the Democrats in the Kavanaugh hearings. John Sununu was funny and effective against a couple of CNN hosts who kept trying to get him to criticize Trump. And I love Diamond and Silk whenever i see them. Wish I could find some of the stuff I mentioned earlier but sorry, maybe I'm just too tech-challenged but I can't find it on this computer.
however, I found this little gem. This guy who is a supporter of Antifa and a college professor, God help us, and I mean that, if this is a college professor we really need God's help. He justifies Antifa violence on the ground that "the community has a right to defend themselves against against people who they consider to be a threat" or something like that, but the point is they justify violence against perfectly innocent people, people who are doing nothing, but probably white people because some white people used to be racists against blacks. That means any white person is fair game. That's my attempt to understand his ridiculous logic. And who is the "community?" I guess not any white people, oh maybe leftist whites of course, like himself. Although I'm not entirely sure he's even from this Planet. Anyway, I'm not up to hearing it again right now, I have to get off this public computer.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Replies to this message:
 Message 163 by PaulK, posted 11-14-2018 4:08 PM Faith has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22392
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(3)
Message 113 of 5796 (843030)
11-11-2018 8:13 PM
Reply to: Message 99 by Faith
11-11-2018 5:22 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
Faith writes:
Yeah I forgot all the Democrat racism is far enough in the past for you all to deny it.
You don't quote what you're replying to, but this seems irrelevant to anything PaulK said, plus practically the whole country was racist at one time. PaulK said you accused Democrats of efforts to prevent blacks from voting in the recent election. Is that true? If so, why would you say something as ridiculous as that?
Sorry about that. But the rest of your accusations are just the usual unsubstantiated name-calling.
Nationalism and populism are not fascism, they are as he said based on a love of America and opposed to those who would trash every good virtuous thing that built this country. No, not racism, no not fascism, no not xenophobia. What a devilish brew of lies to misrepresent a movement by good solid virtuous peaceable fair minded Americans against leftist efforts to destroy the nation.
Trump has been saying at his rallies, "I am a nationalist," a facet of fascism.
Trump's appeal is greatest to those with the least education, which is a key facet of populism (anti-intellectualism). I don't believe that's a facet of fascism, though it was employed by the two most famous fascists in history, Hitler and Mussolini.
Trump provokes irrational fear of immigration by people from south of our border (xenophobia), and hyping imaginary threats is a facet of fascism.
Trump is an autocrat with little respect for democratic institutions or the rule of law, another facet of fascism.
If the shoe fits...
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Faith, posted 11-11-2018 5:22 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 116 by PaulK, posted 11-12-2018 12:41 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(2)
Message 114 of 5796 (843032)
11-12-2018 12:33 AM
Reply to: Message 99 by Faith
11-11-2018 5:22 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
quote:
Yeah I forgot all the Democrat racism is far enough in the past for you all to deny it
If by deny it you mean deny that it is happening now you would be right but silly. If you mean deny it altogether then you are still making things up.
But the fact is that you still responded to a true accusation with a false one.
quote:
But the rest of your accusations are just the usual unsubstantiated namecalling.
Odd that you seem ignorant of such well-known facts.
quote:
Nationalism and populism are not fascism,
They are, however, features of Fascism, which was my point.
quote:
...they are as he said based on a love of America and opposed to those who would trash every good virtuous thing that built this country
In other words extreme nationalism.
quote:
No, not racism, no not fascism, no not xenophobia.
Trump is certainly willing to pander to racists, as we have seen. The xenophobia he promotes is obvious from his comments on Mexican illegal immigrants to the Muslim ban to the whole business with the refugee caravan.
quote:
What a devilish brew of lies to misrepresent a movement by good solid virtuous peaceable fairminded Americans against leftist efforts to destroy the nation.
And those are the lies you will use to persecute all who oppose your tyranny.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 99 by Faith, posted 11-11-2018 5:22 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 115 of 5796 (843033)
11-12-2018 12:37 AM
Reply to: Message 108 by Percy
11-11-2018 6:14 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
You can condemn both, but one has obvious hallmarks of facism while the other does not.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 108 by Percy, posted 11-11-2018 6:14 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 116 of 5796 (843034)
11-12-2018 12:41 AM
Reply to: Message 113 by Percy
11-11-2018 8:13 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
quote:
PaulK said you accused Democrats of efforts to prevent blacks from voting in the recent election. Is that true? If so, why would you say something as ridiculous as that?
For the reason I said. I had pointed out that Republicans were engaging in voter suppression, especially in Black areas (which is a widely-known fact). Faith insisted that the Democrats were doing it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 113 by Percy, posted 11-11-2018 8:13 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
ooh-child
Member (Idle past 344 days)
Posts: 242
Joined: 04-10-2009


Message 117 of 5796 (843053)
11-12-2018 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 70 by Faith
11-10-2018 12:47 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
From all the commentary I've been hearing it certainly is perfectly legal and constitutional.
We keep telling you the 'commentary' you rely on is lying to you. Why do you want that?
In addition, you never answered my question about Trump: what am I to believe? You seem to have a way of discerning truth from lies as he bumbles through the Presidency.
So I'll ask again, do I believe him when he said he absolutely knew Whitaker when Fox interviewed him last month, or do I believe him now that he claims not to know him at all?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Faith, posted 11-10-2018 12:47 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 121 by Faith, posted 11-12-2018 2:59 PM ooh-child has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 118 of 5796 (843056)
11-12-2018 1:59 PM
Reply to: Message 85 by Faith
11-10-2018 2:59 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
All this legal parsing is just time-consuming obstructionism. Why isn't firing just subsumed under "otherwise unable to perform the functions and duties of the office. If Obama had done exactly the same thing nobody would have been making such a fuss.
People made a fuss when Obama wore a tan suit, Faith. They made a fuss when he put mustard on his hamburger.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 85 by Faith, posted 11-10-2018 2:59 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 119 by Faith, posted 11-12-2018 2:52 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 119 of 5796 (843058)
11-12-2018 2:52 PM
Reply to: Message 118 by Dr Adequate
11-12-2018 1:59 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
People made a fuss when Obama wore a tan suit, Faith. They made a fuss when he put mustard on his hamburger.
Oh right, the occasional complaint about style is certainly on a par with a blitz of "news" reporting on nothing but criticisms and objections of all kinds, and calling the President a racist or fascist or xenophobe. Right. Thanks so much for reminding me of the parity in this case.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 118 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-12-2018 1:59 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 120 by PaulK, posted 11-12-2018 2:59 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 130 by JonF, posted 11-13-2018 7:59 AM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 120 of 5796 (843059)
11-12-2018 2:59 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by Faith
11-12-2018 2:52 PM


Re: Not Honest nor Straightforward
Indeed. The Right were desperate to find criticisms of Obama and were reduced to pettiness. Trump just serves it up on a plate.
Don’t blame us. It’s the Right who chose Trump as their candidate and elected him. It may not be fair that you’re lumbered with him, but that’s not our fault.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 119 by Faith, posted 11-12-2018 2:52 PM Faith has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024