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Author | Topic: The Trump Presidency | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
Percy writes: What Mueller doesn't seem to grasp is the ease with which his report is being successfully misrepresented to large segments of the American public. Many actually believe that the Mueller report absolved Trump of both conspiracy and obstruction charges. No amount of evidence will convince Trump supporters of reality. It is harder to fall out of bed than it is to convince Trump supporters that Trump was exonerated.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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xongsmith writes: Taq - I think you need an edit... It may be poorly worded, but still correct. Falling out of bed is the harder task out of the two. If I said that convincing a Trump supporter that Trump was exonerated was easier than falling out of bed it might be easier to understand.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
Percy writes: Mueller and Barr had differing interpretations of the OLC (DOJ's Office of Legal Counsel) opinion about whether a sitting president could be indicted. Mueller isn't a politician, and he wanted to play the role of neutral investigator, which he did quite well. We can argue about the OLC opinion, but I think Mueller did a great job of aligning himself to the spirit of the rules set out for the Special Counsel's office. He knows that any charges against Trump are inherently political and are outside of his office. Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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JonF writes: I think they also preferred an illiterate ignorant egomaniac who's easily manipulated over an experienced and knowledgeable professional. It is worth mentioning that Clinton had a long history of being anti-Putin, so it isn't surprising that Putin would support someone running against her. Trump being an easily manipulated fool is just a bonus.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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JonF writes: No President before wanted to meet Kim, and now the President grovels at his feet. I think he's panicking trying for some significant achievement, any significant achievement, before the election. Can you imagine what Fox News would be saying right now if it was Obama/Clinton in that video instead of Trump? Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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Chiroptera writes: I will say, though, I always did think trying to influence North Korea by trying to bully them isn't very productive. I am at least glad that a direct dialogue between leaders has begun, even if it is for the wrong reasons. Most reasoned people already know that NK is never going to give up their nukes or missile program because it deters others from invading them. Their entire existence rests on the threat they pose to others. Invoking Godwin's Law, I heard someone describe it as a US President being proud to meet Hitler in Auschwitz. We do have to keep in mind the massive humanitarian crisis in NK, and how a visit like this one can legitimize those abuses.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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messnjaH of oNe writes: obama had the illegals in cages. During the Obama administration, families were not separated, and children who were arrested without parents were placed with families in the US if possible. Also, there wasn't massive overcrowding in detention centers like there is now. It was the Trump "Zero Tolerance" policy that resulted in the current mess.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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messenjaH of oNe writes: i didn't vote for trump on the immigration issue, but it does seem like an unsolvable problem no matter what tack you take. Surely, the solution can't be misrepresenting the policies and actions of previous administrations. You can have your own opinions, but not your own facts. On a different note, I was talking to an old buddy who was in town for a few days and he talked about his conversations with people abroad. When he was in the Netherlands someone said something that stuck with him: "You're American. You think there is a solution to everything.". There may be no solution to illegal immigration, and we should come to that realization. What we can do is put policies in place that mitigate negative side effects while also upholding our moral and ethical values at the same time. Separating children from their parents, throwing them into overcrowded detention centers, and then not being able to reunite them with their parents contradicts everything about American values. EVERYTHING!!! That needs to be fixed pronto, and fixed by the administration that caused the problem in the first place.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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messenjaH of oNe writes: the problem with that is the resentment it would cause from the fact of millions of homeless in US citizenry. Trump is trying to cut food stamps to those very people, over 3 million of them:
Trump cutting food stamps: President Trump's plan would kick more than 3 million people off food stamps with proposed Temporary Assistance to Needy Families program (TANF) change - CBS News
not to mention the baddies like ms-13 and other criminals that kill citizens who aren't overtly interested in rehabilitation Illegal immigrants commit crimes at a 25% lower rate than US citizens. There has also never been a confirmed link between immigration and increases in crime rates.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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messenjay of one writes: For Christians there are a lot of reasons to dislike Obama. He had a particular disdain for people who "cling to God (and guns)". My hypocrisy detector is going off.
quote: I think the pinnacle was when he forced nuns to perform abortions. Say what????? Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
DrJones writes: you haven't heard of all those nuns who were trained to perform abortions but refused to do so on religious grounds until the big bad president came and forced them into the procedure room? The part that always amazes me is how many lies the Christian Right is willing to tell in order to support the Republican party. Mr. Messenger has to know what he wrote is a lie. Does he really think US troops came in and made nuns perform abortions at gun point, or something to that effect? Why the obvious lies? It reminds me of why I questioned my previous religious beliefs to begin with. What I saw around me at church was a lot of people who were just as flawed as anyone else, and weren't above passing on lies to support their religious beliefs. The pattern continues here.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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messanjah of one writes: spoiler alert: the good guys won. Spoiler alert: the bad guys lied. You said that Obama forced nuns to perform abortions. That wasn't true. Why did you say that?
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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vimesey writes: Trump’s impeachment begins. It will be political suicide for Dems if they pass articles of impeachment without the needed votes in the Senate. They need to look back at Clinton's impeachment and learn a few lessons. We could get lucky and suddenly find some Republicans who put country before party, but I doubt that will happen.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
vimesey writes: Presumably the main purpose is to subpoena the recording ? In the eyes of people like Nadler, Pelosi, and Schumer that would probably be the case. Edited by Taq, : No reason given.
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Taq Member Posts: 10081 Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
Percy writes: For the cowardly Democrats in Congress paying off paramours, obstructing justice, accepting emoluments, hiding his tax returns, refusing to put his business in a blind trust, and stonewalling all congressional inquiries (just to mention the worst) wasn't enough. But apparently inviting campaign help from a foreign country has finally put Trump over the top for these paragons of gutlessness, and now Pelosi believes she finally has sufficient House support to begin impeachment inquiries. If Democrats had a 2/3 majority in the Senate they would have impeached the President already. They don't. If you attack a bear you had better kill it. If you just wound it, you're in deep doodoo. The charges against Trump have to be egregious enough that even Republicans will vote to kick Trump out and have the support of their voting base when doing it.
Percy writes: I don't know how Trump supporters continue their support in the face of Trump's constant lies, misdeeds and cruelty. Tribalism, plain and simple. Beating the "evil liberals" is more important than morality or truth.
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