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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2290
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 6.9


Message 781 of 5796 (848018)
01-30-2019 3:20 PM
Reply to: Message 778 by Faith
01-30-2019 10:53 AM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
I still think if you pay Americans enough they will do that work.
why do you hate capitalism?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 778 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 10:53 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
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ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 782 of 5796 (848019)
01-30-2019 3:29 PM
Reply to: Message 778 by Faith
01-30-2019 10:53 AM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Faith writes:
I still think if you pay Americans enough they will do that work.
I kind of agree with that.
Our politicians are always going on about creating "good" jobs. Why don't they care about making the "bad" jobs better? If the working conditions were better and the pay was better, yes your grocery bill would be higher but you'd save a lot of money on walls too.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 778 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 10:53 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 785 by Tangle, posted 01-30-2019 4:15 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 196 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 783 of 5796 (848020)
01-30-2019 4:01 PM
Reply to: Message 778 by Faith
01-30-2019 10:53 AM


Re: Trump Campaign Russian Contacts Timeline
This administration will never increase the number of legal immigrants or refugees
Quite the opposite. Lots of right-wingers agree.
.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 778 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 10:53 AM Faith has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5952
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.2


(1)
Message 784 of 5796 (848021)
01-30-2019 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 781 by DrJones*
01-30-2019 3:20 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
I already told her what the Great Prophet of Capitalism, Adam Smith, had said about that.
In much the same vein, a couple/few decades ago I sat down and crunched some numbers. I was a software engineer (retired a year ago) with a family to support and a mortgage to pay. That gave me a base-line level of expenses to try to cover each month. Now, there was a fairly common conceit that if you were out of work then you should be willing to take on any job that there is. So I took the minimum wage and figured out how many hours a week I'd have to work to be able to meet my base-line level of expenses. I found that I would have had to work more than 100 hours a week.
The scary part is that some people have to work such impossible hours just to get by. I was struck by a response to the question of whether a $15/hr minimum wage would allow them to quit their second job: "No, but I could quit my third job."

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Tangle
Member
Posts: 9512
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.8


Message 785 of 5796 (848022)
01-30-2019 4:15 PM
Reply to: Message 782 by ringo
01-30-2019 3:29 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Ringo writes:
Our politicians are always going on about creating "good" jobs. Why don't they care about making the "bad" jobs better? If the working conditions were better and the pay was better, yes your grocery bill would be higher but you'd save a lot of money on walls too.
'cos that ain't the 'merican way. That would mean government intervention in the free market.
I was in Reykjavic a while ago and tried to tip the hotel staff, they declined politely and told me that they are very well paid and don't need tips. It's a different culture. To a visitor though, it's an incredibly expensive place.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona
"Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 786 of 5796 (848023)
01-30-2019 5:25 PM
Reply to: Message 780 by dwise1
01-30-2019 2:56 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
I also know of an illegal I'd like to see somehow helped to become legal because of his hard work and usefulness to his employer. But I don't know how many situations could be described in such ways. But yes, there should be more consideration of individual cases at least. Still, stopping illegals altogether has to happen so that we have only legal entry. And requiring that they go through the citizenship process benefits US by making them aware of the history and culture of the country they are supposedly choosing to make their home. And learning English has to be a part of that process. We are no longer the melting pot we used to be and we need to get back to that. Unassimilated groups do not build the nation.
As for a wall, the border patrol like the idea of having walls in particular locations, it helps them to be able to monitor the ports of entry more efficiently. That would make the control of the flow of drugs easier among other things.
The fact that there is so much corruption involved is very distressing. The exploitation of the illegals by employers is distressing. I keep thinking of the Guinness company which is known for its extensive care of its workers. Honesty and caring for employees ought to be basic for American businesses. Yes I understand the economic problems, but there has to be a solution.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
 Message 787 by Taq, posted 01-30-2019 5:29 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 796 by AZPaul3, posted 01-30-2019 9:28 PM Faith has replied
 Message 804 by Percy, posted 01-31-2019 9:00 AM Faith has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10084
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 787 of 5796 (848024)
01-30-2019 5:29 PM
Reply to: Message 786 by Faith
01-30-2019 5:25 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Faith writes:
I also know of an illegal I'd like to see somehow helped to become legal because of his hard work and usefulness to his employer. But I don't know how many situations could be described in such ways.
Ironically, there was an illegal worker who was employed by the same company for over a decade. He even won employee of the month on a few occasions. With almost no warning, he was fired after years of faithful and hard work.
Guess who that guy worked for? The Trump Organization.
Undocumented workers reportedly fired from Trump golf club | Fox News

This message is a reply to:
 Message 786 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 5:25 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 788 of 5796 (848025)
01-30-2019 5:32 PM
Reply to: Message 784 by dwise1
01-30-2019 4:03 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
The scary part is that some people have to work such impossible hours just to get by. I was struck by a response to the question of whether a $15/hr minimum wage would allow them to quit their second job: "No, but I could quit my third job.
How do you explain this situation of people having to have more than one job in order to survive? That was not the case until fairly recently. My father supported a family of six on his own income and he didn't make a lot of money. That situation pretty much persisted through the years I was married and raising my daughter too. When did that change and why?
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 784 by dwise1, posted 01-30-2019 4:03 PM dwise1 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 789 by Theodoric, posted 01-30-2019 6:01 PM Faith has replied
 Message 794 by Phat, posted 01-30-2019 6:26 PM Faith has replied
 Message 797 by AZPaul3, posted 01-30-2019 9:47 PM Faith has replied
 Message 798 by PaulK, posted 01-31-2019 2:59 AM Faith has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9199
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 789 of 5796 (848026)
01-30-2019 6:01 PM
Reply to: Message 788 by Faith
01-30-2019 5:32 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Anyone else feel like trying to explain the reality to her? Not worth banging my head against the wall.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 788 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 5:32 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 790 by Tanypteryx, posted 01-30-2019 6:07 PM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 791 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 6:11 PM Theodoric has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4451
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


(1)
Message 790 of 5796 (848028)
01-30-2019 6:07 PM
Reply to: Message 789 by Theodoric
01-30-2019 6:01 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Anyone else feel like trying to explain the reality to her?
Come on, you know that is not possible, ever.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 791 of 5796 (848029)
01-30-2019 6:11 PM
Reply to: Message 789 by Theodoric
01-30-2019 6:01 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
Which has to mean you'd give me a tale of conservative fault and Leftist perfection that I'd reject.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 789 by Theodoric, posted 01-30-2019 6:01 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 792 by Theodoric, posted 01-30-2019 6:18 PM Faith has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9199
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


(2)
Message 792 of 5796 (848030)
01-30-2019 6:18 PM
Reply to: Message 791 by Faith
01-30-2019 6:11 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
No we would present data and facts, which you would reject without even considering. Trolls are not worth my time, you are a troll.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 791 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 6:11 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 793 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 6:25 PM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 795 by Faith, posted 01-30-2019 8:41 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 793 of 5796 (848031)
01-30-2019 6:25 PM
Reply to: Message 792 by Theodoric
01-30-2019 6:18 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
You would present SELECTED data and facts.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 792 by Theodoric, posted 01-30-2019 6:18 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Phat
Member
Posts: 18348
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 794 of 5796 (848032)
01-30-2019 6:26 PM
Reply to: Message 788 by Faith
01-30-2019 5:32 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
How do you explain this situation of people having to have more than one job in order to survive? That was not the case until fairly recently. My father supported a family of six on his own income and he didn't make a lot of money. That situation pretty much persisted through the years I was married and raising my daughter too. When did that change and why?
What type of work did he do? My Dad was a general contractor...he built houses. Usually around 2 a year or so. His income back in the early seventies was only around $14,000.00 a year, but it was enough to support me and my sister, sending her to college and me to a private school. These days, it is different, however. Unless one makes around $60,000 a year one cannot successfully support a family the way my father did. Everyone will eat and get by, but life is tough. The cost of living has increased quicker than wages.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith
You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.
In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.
~Stile

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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1473 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 795 of 5796 (848038)
01-30-2019 8:41 PM
Reply to: Message 792 by Theodoric
01-30-2019 6:18 PM


Re: Jobs Americans won't do
you are a troll
What is your definition of a troll? Not Google's definition please, yours.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 792 by Theodoric, posted 01-30-2019 6:18 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
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