|
Author
|
Topic: Conservative Racism
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
(2)
| |
| |
| |
|
Message 792 of 953 (862399)
09-04-2019 2:44 PM
|
Reply to: Message 789 by AZPaul3
09-04-2019 1:47 PM
|
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
Just in case you haven't noticed but Obama isn’t running for anything and his national influence is not going to be altered by anything you and the right-wing do to fake his birth details. Nor did their "Kenyan birth" fantasy have any bearing while Obama was President. But since most birthers were and still are so ignurunt of citizenship, that didn't (and still doesn't) make any difference. It just gave them an outlet for their darkest impulses and prejudices. Since Faith is working so hard to avoid explaining why she thinks that that "Kenyan birth" fantasy means anything at all, that tells us that even she realizes what a crock it is. But because it seems to tickle some particularly dark and deep recess of her psyche, she cannot let go of it, even though she realizes that she cannot justify it in any way.
{ABE:
Another explanation of Faith's frantic avoidance of explaining her position could be that she has no idea what it is about. We have seen this situation play out over and over again over the decades when dealing with creationists on-line. All they know is how to repeat their claims, but they don't understand those claims. So when you ask them questions or try to discuss their own claims with them, they cannot do since they don't know anything about their claims except how to repeat them. So they try to bluff their way out in order to avoid discussion. The more you try to press them for discussion, the more drastic measures they take, from trying to change the subject to falsely claiming to take offense to becoming increasingly unpleasant in order to chase you off. Finally, they just run away. That looks very much like what Faith has been doing. The question in question is why this birther claim is supposed to matter. Answering that question would require her to be able to connect the dots from her claim to her conclusion (which itself is mostly just implied). Clearly, she cannot do that, so she tries to bluff, deflect and divert, and finally she just runs away. That would support the conclusion that, in typical creationist fashion, she does not understand her own claim but won't admit it. All she knows is how to make the claim and what the conclusion is supposed to be, but she has no idea how to get from the claim to the conclusion. The problem for her is the fact that there is no way to get from her claim to her conclusion (much of which we have to assume since it is mostly just implied, which is also typical of so many aspects of creationist claims).
And of course there's also the boogeyman factor. When there'd be a new scandal in the Trump Administration, FOX News would instead over Hillary Clinton and demand that she be investigated and arrested -- it's the old right-wing tactic of deflect and divert, which explains some of the more outrageous things that Trump does or says (ie, when someone testifies about him, he tries to divert press attention away with some outrageous stunt). Obama serves that purpose as well. Neither of them are in government anymore, but they can still be used to whip the right-wing base into a frenzy. I think it was Jimmy Kimmel doing his man-on-the-street interviews where, well into the Trump Administration, the question was, "Should Hillary Clinton be impeached?" I think the majority said that she should be impeached even though she's not holding any office. Those people's profound ignurunce is mind-boggling. Edited by dwise1, : {ABE} Edited by dwise1, : Added ", which is also typical of so many aspects of creationist claims"
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 789 by AZPaul3, posted 09-04-2019 1:47 PM | | AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 829 of 953 (862495)
09-05-2019 2:54 PM
|
Reply to: Message 781 by JonF
09-04-2019 12:32 PM
|
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
There is the pathetically obviously fake Kenyan birth certificate. I remember seeing it. Such poor quality that it was barely readable. As I recall, I couldn't make out the date on it. If I could have read the date, I wouldn't be surprised to find that it was from 1936, which is when President Obama's father, Barack Obama, was born in Kenya.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 781 by JonF, posted 09-04-2019 12:32 PM | | JonF has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 832 of 953 (862503)
09-05-2019 3:39 PM
|
Reply to: Message 809 by Faith
09-05-2019 1:01 PM
|
|
Re: Obama was the pawn of Communist political engineers
Perhaps you and PaulK and AZPaul and dwise could get jobs with Putin, or the Chinese Communists. I thought I've made it quite clear. I am an American, have served my country with 35 years of military service, and have sworn an oath at least seven times to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies foreign and domestic (that includes Trump) and I take that oath very seriously. There is no way I could ever become a traitorous Republican and join your vile traitorous ilk!
Good work of attacking the raiser of inconvenient questions. No, you are describing yourself. I keep raising that simple inconvenient question which absolutely terrifies you: What significance are you attaching to the question of where President Obama was born? What do you think the consequences of that birthplace are?
My question in its original form from my Message 694:
DWise1 writes: What possible importance could you attach to the question of whether Obama was born in an US state (or territory, as in Goldwater's and McCain's cases) or not? You cleave so tightly to your false Kenya-birth claim that it appears that you believe it to be very important. What exactly is that importance supposed to be? That question absolutely terrifies you. Why? Are you trying to cover something up? What would that be? In an ABE to my Message 792, I suggested that you're just being a typical creationist posting claims that you do not understand and hence are incapable of discussing them so you turn to bluffing and worse in order to avoid all attempts to discuss them with you. Here is that ABE again:
DWise1 writes: {ABE:
Another explanation of Faith's frantic avoidance of explaining her position could be that she has no idea what it is about. We have seen this situation play out over and over again over the decades when dealing with creationists on-line. All they know is how to repeat their claims, but they don't understand those claims. So when you ask them questions or try to discuss their own claims with them, they cannot do since they don't know anything about their claims except how to repeat them. So they try to bluff their way out in order to avoid discussion. The more you try to press them for discussion, the more drastic measures they take, from trying to change the subject to falsely claiming to take offense to becoming increasingly unpleasant in order to chase you off. Finally, they just run away. That looks very much like what Faith has been doing. The question in question is why this birther claim is supposed to matter. Answering that question would require her to be able to connect the dots from her claim to her conclusion (which itself is mostly just implied). Clearly, she cannot do that, so she tries to bluff, deflect and divert, and finally she just runs away. That would support the conclusion that, in typical creationist fashion, she does not understand her own claim but won't admit it. All she knows is how to make the claim and what the conclusion is supposed to be, but she has no idea how to get from the claim to the conclusion. The problem for her is the fact that there is no way to get from her claim to her conclusion (much of which we have to assume since it is mostly just implied, which is also typical of so many aspects of creationist claims).
Cut your BS and just engage in honest discussion. If you don't know what you're talking about, then just admit it. Don't be like Trump who just violated yet another federal law by falsifying a weather map (with a Sharpee, his weapon of choice) in order to over up his stiupid mistake about Alabama being in the path of Dorian and his false weather warning to that state (another violation of that same law), all because his pathetic ego won't let him ever admit to being wrong about anything. Is that your problem too?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 809 by Faith, posted 09-05-2019 1:01 PM | | Faith has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 833 of 953 (862504)
09-05-2019 3:43 PM
|
Reply to: Message 817 by ringo
09-05-2019 1:27 PM
|
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
You seem to forget that Putin is Trump's boyfriend. And given how Trump is always signalling his submissiveness when they're together, we all know which one is the "flower" (term learned from the film, The Boston Strangler (1968)).
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 817 by ringo, posted 09-05-2019 1:27 PM | | ringo has seen this message but not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 834 of 953 (862505)
09-05-2019 3:48 PM
|
Reply to: Message 823 by Faith
09-05-2019 1:39 PM
|
|
Re: Obama was the pawn of Communist political engineers
The evidence is circumstantial but there's a lot of it. I'm reminded of a response to a similar creationist boast that each little bit of "evidence" may be nothing, but he has millions of those little bits that all add up:
quote:
Response: "Zero times a million equals zero."
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 823 by Faith, posted 09-05-2019 1:39 PM | | Faith has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 836 of 953 (862517)
09-05-2019 9:10 PM
|
Reply to: Message 835 by Faith
09-05-2019 8:24 PM
|
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
The grandmother's first statement on the phone and the Postman's memory are the best evidence. Evidence of what? With what consequences? And of what possible significance? IOW, just what the hell are you talking about?
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 835 by Faith, posted 09-05-2019 8:24 PM | | Faith has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
(1)
| |
| |
| |
Re: Kenyan birth certificate
That fake "Kenyan" document is not what I remember. What I saw was a very grainy and poor quality "copy". I'm still waiting for a zoo vet's certification that Trump's father wasn't an orangutan. The resemblance is just too uncanny.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 831 by Theodoric, posted 09-05-2019 3:19 PM | | Theodoric has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
(1)
| |
| |
| |
|
|
Message 852 of 953 (862917)
09-17-2019 1:16 AM
|
Reply to: Message 850 by Faith
09-17-2019 12:40 AM
|
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
Why is so much energy expended on proving he wasn't born in Kenya if it doesn't matter? Because it's a fecking liie that is meant to deceive ignurant and stiupid people, who are the only ones who would fall for such a stiupid liie. It's of the same class as typical creationist lyes, which is why you fail to see that it is not shinola, but rather pure shite. We oppose that liie for the same reason that we oppose creationist liies, because we support the truth, unlike creationists and Trumpisti.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 850 by Faith, posted 09-17-2019 12:40 AM | | Faith has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
Re: I forgot about Snopes
If it could be proven that he was in fact Kenyan and not a naturalized American, as is a Constitutional provision to be eligible for POTUS, then he would immediately be taken out of the White House. Uh, what? Obama is not and never has been a naturalized citizen, because he is a natural born citizen. A naturalized citizen was not born a citizen, but rather had to apply for citizenship and go through the naturalization process to become naturalized. In Article II, Section 1, The Constitution states:
quote:
No Person except a natural born citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; ...
A naturalized citizen would be ineligible to be President. Obama, like Cruz, was born to an American citizen (the mother in both cases), which qualifies both of them as natural born citizens. Cruz was born in a foreign country, but that does not change the fact that he's a natural born citizen; that's not even a question regarding Obama, since he was born in Hawaii and hence in the USA. The only purpose that birtherism served was to rile up racial hatred against Obama, especially among the rubes who didn't realize that it made no difference and who didn't care. The only reason why it's still around is because the Right needs to keep the hate and the fake outrage stirred up.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 871 by Hyroglyphx, posted 09-18-2019 6:31 PM | | Hyroglyphx has not replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 874 by Faith, posted 09-18-2019 8:38 PM | | dwise1 has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 938 of 953 (866320)
11-09-2019 7:45 PM
|
Reply to: Message 937 by Faith
11-09-2019 5:01 PM
|
|
Re: 4th item Faith needs to back with actual evidence
Hey when I can I'll produce the info you ask for but if not, I'm expecting all this to blow wide open pretty soon and then what I say won't matter anyway. Which of course will never ever happen, because you are a fucking lyyer! Typical of Trumpists. Typical of creationists. Typical of "true Christians".
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 937 by Faith, posted 11-09-2019 5:01 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 939 by Faith, posted 11-09-2019 8:30 PM | | dwise1 has replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 940 of 953 (866323)
11-09-2019 8:58 PM
|
Reply to: Message 939 by Faith
11-09-2019 8:30 PM
|
|
Re: The demand for evidence is always to get back to reality which is the main point
And what you fail to get into your head is that there is such a thing as THE REAL WORLD where ACTUAL THINGS ACTUALLY HAPPEN! Where ALL THINGS HAVE ACTUAL WAYS IN WHICH THEY ACTUALLY WORK! Your "ANOTHER POINT OF VIEW" is nothing but complete and utter made-up fantasy bullshit liies which have absolutely no bearing on reality. Evidence exists for things rooted in reality. Evidence simply does not exist of your complete and utter made-up fantasy bullshit liies which have absolutely no bearing on reality. That is why you are completely unable to provide any evidence at all of your complete and utter made-up fantasy bullshit liies which have absolutely no bearing on reality. And why you have to work so very hard to ignore our own evidence of things rooted in reality. And our demands that you actually deal with evidence are attempts to get you back to reality and way from those pernicious destructive Trumpist fantasies. HINT: You cannot change reality with a Sharpie.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 939 by Faith, posted 11-09-2019 8:30 PM | | Faith has not replied |
|
dwise1
Member Posts: 5946 Joined: 05-02-2006 Member Rating: 5.6
|
|
|
Message 943 of 953 (866333)
11-09-2019 11:10 PM
|
Reply to: Message 942 by Faith
11-09-2019 10:14 PM
|
|
Re: The demand for evidence is sometimes just a smoke screen to hide the main point
First of all that 's not true, I often supply evidence. Uh, sorry, but when has that ever happened? You have often thrown your unsupported and fantasized baseless assertions at us frequently, but I cannot remember when you have ever supplied any actual evidence for anything. What the hell are you talking about?
... why Trump won the Presidency. The Electoral College. He got marginally enough votes in certain key states, mainly thanks to Russian interference in our elections. Hillary got three million more votes in the popular election, so the actual majority of voters were with her. And that thin-skinned morron Trump still cannot get over that, nor that it was Russian interference that got him into office. Trump's and your "point" does not represent the majority of Americans who had voted. But go ahead, miss it again, that's fine with us.
| This message is a reply to: | | | Message 942 by Faith, posted 11-09-2019 10:14 PM | | Faith has replied |
| Replies to this message: | | | Message 944 by Faith, posted 11-10-2019 3:09 AM | | dwise1 has not replied |
|
™ Version 4.2