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Author Topic:   Dogs Evolved Special Cuteness Muscle
Dr Adequate
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Joined: 07-20-2006
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Message 1 of 12 (855241)
06-17-2019 7:51 PM



Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Faith, posted 06-18-2019 7:02 AM Dr Adequate has responded

  
Faith
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From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
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Message 2 of 12 (855266)
06-18-2019 7:02 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dr Adequate
06-17-2019 7:51 PM


More likely it was just a trait in some dogs and those dogs got selected, which is the way most breeds got developed in the past. It might have been very slight at first, but would have strengthened over generations as that trait was repeatedly selected, as Darwin's chesty pigeons got chestier over generations. If you want to call that evolution, OK, but it's not the same thing as saying the dogs developed the trait in response to human attraction to it.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-17-2019 7:51 PM Dr Adequate has responded

Replies to this message:
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 Message 4 by Dr Adequate, posted 06-18-2019 8:04 PM Faith has responded

  
RAZD
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From: the other end of the sidewalk
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Member Rating: 4.0


(1)
Message 3 of 12 (855269)
06-18-2019 7:48 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Faith
06-18-2019 7:02 AM


... OK, but it's not the same thing as saying the dogs developed the trait in response to human attraction to it.

Except that you did just say that.

Enjoy


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This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Faith, posted 06-18-2019 7:02 AM Faith has responded

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Dr Adequate
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Posts: 16107
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 4 of 12 (855362)
06-18-2019 8:04 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Faith
06-18-2019 7:02 AM


Well, it isn't present in wolves.

You don't need to explain to me how variation and selection works. I know.


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Faith
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Posts: 33672
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 5 of 12 (855368)
06-18-2019 8:43 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by RAZD
06-18-2019 7:48 AM


The context was the dogs doing it on purpose to "bamboozle" people who get the "Aw" thing going when they see it. Of course they developed it genetically. in response to human selection of that trait..

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Faith
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Posts: 33672
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001
Member Rating: 1.2


Message 6 of 12 (855369)
06-18-2019 8:45 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Dr Adequate
06-18-2019 8:04 PM


So which is it, the dogs are cleverly manipulating us or it's just a genetic variation?

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


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 Message 8 by Tangle, posted 06-19-2019 3:14 AM Faith has not yet responded

  
Coragyps
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Posts: 5407
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


(1)
Message 7 of 12 (855375)
06-18-2019 9:52 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Faith
06-18-2019 8:45 PM


Both.

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Tangle
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From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 4.0


(1)
Message 8 of 12 (855384)
06-19-2019 3:14 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Faith
06-18-2019 8:45 PM


Faith writes:

So which is it, the dogs are cleverly manipulating us or it's just a genetic variation?

randomly occurring mutation + plus selection = genetic change

You need both. It ain't hard to understand.


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Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
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AZPaul3
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Posts: 4731
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


Message 9 of 12 (855388)
06-19-2019 6:10 AM


Manipulation? Dog doesn't know nor care what it looks like. Can't even recognize itself in a mirror.

This is the dog's "I love you" look. If you don't get that look from your dog then it's not your dog. No manipulation. Just expression.

As for the genetics, turns out if you say "I love you" to a human often enough they'll return the feeling and feed you and breed you.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by caffeine, posted 06-19-2019 9:36 AM AZPaul3 has responded

  
caffeine
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Posts: 1713
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 10 of 12 (855399)
06-19-2019 9:36 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by AZPaul3
06-19-2019 6:10 AM


This is the dog's "I love you" look. If you don't get that look from your dog then it's not your dog. No manipulation. Just expression.

It's not an "I love you" look. Our dog does it to anyone with food.


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ringo
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From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 11 of 12 (855409)
06-19-2019 11:54 AM


I saw a documentary once about people's relationship with dogs. Apparently there's a village in Africa where the people don't even like dogs; they don't feed them, they don't talk to them, they don't give them names, etc. But the dogs still come into the village, clean up scraps, bark when lions threaten the cattle, etc. They do what dogs do without any regard to how they are treated by humans.

All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis
That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 4731
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.2


(1)
Message 12 of 12 (855491)
06-20-2019 4:13 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by caffeine
06-19-2019 9:36 AM


It's not an "I love you" look. Our dog does it to anyone with food.

Of course. Your dog loves food.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by caffeine, posted 06-19-2019 9:36 AM caffeine has not yet responded

  
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