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Author Topic:   Ted Bundy the serial killer of the 70s
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 11 of 63 (852816)
05-17-2019 12:04 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Faith
05-17-2019 12:04 AM


Faith writes:
Bundy had the ability to come across as completely normal, was somebody people *****, seemed to be a kind and thoughtful and empathetic person. He had all kinds of psychological tests in prison and they found nothing frankly pathological although they did come up with some interesting characteristics we can discuss.
You may want to check out another Netflix series called "Mindhunter". It is based on real FBI agents who were the first to tackle the phenomena of serial killers. They start out by interviewing many different serial killers and they find some interesting commonalities. The series probably isn't completely accurate, but it's a good watch.
What I think you will find is that these types of killers are pathological, but they are able to hide it. That's what makes them so creepy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Faith, posted 05-17-2019 12:04 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by Faith, posted 05-17-2019 4:30 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 20 of 63 (852833)
05-17-2019 5:15 PM
Reply to: Message 18 by Faith
05-17-2019 4:30 PM


Re: Mindhunter
Faith writes:
I put Mindhunter on my Netflix list. It's fiction, though, right? I'll watch some of it anyway.
It's "based on a true story".
quote:
Mindhunter is an American crime drama web television series created by Joe Penhall, based on the true crime book Mindhunter: Inside the FBI's Elite Serial Crime Unit written by John E. Douglas and Mark Olshaker.[2]
Mindhunter - Wikipedia(TV_series)

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 Message 18 by Faith, posted 05-17-2019 4:30 PM Faith has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 30 of 63 (852908)
05-20-2019 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 27 by Faith
05-19-2019 2:47 PM


Re: Some general points
Faith writes:
So maybe it seems to make more sense just to dismiss the dogs' behavior as nothing unusual. I guess that has to be accepted as a reasonable conclusion.
Dogs bark at strangers all of the time. I would also assume that there are many serial killers who had dogs of their own who loved them and were loved back.
My own take remains the same of course. I think the dogs' behavior was described as definitely unusual for them in the contexts given so I'm looking for something to explain it in terms of what they might have sensed in Bundy, and the only thing that makes sense to me is that he probably had a demon,
I think it is much more likely that people read more into dramatic events than in their everyday lives. Bundy may have passed 50 dogs, but if someone remembers just 1 dog barking at Bundy they will remember that more and exaggerate it in their mind because it is linked to Bundy. Humans are actually poor witnesses because our emotions at the time of an event can drastically color our memories.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Faith, posted 05-19-2019 2:47 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 31 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 2:01 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 33 of 63 (852926)
05-20-2019 4:21 PM
Reply to: Message 31 by Faith
05-20-2019 2:01 PM


Re: Some general points
Faith writes:
The three dogs in question were said to be acting in an unusual way toward Bundy, that they were not the sort of dogs that snarled -- not just barked, snarled and growled -- at strangers, and the event in each case was noted as unusual AT THE TIME, not just in retrospect.
The drama of that event may have colored how the witnesses viewed that event. Happens all of the time. I have had dogs that love women but hate men, and sometimes they barked at different people for no apparent reason. Dogs barking at people is hardly extraordinary, and it certainly isn't much of a platform to leap to the conclusion of demons.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 31 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 2:01 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 35 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 4:31 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 36 of 63 (852935)
05-20-2019 5:48 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by Faith
05-20-2019 4:31 PM


Re: Some general points
Faith writes:
Again you generalize without taking into account anything I've said,
I took it all into account. Anecdotal accounts are not very reliable in these types of situations.
If you are interested, John Wayne Gasey had dogs that he was very close to. There is also the sad story of the dog named Bleep:
quote:
"Bleep" was the faithful, loyal and loving Border Collie cross of London's most notorious serial killer Dennis Nilsen. She was bought as a puppy in a local pet shop on Kilburn High Road by David "Twinkle" Gallachan, who was Nilsen's lover, who he'd met barely a few weeks earlier at The Champion in Bayswater and named "Bleep" as her muted barks as a puppy sounded more like a high-pitched squeak. So was "Bleep" the last victim of serial killer Dennis Nilsen? Yes. Did Nilsen kill "Bleep"? No. Of course he didn't. Nilsen absolutely adored "Bleep" (see them playing in the animation above); he fed her, brushed her, bathed her and the two would take lovely long walks together on Hampstead Heath. Bleep was his best-friend, his closest companion, and - in Nilsen's eyes - the only one who ever truly loved him.
But in 1978, after a few volatile months together, "Twinkle" walked out, causing Nilsen to spiral out of control, and with his rage uncontrollable and fuelled by anger, he killed fifteen young men in just five years. "I wanted to stop sooner", Nilsen said after his arrest, but after he'd murdered his second victim - Kenneth Ockenden - he knew he'd be locked up for life and his main concern was "if I'm put away, what would happen to Bleep?". Unfortunately, Nilsen's concerns were proved right as just three days after he was imprisoned, "Bleep" was put to death by lethal injection. Her only crime? Being a faithful, loyal and loving dog... of a serial killer. ”
Serial Killers / Murderers Who Loved Their Pets (Dogs & Cats)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 4:31 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 8:33 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 38 of 63 (852954)
05-21-2019 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 37 by Faith
05-20-2019 8:33 PM


Re: Some general points
Faith writes:
But three grown dogs defending their owners or just meeting him for the first time didn't take kindly to him. Their hostility was striking to those who witnessed the encounter, two of whom knew their dogs well, one of whom was not treated with hostility by the same dog that snarled at Bundy.
That happens all of the time with all dogs and all people.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 37 by Faith, posted 05-20-2019 8:33 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 39 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 11:09 AM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 40 of 63 (852992)
05-21-2019 1:17 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Faith
05-21-2019 11:09 AM


Re: Some general points
Faith writes:
Funny, then, that the people who witnessed these incidents and probably knew dogs as well as you know dogs, especially their own, didn't dismiss them as what happens all the time with all dogs and all people, but regarded them as distinctly unusual.
They did so after the fact. Again, memories are colored by the present. You can say that they "noticed it at the time" but those claims are well after the event. The Mandela effect is pretty weird.

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 Message 39 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 11:09 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 41 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 1:25 PM Taq has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


(1)
Message 45 of 63 (853014)
05-21-2019 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 44 by Faith
05-21-2019 1:50 PM


Re: The question about the dogs
Faith writes:
Maybe you'll read further and discover I covered it pretty well. If not maybe I'll get back to it later.
Maybe you use some simple logic. "I noted it at the time" said months or years after the events is not "noting it at the time". Unless you have diary entries, police statements, or news reports from that very day it is a memory.
Edited by Taq, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 44 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 1:50 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 46 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 3:29 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 47 of 63 (853016)
05-21-2019 3:40 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by Faith
05-21-2019 3:29 PM


Re: The question about the dogs
Faith writes:
"Noted it at the time" means it struck them as unusual at the time and later they remember being struck at the time with its unusualness.
They remember being struck at the time, but that doesn't mean they actually were. Memories are a funny thing.
I can think of some events in my past, even back in my childhood, that I "noted at the time" for being a special kind of event, maybe a traumatic event. It's a common experience.
Have you heard of the Mandela effect?
quote:
False memories can sometimes be shared by multiple people.[32][33] In 2010, this was dubbed the "Mandela Effect" by self-described "paranormal consultant" Fiona Broome, in reference to a false memory she reported of the death of South African leader Nelson Mandela in the 1980s (who was at the time still alive), which she claimed was shared by "perhaps thousands" of other people.
Many people swear they remember Mandela dying in the 1980's, even remembering the funeral. People have false memories. It happens.
Edited by Taq, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 46 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 3:29 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 48 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 4:02 PM Taq has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


(2)
Message 49 of 63 (853021)
05-21-2019 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 48 by Faith
05-21-2019 4:02 PM


Re: The question about the dogs
Faith writes:
The interesting thing is that *they* have false memories, but you never do.
I have had many false memories. That's why I look for objective evidence instead of relying on memory.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 48 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 4:02 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 50 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 8:30 PM Taq has replied
 Message 51 by Pressie, posted 05-22-2019 6:12 AM Taq has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 52 of 63 (853093)
05-22-2019 11:09 AM
Reply to: Message 50 by Faith
05-21-2019 8:30 PM


Re: The question about the dogs
Faith writes:
But remember there were THREE separate people who had THREE separate impressions of dogs behaving in an UNUSUALLY hostile way toward Ted Bundy when they didn't treat others that way. As I said, I'm still accepting these accounts as likely true.
Thousands,perhaps millions, of people thought Mandela died in the 1980's, even remembering his funeral. It wasn't true.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 50 by Faith, posted 05-21-2019 8:30 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 53 by Faith, posted 05-22-2019 11:11 AM Taq has not replied

  
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