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Author Topic:   Why It Is Right To Do Good To Others
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 235 of 304 (848741)
02-14-2019 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 234 by GDR
02-14-2019 2:52 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
But what makes it good?
What makes an "ultimate good" good?

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 234 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 2:52 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 236 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:27 PM ringo has replied
 Message 238 by Theodoric, posted 02-14-2019 3:33 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 237 of 304 (848745)
02-14-2019 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 236 by GDR
02-14-2019 3:27 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
As a Christian theist it is my "belief", that it represents a fundamental nature of God and His desires for it to be a fundamental part of our nature.
That's circular. Good is good because it's what God wants - and God must be good because what He wants is good.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 236 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:27 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 241 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:43 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 244 of 304 (848753)
02-14-2019 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 241 by GDR
02-14-2019 3:43 PM


Re: Goodness
Phat writes:
It is also circular for Stile to say that something is good because what Stile wants is good..
But good isn't just what Stile wants. In a social species, good is a matter of consensus. And consensus involves compromize - i.e. good is inherently relative.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:43 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 246 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:57 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 250 of 304 (848759)
02-14-2019 4:09 PM
Reply to: Message 246 by GDR
02-14-2019 3:57 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
In the last several years there have been numerous societies where there was a consensus that it would be good to commit genocide, which would involve compromise and would be inherently relative.
You're talking about subsets of society. It was society as a whole that sanctioned Hitler and his subset.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by GDR, posted 02-14-2019 3:57 PM GDR has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 281 of 304 (848817)
02-15-2019 8:31 PM
Reply to: Message 279 by GDR
02-15-2019 7:05 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
Why do we not live by the the law of the survival of the fittest?
You're misunderstanding survival of the fittest. The "fittest" isn't the strongest or the meanest individual. Being good is part of what makes us fit for survival as a species.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by GDR, posted 02-15-2019 7:05 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 284 by GDR, posted 02-15-2019 9:28 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 285 of 304 (848822)
02-15-2019 9:33 PM
Reply to: Message 284 by GDR
02-15-2019 9:28 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
I guess what I'm asking is how broad is your idea of what constitutes our species?
You're treading on dangerous ground there, Mr. Grand Dragon. "Our species" includes all of us. Diversity is strength.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 284 by GDR, posted 02-15-2019 9:28 PM GDR has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 286 by GDR, posted 02-15-2019 9:46 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 288 of 304 (848834)
02-16-2019 10:46 AM
Reply to: Message 286 by GDR
02-15-2019 9:46 PM


Re: Goodness
GDR writes:
However, from a mindless evolutionary POV I'm not so sure.
Somebody else mentioned serotonin, a mindless chemical that effects our feelings. If there was a Grand Intelligence somewhere in the universe, no doubt its mind would be the product of mindless chemicals too.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 286 by GDR, posted 02-15-2019 9:46 PM GDR has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 290 by Phat, posted 02-16-2019 11:15 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 291 of 304 (848839)
02-16-2019 11:19 AM
Reply to: Message 290 by Phat
02-16-2019 11:15 AM


Re: Goodness
Phat writes:
Your lack of imagination is noted.
Thanks for noticing. Imagination is fine when you're writing children's books. It has no place in a discussion of facts.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 290 by Phat, posted 02-16-2019 11:15 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 292 by Phat, posted 02-16-2019 11:32 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 293 of 304 (848843)
02-16-2019 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 292 by Phat
02-16-2019 11:32 AM


Re: Goodness
Phat writes:
...unless you mean simply an intelligence more evolved than other carbon-based life forms. If you mean an intelligence capable of creating all things seen and unseen...
A "more-evolved" intelligence is plausible. An intelligence capable of creating all things seen and unseen is pure imagination, the stuff of children's stories.
Phat writes:
... chemicals are hardly the default assumption.
Sure they are. The default would naturally be something that actually exists, like chemicals.
Phat writes:
No wonder you limit yourself.
I limit myself to facts, yes. Sue me.
Phat writes:
You Grovel at the Altar Of Evidence.
And you mock evidence. Why do you pretend to accept science at all?
Phat writes:
And you seem to view Belief almost as the Anti-Evidence.
It's worse than that.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 292 by Phat, posted 02-16-2019 11:32 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 297 by Phat, posted 02-19-2019 2:51 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 302 of 304 (848996)
02-20-2019 2:13 PM
Reply to: Message 297 by Phat
02-19-2019 2:51 PM


Re: Goodness
Phat writes:
If society simply waits for *evidence* of God, we will likely stand at the altar forever.
If society simply waits for *evidence* of leprechauns, we will likely stand at the altar forever.
What's the problem with that?
The idea that God hides because He wants us to have faith is just pathetic. Leprechauns also hide because they want us to have faith

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Phat, posted 02-19-2019 2:51 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 303 by Theodoric, posted 02-20-2019 3:07 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 304 of 304 (849004)
02-20-2019 3:15 PM
Reply to: Message 303 by Theodoric
02-20-2019 3:07 PM


Re: Goodness
Theodoric writes:
He presented me with his "evidence" for ghosts; EVPs, orbs in photos and videos and I asked him how he as sure they weren't leprechauns.
An example that I have used before: A dead body with a hole in it is evidence that the body is dead and has a hole in it. It is not evidence that the hole killed him. Similarly, "strange voices" are evidence of strange voices. They are not evidence of demons.

And our geese will blot out the sun.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 303 by Theodoric, posted 02-20-2019 3:07 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
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