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Author | Topic: Free will vs Omniscience | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Of course it does. If He's wrong, you shouldn't be following Him.
Him being wrong doesn't change anything. Phat writes:
Nope. I have never chosen to go to Hell and I never will. It may well be a choice of yours down the road.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
It's in the Bible. This whole attitude that humans are capable of or expected to prod God into action is just silly.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined:
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You have it backwards. God hardened Pharaoh's heart - i.e. He deliberately interfered with Pharaoh's natural conscience. You miss the whole point of course, as unbelievers must. The point is that whatever we do by our own natural inclination is the same thing as God's doing it in us. Because He is the one "in whom we live and move and have our being." We cannot contradict God and God cannot contradict us because all our power to do anything at all comes directly from Him. I know it's hard to wrap your mind around but that's why you and other unbelievers have such a terrible time understanding Calvinism. Now you are going to think of all the pedantic nitpicky ways this seems wrong to you and just get me tearing my hair out.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
If everything I do comes from God, why are you trying to argue with me? We cannot contradict God and God cannot contradict us because all our power to do anything at all comes directly from Him.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yup, here we go.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Faith writes:
So no response. Never anything from you but empty opinions and hate. Yup, here we go.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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GDR Member Posts: 6202 From: Sidney, BC, Canada Joined: Member Rating: 2.1 |
jar writes: I would put it diggerently. The words attributed to Jesus tell us how our lives should be lived which is essentially the Golden Rule. What gets us on God's wrong side is to go against that rule. I have no idea of what would make me right with God but the Bible and the words attributed to Jesus sure in hell tell us what would get us on God's wrong side. To quote you, "It really is that simple" Another thing that is really simple is that it's good to see you back here again. I hope all is well.He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God. Micah 6:8
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PaulK Member Posts: 17827 Joined: Member Rating: 2.3 |
quote: Do you have any support for that idea from the actual text of Exodus ? And isn’t it also your belief that we have a natural inclination to sin? Do you really want to say that God makes us sin ?
quote: It’s not us that has the problem.
quote: It’s not our fault that your beliefs are incoherent. If you will build a worldview out of dogma and lame excuses that problem is inevitable.
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Phat Member Posts: 18338 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Notice the date of his post, GDR. jar has not yet returned.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
You miss the whole point of course, as unbelievers must. The point is that whatever we do by our own natural inclination is the same thing as God's doing it in us. Do you have any support for that idea from the actual text of Exodus ? And isn’t it also your belief that we have a natural inclination to sin? Do you really want to say that God makes us sin ? We understand that God's causing Pharoah to commit the sin of hardening his heart against the Israelites was not His committing the sin Himself. He's the source of power for everything we do but He doesn't share in our motivations.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I do hate stupidity, yes.
And I definitely hate Antifa. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1471 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
If everything I do comes from God, why are you trying to argue with me? That comes from God too of course, the power to do it anyway. Nothing at all happens without Him.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
But He didn't give us the power to stop a mass shooting, etc. If He has the power to stop it, why doesn't He use it? One could argue that He gave us the power and expects us to develop it.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
Self-loathing is a common fundamentalist trait. I do hate stupidity, yes.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
So He's just tripping over His own feet. That comes from God too of course, the power to do it anyway. Nothing at all happens without Him.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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