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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 735 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


(1)
Message 1261 of 5796 (850898)
04-16-2019 3:37 PM
Reply to: Message 1260 by Taq
04-16-2019 3:32 PM


I once spent a summer assisting in the killing of 8000 chickens every day, five days a week. I didn’t eat chicken for a couple of years after that.
Edited by Coragyps, : Clarity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1260 by Taq, posted 04-16-2019 3:32 PM Taq has not replied

Replies to this message:
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dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 1262 of 5796 (850901)
04-16-2019 4:19 PM
Reply to: Message 1256 by Faith
04-16-2019 1:53 PM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
None of that attitude is in the film. But perhaps you don't really want to know what is in the film
Completely irrelevant, since I said absolutely nothing whatsoever about your propaganda film.
Duly noted that you completely avoided the issues and questions that I did raise, which was the rash of severely draconian anti-abortion laws being written in state legislatures and just exactly what the Bible actually does say about abortion.
If you don't know what the Bible actually says, then do not try to deflect and distract from that question -- Trump's gross dishonesty corrupts everybody working for him and obviously his followers too. Either admit you don't know, or make an honest attempt, so simply say nothing.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1256 by Faith, posted 04-16-2019 1:53 PM Faith has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 1263 of 5796 (850902)
04-16-2019 6:19 PM
Reply to: Message 1243 by Faith
04-15-2019 1:30 PM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
Most Christian movies are low budget and not very well made ...
It's not fair to blame low budgets for how bad Christian movies are. They could still do a decent job on a low budget if they had any clue how to make a movie, or had attended even just one class on cinematography, or had watched documentaries on film-making (eg, The Story of Film: An Odyssey, which did an excellent job of explaining the kinds of shots and angles and editing with countless examples).
There are several videos on YouTube (eg, this search results page, https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=why+christia...) which discuss the problem. This is the one I had watched several months ago: Why Christian Movies are BAD | The Problem with Christian Media - Part 2. Watch the entire video (15 minutes), but at around 3 minutes he admits that he used to blame the movies' low budgets, but then he saw that "God's Country" had a budget of a million dollars, so lack of funding was not the problem: "Money isn't the problem; it's execution." At about 4 minutes, he discusses the editing of a dialogue between two characters. First he shows it being done properly with the editing cutting between different camera angles which in itself helps to tell the story such that you can get the gist of the scene with the sound turned off. Then he shows a Christian movie dialogue which is boring:
quote:
Shot, reverse shot, shot, reverse shot. This isn't the result of a low budget. This is the result of laziness. Good editing can be achieved by a 13-year-old with a phone and iMovie. It doesn't take any money to edit like that. What it does take is creativity and a love for the art form.
...
The problem is not money; they have plenty of it. The problem with Christian movies is that they seem to be made by preachers, not filmmakers.
Add to that the ham-fisted writing and the use of false stereotypes and unrealistic events intended to feed the modern myth of Christians being persecuted (when most of the time they are the persecutors). As the narrator of this video points out, these Christians movies are actually sermons which preach culture war. He was a Christian raised on these movies. He saw "God is Not Dead" and was fired up to go forth and do battle against those evil atheists, only to learn the hard way that that propaganda film had lied to him.
I remember when Phat posted a message about having just watched "God is Not Dead" and how it had excited him and fired him up. The big scene is when the student debates his atheist philosophy prof and proves that God exists. I asked Phat to tell us what the kid's argument was, he wouldn't tell us. It turns out that the "winning argument" was a big ball of nothing, just him saying that he believes in God so that proves it. Similarly, I watched a Christian movie on creationism with the same kind of lame writing. It culminated in a creation/evolution debate unlike any I've ever seen before or since: the creationist made a short statement of faith which had nothing whatsoever to do with creationism and the pro-evolution biology professor magically could give no response (that's the advantage of being able to write the script yourself).
Part of the lack of realism is how the two movies depict college classes. In "God is Not Dead", the philosophy class consisted of every student having to accept the professor's religious beliefs, whereas an actual philosophy prof would teach his students how to think -- clearly at work was the typical "true Christian" misunderstanding of education (ie, learn about the subject matter) as being the same as their own practice of indoctrination (ie, tell the students what to believe and compel them to believe it). In the creationism movie, the biology class consisted solely of the prof asking which came first, the chicken or the egg (seriously! That was the entire content of the course!). Clearly, those writers had never attended any college classes.
As for effect that these Christian propaganda films have, you should read the comments for the YouTube video. Here's one:
quote:
God's Not Dead is actually a really big reason why I no longer identify as a Christian. I still have faith, and it's a bit complex, but I am not a Christian and want nothing to do with mainstream Christianity. I understand that this movie and others like it do not represent all of Christianity, but they have become so big that the majority of Christians in America actually have conformed to that void of critical thinking whether they like it or not. I watched (or was forced to watch with my family) GND after I had been outside of the perfect Christian bubble for a few years. So it was not the wonderful, self-affirming feel-good movie that the rest of my family saw through their eyes of "Christian persecution in America is real." Instead, it was very clearly propaganda, as I now had Athiest friends and loved ones, and I had seen first hand the many persecutions inflicted on non-Christians and LGBT people by the Christian church itself.
In short, to a Christian in a non-diverse bubble, these movies are just a warm and fuzzy chocked full of confirmation bias. For an Athiest, these movies are pure comedy as surely nobody could actually believe stuff like that, right? But as a Christian on the fence, who has learned that non-believers are not the evil baby-eaters I was raised to believe and who has seen loudmouth Christians do everything in their power to destroy the rights, voices, and livelihoods of people who aren't like them, these movies are just another nail in the coffin of our once-perfect childhood religion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1243 by Faith, posted 04-15-2019 1:30 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Percy
Member
Posts: 22394
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(1)
Message 1264 of 5796 (850907)
04-17-2019 8:28 AM
Reply to: Message 1263 by dwise1
04-16-2019 6:19 PM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
I know nothing about Christian movies and so won't comment on their production skills or lack thereof, but most movies and TV shows today are pretty bad even though the production quality is often excellent. Often it's the plot, where you have to invent your own rationalizations in order to make what just happened make sense.
My biggest criticism is about action movies. We don't usually watch action movies, but during a holiday visit the kids had us watch the series of Thor movies, one per night. They seemed typical of the modern action movie. There is a great deal of gratuitous action which makes no sense (and often isn't physically possible) and isn't necessary to or doesn't even fit the storyline. Tiny but important details are shown for only a second, and you're supposed to remember them because they'll explain what comes later. Often events occur so fast and furiously that even if they do make sense it's impossible to figure it all out or commit it to memory in the moment. All that being said, I greatly enjoyed the Thor movies, but we did have to pause regularly so the kids could explain things.
For action movies give me True Lies or Top Gun. For drama give me Casablanca. For comedies give me Manhattan, Groundhog Day or Home Alone. For quirky give me Clerks. For science fiction give me Oblivion or Jurassic Park II or Total Recall (the 1990 one with Schwarzenegger). For animated films give me Wall-E or Up. For fantasy just leave me home - definitely not a Harry Potter or hobbit fan.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1263 by dwise1, posted 04-16-2019 6:19 PM dwise1 has not replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1265 of 5796 (850908)
04-17-2019 9:43 AM
Reply to: Message 1258 by ooh-child
04-16-2019 2:33 PM


A living baby isn't aborted, it's born.
And so would any sane person think, and be unable to consider killing it or just letting it die. But sorry to say that is not the case in many situations where the infant survives an intended abortion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1258 by ooh-child, posted 04-16-2019 2:33 PM ooh-child has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1278 by JonF, posted 04-17-2019 10:18 AM Faith has replied
 Message 1282 by ooh-child, posted 04-17-2019 10:53 AM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1266 of 5796 (850909)
04-17-2019 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 1257 by ooh-child
04-16-2019 2:30 PM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
None of that attitude is in the film.
If you haven't seen it, how do you know?
From seeing so many interviews and documentaries on the making of it. Apparently they made an effort to include a couple of scenes of what they consider to be the extremes on both sides, but otherwise the film aims for an upbeat positive note offering help for women considering an abortion and no attitude of condemnation at all. Of course not having seen it I don't know how well they succeeded but I'd guess pretty well.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1267 of 5796 (850910)
04-17-2019 9:55 AM
Reply to: Message 1259 by RAZD
04-16-2019 2:46 PM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success ... or is it?
The clip you linked is just actors glad talking their work. Whoopie.
Well, yes, and that is rather big news in the Christian film arena. Even to have a premiere with the actors on the red carpet is as far as I know completely unprecedented. And nobody is saying it competes with Hollywood movies but six million the first weekend isn't shabby. And they ARE all talking it up but they sound very sincere to me, rather amazed at the turnout but feeling it was very well done and deserves it.

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 Message 1270 by Theodoric, posted 04-17-2019 10:01 AM Faith has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 1268 of 5796 (850911)
04-17-2019 10:00 AM
Reply to: Message 1264 by Percy
04-17-2019 8:28 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
I rarely see movies anymore. I just cannot stand the idiocy. I have a 9 year old and 12 year old so I do see kids movies. Kids movies seem to be where the quality is. Coco and Ferdinand were excellent. I also thought Zootopia, Sing and The Secret Life of Pets were excellent.
The movies I despise the most are "historical" ones. Usually they take a bare snippet of a historical event or person and then present something that is not historical at all. For example, Hidalgo. None of the movie happened in real life, though it was marketed as historical and biographical. They took the tall tales of an admitted liar and even further embellished them. It is almost bibilical because the tall tales and myths were presented as factual.
Here is a site that goes through some of the worst "historical" movies. Braveheart and The Patriot are two that drive me the craziest. Partly because Mel Gibson is a vile human being, but mostly because they take very interesting and compelling stories and completely destroy them while claiming they are historic.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1264 by Percy, posted 04-17-2019 8:28 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1273 by Faith, posted 04-17-2019 10:09 AM Theodoric has replied
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1269 of 5796 (850912)
04-17-2019 10:01 AM
Reply to: Message 1260 by Taq
04-16-2019 3:32 PM


I wonder how many people could kill a cow, and how many of those people would still eat a hamburger without feeling guilty.
Fortunately I know that if you actually witnessed both the killing of a baby and the killing of a cow, although you might not be able to eat hamburger for a few years the killing of a human baby would leave the greater impression on you.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1260 by Taq, posted 04-16-2019 3:32 PM Taq has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


(2)
Message 1270 of 5796 (850913)
04-17-2019 10:01 AM
Reply to: Message 1267 by Faith
04-17-2019 9:55 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success ... or is it?
Anyone can roll out a red carpet. As a matter of fact even the crappiest movies in the world had a red carpet premiere. Means nothing, just that someone is paying money for promotions

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1267 by Faith, posted 04-17-2019 9:55 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1272 by Faith, posted 04-17-2019 10:05 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1271 of 5796 (850914)
04-17-2019 10:03 AM
Reply to: Message 1261 by Coragyps
04-16-2019 3:37 PM


I read a comic book when I was a child in which the only food the characters had was bananas and it took years before I could overcome my loathing for bananas. However, except in truly dire circumstances I don't think you'd be considering eating a baby.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1272 of 5796 (850915)
04-17-2019 10:05 AM
Reply to: Message 1270 by Theodoric
04-17-2019 10:01 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success ... or is it?
Christian films don't usually have the money for any kind of promotion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1270 by Theodoric, posted 04-17-2019 10:01 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1273 of 5796 (850916)
04-17-2019 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 1268 by Theodoric
04-17-2019 10:00 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success
"Unplanned" is based on the book by Abby Johnson, about her experience at Planned Parenthood and what prompted her to leave. That doesn't guarantee quality of course but she thought it did a good job of sticking to the book.
Most of the posts here are nothing but excuses not to see it and most of them are somebody's imagination about what it must be like without any resemblance to the reports on it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1268 by Theodoric, posted 04-17-2019 10:00 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1276 by Theodoric, posted 04-17-2019 10:15 AM Faith has replied
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 1274 of 5796 (850917)
04-17-2019 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 1272 by Faith
04-17-2019 10:05 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success ... or is it?
Because very people will pay to see them. They can be preached to for free, so why pay to have an ignorant, grifter spew hate?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1272 by Faith, posted 04-17-2019 10:05 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1275 by Faith, posted 04-17-2019 10:13 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1445 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 1275 of 5796 (850918)
04-17-2019 10:13 AM
Reply to: Message 1274 by Theodoric
04-17-2019 10:09 AM


Re: Pro Life Movie a big success ... or is it?
Funny how you all prefer made-up propaganda to seeing the film.
As for paying to see a Christian film I don't think that brings in much money either, especially since eventually your church will give you a free showing anyway.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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