Chance as a sole-product of the Universe

Phat writes:My point is that I believe that the universe cannot be said to have occurred by chance. The universe was in fact created by necessary certainty. That it is means that we are. I struggle for the words I want to say. It may well be that one could assert that a Designer/Creator is unnecessary, but I would say that if the universe exists by necessity and if we exist and can intellectualize this stuff, than Certainty is involved rather than chance.

My point is that I believe that the universe cannot be said to have occurred by chance.

The universe was in fact created by necessary certainty.

My point is that I believe that the universe cannot be said to have occurred by chance.

tanle writes:...nobody understands and it can't be resolved just by thinking and talking bollox - people far cleverer than you and me have failed to get anywhere with these sorts of arguments for thousands of years. The only progress we've made towards answers have come from mathematics and physics and those are beyond our comprehension.

ringo writes:God is an anachronism. He has been ever since we started looking for the real answers to our questions. It has nothing to do with chance. Even if God does exist, He isn't the answer to anything.

But if chaos is our friend, then why does it have such a shabby reputation? All of us have said, during a tumultuous time, that, “my life is in chaos right now.” If a room is messy and not functional, we say sheepishly to a friend who sees it, “Sorry, my room is in chaos right now.” If people are rioting in the streets, and violence is breaking out, and fires are being set, and cars are being flipped, and utter bedlam has broken out in every conceivable way, we are apt to describe this situation with the word “chaos.” And in none of these examples are we misusing the world. All of these situations are, in fact, chaos. And it’s this chaos that Jordan Peterson likely sees his book as being the antidote to.Peterson has developed a catchphrase of sorts, that has resonated and caught on with many of the disenfranchised people who have come to him. “Clean your room, Bucko.” It’s such a simple phrase. The same kids who likely ignored it when it came from their parents are now championing it as great philosophical wisdom now that it comes to them from Peterson. (...)It sounds so reasonable, doesn’t it? Too bad it’s completely wrong. The people throughout history who have made an impact, who have changed the world, for better or do worse, have never done so by cleaning their room, but by messing it up. Remember that angry mob I mentioned in my example of harmful chaos”the throngs of people turning over cars, breaking windows, setting fires, and throwing a massive tantrum? Let me ask you this: what are they saying? Are they saying, “We are through with order and we now want nothing but chaos?” No. They are saying, “We are tired of the order that exists now, and we demand a new order. We demand an order more in line with what we want the world to be.”

Phat writes:Read my link in the last post and tell me what comes to mind comparing that philosophy to classic scripture.

Phat writes:My argument is essentially that scripture provides rational "old order" answers that chaos theory and human reasoning have been trying to overthrow ever since the snake whispered in Eves' ear.

ringo writes:...So, instead of hoping that I'll see what you see, why don't you tell us how it contrasts with classic scripture.

Phat writes:My point is that I see it as a spiritual war of ideas. Perhaps I am overthinking it in regards to science and physics...but look what this author suggests. He is basically describing chaos as a belief.

Phat writes:My point is that I believe that the universe cannot be said to have occurred by chance. The universe was in fact created by necessary certainty. That it is means that we are. I struggle for the words I want to say. It may well be that one could assert that a Designer/Creator is unnecessary, but I would say that if the universe exists by necessity and if we exist and can intellectualize this stuff, than Certainty is involved rather than chance.

tangle writes:All you're doing Phat, is telling us what you want to believe. It's not based on anything.

Phat writes:Sometimes philosophy cannot be explained through objective proof or maths. Does that make such ponderings useless?

Phat writes:I was hoping that your encyclopedic knowledge of scripture would provide you an opportunity to refute your original proclamation that God was an anachronism.