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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Conservative Racism

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Author Topic:   Conservative Racism
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 601 of 953 (860923)
08-13-2019 12:46 PM
Reply to: Message 600 by Hyroglyphx
08-13-2019 10:25 AM


Re: Maybe you should address responses to assertions you have made
Actually as I have said before the Amnesty international makes no mention of race, culture or immigration status. None whatsoever.
You accuse me of poisoning the well and say I am making a racial thing out of it? Show me where I have done that. This is another strawman of yours.
Please show where the amnesty international report backs up your wild ass assertions.
The data represents a clear parallel between immigrants of Middle-Eastern and North African (MENA) descent and a rise in crime ranging from theft to sexual assaults that is disproportionate when compared to previous years of less immigration and when compared to native-born Scandinavians.
The Amnesty international report you presented as evidence sys no such thing. In fact it states that this is a long time problem in the Scandinavian countries with no reference at all to recent immigrants.
Again, we can view this from a racial perspective versus a cultural one.
Another strawman. Bringing up culture is not defense against racism. All cultures except the western European culture are brown and black. You try to sound all high and mighty by saying culture but you are reciting racist tropes because you lump all MENA immigrants into the same category and have yet to provide any evidence that they are the cause of a new rape problem in Sweden. All I want is evidence and facts. Tired of assertions.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 600 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-13-2019 10:25 AM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 602 of 953 (860924)
08-13-2019 1:02 PM
Reply to: Message 600 by Hyroglyphx
08-13-2019 10:25 AM


Re: Maybe you should address responses to assertions you have made
I tell you what I address some of your strawman arguments. As they are not much better than your original claim about immigrants being responsible for a "rape wave" in Sweden.
Are you really going to pretend that these poor nations, clinging to traditional, Islamic social mores are integrating well into Western Civilization?
Your source does not support you. You should read the full article and it's conclusions before you assume, because of it's title, that it supports you.
quote:
This disproves the commonly held view in Western Europe/Norway that the rise in rape cases — or the rape wave — is primarily to be blamed on the MENA immigrant’s influx to Western societies.
You might want to at least read the full conclusions.
Here are some important parts.
quote:
First, there is the obvious cultural clash between sexual norms and gender roles between the predominantly patriarchal, conservative and Muslim regions, and the predominantly gender equal, liberal and secular Western Europe. Second, there is also an overwhelming feeling of society’s discrimination and exclusion of the MENA immigrant community in Norway. This holds true for several other Western European countries as well. Even those who were born and raised in Norway to immigrant parents, testified being subject to a significant extent of discrimination in multiple layers of the society, as seen in the examples of labor market experiences, access to welfare system benefits, and so forth...
If racism and discrimination is occurring, or any other kind of maltreatment towards an ethnic minority, it will often stir social tensions. Regardless if it is happening at the workplace, at a top-down level in society such as any kind of public platform, or at a bottom-up level such as mainstream’s stereotypes and notions, it could provoke increased crime rates. This could be particularly relevant for rape crimes, as these crimes are often judged to be crimes in which the assailant seeks to exercise power or control46 — a logical reaction to humiliation. Last, but not least, the media and political public discourse’s frequent use of anti-immigrant rhetoric has also contributed greatly to shaping society’s prejudice view on MENA immigrants.
The same thing is unsurprisingly happening in Nordic countries presently with an influx of MENA immigrants
This Journal article is 22 years old. Do you really think it is still relevant? What does it say? What are the claims the article makes abut islamic immigrants being responsible for an increase in rapes in Sweden? That is what we are discussing. Again you build another strawman argument. How about sticking to your original claim about immigrants being responsible for a "rape wave" in Sweden.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 600 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-13-2019 10:25 AM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 605 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-14-2019 2:46 PM Theodoric has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(3)
Message 606 of 953 (860966)
08-14-2019 5:23 PM
Reply to: Message 605 by Hyroglyphx
08-14-2019 2:46 PM


Re: Maybe you should address responses to assertions you have made
Its also really stupid to pretend that concepts of women's rights are vastly different when comparing Norway to Yemen.
Another strawman? No on has made such a claim. But go you.
The 22 year old journal article is the other link your posted. You could tell I was talking about it because I quoted your link right above the comment you have quoted.
Journal Article
Immigrants, Crime, and Criminal Justice in Sweden
Peter L. Martens
Crime and Justice
Vol. 21, Ethnicity, Crime and Immigration: Comparative and Cross-National Perspectives (1997), pp. 183-255
From the header. Keep up.
Again I will reiterate. No article you have linked to supports your original contention that recent immigrants are responsible for a rape wave in Sweden. You are just engaging in a Gish Gallop right now. Since you can not support your original assertion then I guess I am done. I am tired of knocking down strawman after strawman.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 605 by Hyroglyphx, posted 08-14-2019 2:46 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 609 of 953 (861062)
08-16-2019 2:13 PM


The propaganda arm of the far right
More evidence that Sinclair Broadcasting is a propaganda arm of the right wing.
Sinclair gives Trump official 'must-run' airtime to mislead on Trump immigration policy
quote:
Sinclair Broadcast Group kept up its quest to be Fox News, Only More So this week with an interview giving U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services acting director Ken Cuccinelli the chance to explain how wonderful and humane Trump administration immigration policy is. The interview, in one of Sinclair’s loathed must-run segments featuring former Trump staffer and Sinclair messaging thug Boris Epshteyn, is framed by Epshteyn as a response to the recent ICE raids in Mississippi, though Cuccinelli says not a word about them in what aired.
More on this softball interview.
Sinclair teams up with immigration official Ken Cuccinelli to defend ICE raids and demonize asylum-seekers | Media Matters for America
Edited by Theodoric, : No reason given.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 665 of 953 (862208)
09-02-2019 9:53 PM
Reply to: Message 663 by Faith
09-02-2019 9:46 PM


Re: Protests and counter protests at Islamic conference
You might want to listen to or read the actual transcript.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 663 by Faith, posted 09-02-2019 9:46 PM Faith has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 721 of 953 (862269)
09-03-2019 12:12 PM
Reply to: Message 678 by Faith
09-03-2019 7:02 AM


Re: Obama's birthplace
Answer the damn question. How did you prove the birth certificate is a forgery? What are your credentials for documentary analysis? How did the birth announcement get put in the local HI paper?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 678 by Faith, posted 09-03-2019 7:02 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 731 by Faith, posted 09-03-2019 7:47 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 757 of 953 (862345)
09-04-2019 10:59 AM
Reply to: Message 727 by Faith
09-03-2019 7:38 PM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
On what basis did you conclude it was a forgery? What is your expertise in document analysis? Have you published your findings?
Will you give an actual answer to at least the first question?
OK we all know the answer to that.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 727 by Faith, posted 09-03-2019 7:38 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 759 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 11:00 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 763 of 953 (862352)
09-04-2019 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 746 by Faith
09-04-2019 10:36 AM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
Enough of your blithering gab. That is the birth certificate. There is not another one. You think maybe you were lied to again?
Nothing you have claimed as evidence supports you at all. It has been shown to all be lies and smoke and mirrors.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 746 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 10:36 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 765 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 11:04 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 766 of 953 (862355)
09-04-2019 11:06 AM
Reply to: Message 759 by Faith
09-04-2019 11:00 AM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
You said you determined it was a forgery. If you determined it was a forgery you must have had some reasons. What were the reasons?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 759 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 11:00 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 768 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 11:08 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 779 of 953 (862374)
09-04-2019 12:31 PM
Reply to: Message 768 by Faith
09-04-2019 11:08 AM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
So you have no reasons. Lies? There is no other birth certificate. The one posted is it. If you have no evidence it is a forgery quit claiming that you do.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 768 by Faith, posted 09-04-2019 11:08 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 781 by JonF, posted 09-04-2019 12:32 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 821 of 953 (862482)
09-05-2019 1:38 PM
Reply to: Message 815 by Faith
09-05-2019 1:22 PM


Re: Obama was the pawn of Communist political engineers
If they were you could provide the data that supports you. Alas, you can not and will not.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 815 by Faith, posted 09-05-2019 1:22 PM Faith has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 831 of 953 (862500)
09-05-2019 3:19 PM
Reply to: Message 829 by dwise1
09-05-2019 2:54 PM


Kenyan birth certificate
The forgery is laughable.
This is my favorite part.
quote:
The document is dated 17 February 1964 and a bears a legend identifying it as having been issued by the Republic of Kenya, but Kenya (a former British colony) didn’t officially adopt that name until 12 December 1964. In February 1964, it was known as the Dominion of Kenya.
Is This Barack Obama's Kenyan Certified Registration of Birth? | Snopes.com
The evidence shows that he is actually an alien.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 829 by dwise1, posted 09-05-2019 2:54 PM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 837 by dwise1, posted 09-05-2019 9:13 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(2)
Message 848 of 953 (862539)
09-06-2019 10:55 AM
Reply to: Message 847 by JonF
09-06-2019 9:49 AM


Re: the birth certificates
The Hawaii birth certificate is similar to the formats almost all birth certificates are in now days. All the info is in databases. The clerk pushes a button and this is what spits out.
In a lot of places in the USA, there is no "long form" birth certificate available.
Ignorant people have claimed that Obama never supplied an original birth certificate. There is no such thing as an original. In WI birth certificates come with the heading "Original Certificate of Live Birth". I have 5 copies of my sons. So the document is not an original in the idea that there is one original.
Also, since my son is adopted there is probably an earlier birth certificate that has a different name for him and different parents. This whole thing was created by racist people that were and are too stupid to understand how the process even works. And too stupid to understand what the Constitution and law actually says. Even if Barack Obama was not born in a US territory he would still have been eligible to run for President.
I have never seen a legitimate argument to counter that.
quote:
just three years after the drafting of the Constitution, the First Congress established that children born abroad to U.S. citizens were U.S. citizens at birth, and explicitly recognized that such children were natural born Citizens. The Naturalization Act of 1790 provided that the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States . . . . The actions and understandings of the First Congress are particularly persuasive because so many of the Framers of the Constitution were also members of the First Congress. That is particularly true in this instance, as eight of the eleven members of the committee that proposed the natural born eligibility requirement to the Convention served in the First Congress and none objected to a definition of natural born Citizen that included persons born abroad to citizen parents
On the Meaning of Natural Born Citizen - Harvard Law Review
Isn't it funny how Constitutional originalists don't follow that interpretation when it does not agree with their prejudices.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 847 by JonF, posted 09-06-2019 9:49 AM JonF has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 854 of 953 (862926)
09-17-2019 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 850 by Faith
09-17-2019 12:40 AM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
Lies especially lies in the political arena always matter. The sad thing is like most lies from the right, this one was very easy to disprove. The problem is a sizeable group of people prefer hate over the truth. You are one of them.
The whole Q thing is the current incarnation of the need of people to suspend truth and facts in order to embrace their hate.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 850 by Faith, posted 09-17-2019 12:40 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 855 by Faith, posted 09-17-2019 10:33 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9142
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 857 of 953 (862933)
09-17-2019 11:19 AM
Reply to: Message 856 by Faith
09-17-2019 10:47 AM


Re: I forgot about Snopes
then the birth certificate that has some letters typed on it that should match each other but don't, which is hard to account for from the old manual typewriter that supposedly typed it up
You have never shown this birth certificate. As I stated before a birth certificate is not a particular document. A birth certificate is produced by the technology of the time. The birth record is kept in government records. Now days it is probably not even an entry into a book. The information is kept in government databases. The birth certificate is produced on a printer on special paper the county uses. There is no such thing as an original birth certificate. I have a birth certificate that was typed out in 1981. If I requested one now it would be printed out by a computer. Both birth certificates would be considered an original. Request your birth certificate and see what you get.
Are you really this dense or does your hate blind you? The inability for the rightwing haters to even attempt to understand what they are talking about is stunning.
and the mailman's memory that Obama was identified as a "foreign student"
Yet no one has provided corroborating evidence for this memory. No one has been able to show this supposed foreign student was Obama. The postman admits he was not told his name. There is no evidence Ayers and Obama ever met before 1995.
Other than that thestory is still worthless

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.
If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 856 by Faith, posted 09-17-2019 10:47 AM Faith has not replied

  
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