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Author Topic:   The Right Side of the News
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2938 of 5796 (863950)
10-03-2019 3:03 PM
Reply to: Message 2937 by Faith
10-03-2019 2:53 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
quote:
He did not. Biden didn't come up in the conversation until much later, and not in the context of asking a favor. The favor was asked about the Ukraine's part in supporting Hillary in the2016 election and what they knew about the Democrats' efforts to sabotage Trump. Nothing to do with Biden.
The first part is just about correct, but it is clear that Trump wanted Biden’s son investigated.
The rest is laughably wrong. In reality Trump thinks that the American company that investigated the DNC hack have a server in the Ukraine that he wants to get his hands on. Why he thinks that, I have no idea.
I note that you offer no evidence of this supposedly incriminating audio, and since even the Fox News report cited by Percy clearly has no knowledge of such a thing, it looks like another invention of yours.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2937 by Faith, posted 10-03-2019 2:53 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2939 by Faith, posted 10-03-2019 3:25 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2940 of 5796 (863953)
10-03-2019 3:38 PM
Reply to: Message 2939 by Faith
10-03-2019 3:25 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
quote:
What I said has been reported on dozens of sources that apparently those on the Left don't know abouT
Fox News obviously didn’t know about it either.
And still, unless you can show it was for personal interest it’s still better than Trump threatening to withhold aid for personal interest.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2939 by Faith, posted 10-03-2019 3:25 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2941 by Faith, posted 10-03-2019 3:49 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2942 of 5796 (863955)
10-03-2019 3:55 PM
Reply to: Message 2941 by Faith
10-03-2019 3:49 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Oh please. He cancels military aid only hours before the call. Asks the Ukrainians to do things for him - things he shouldn’t be asking for as President - when they are asking for aid. Just because it’s implicit doesn’t mean it isn’t there.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2941 by Faith, posted 10-03-2019 3:49 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2945 of 5796 (863977)
10-04-2019 12:14 PM
Reply to: Message 2944 by Faith
10-04-2019 11:50 AM


Re: Trump was asking a favor about the 2016 election, not about Biden
quote:
This whole thing has been getting very confused so I'll have to wait and see what the ultimate upshot is.
Trump is quite confused - read the transcript.
quote:
But what he did in that phone call is what all Presidents do.
Using his position to seek personal advantage ? His people knew, that’s why they tried to hide the transcript.
quote:
It's only fair but we are now being manipulated by a corrupt Left so nothing fair is going to happen. Also
Exposing Trump’s abuse of his office is hardly corrupt, nor is it unfair.
quote:
Also there can't be a whistleblower in this case since the president is not part of the intelligence community. AND until recently a whistleblower had to have first hand information not this second or third hand gossip that the transcript showed to be wrong.
And every claim there is false.
quote:
But as I've been saying most of what I've heard is that the favor he asked wasn't about Biden anyway, which would not have been wrong even if it was, it was about the Ukraine's position in the 2016 election of meddling on the side of Hillary, and Trump's wanting to get ot the bottom of THAT collusion that issued in the Mueller investigation.
The election meddling was in favour of Trump. And Trump is desperately casting around for ways to discredit it.
quote:
The clue that this is what it was about is his mention of CrowdStrike. Here's a discussion of this aspect of the conversation.
Let’s see what that says:
...Trump has long alleged a DNC server is missing, a theory which appears to be based on a conspiracy theory peddled in right-wing circles that CrowdStrike was involved in a cover-up of the DNC breach.
But in reality, there are no physical machines linked with the DNC breach that are actually missing...
Trump wants Zelensky to find a machine that doesn’t exist.
Let me point out that Crowdstrike is a US-based company, apparently with no offices in the Ukraine (I looked for evidence and the closest is in Romania). If they had taken physical possession of a server (there is no reason to think they did) they would have returned it to the DNC when their investigation was complete. And they certainly wouldn’t have sent it off to the Ukraine. That makes no sense.
And why is Trump personally asking for this non-existent server? And sending in his personal lawyer ? As well as going on to try and get the Ukrainians to discredit Mueller and Biden ?
Could it be any more obvious that it is all about Trump ?
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Fix quote box and contained link.
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Format that link differently.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2944 by Faith, posted 10-04-2019 11:50 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2946 by Faith, posted 10-04-2019 12:17 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(2)
Message 2947 of 5796 (863979)
10-04-2019 12:20 PM
Reply to: Message 2946 by Faith
10-04-2019 12:17 PM


Re: Trump was asking a favor about the 2016 election, not about Biden
In other words it’s all true.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2946 by Faith, posted 10-04-2019 12:17 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2959 of 5796 (864023)
10-05-2019 1:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2955 by Faith
10-05-2019 12:09 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
I think the fact that you chose to cite Russian propaganda had a lot to do with it. RT is owned by the Russian government. The fact that they are choosing to bash Biden is evidence that the Russians are still backing Trump.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2955 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 12:09 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2960 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 1:40 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2961 of 5796 (864025)
10-05-2019 1:44 PM
Reply to: Message 2960 by Faith
10-05-2019 1:40 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
RT or Russia Today is the source of your video in Message 2939. As can be seen be anyone who looks. The RT is hardly hidden.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2960 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 1:40 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2962 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 2:10 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2965 of 5796 (864036)
10-05-2019 4:33 PM
Reply to: Message 2962 by Faith
10-05-2019 2:10 PM


Re: Fox News Gets the Facts Backward
Obviously you should be interested in your sources. And you certainly can’t complain if someone notices which sources you are using.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2962 by Faith, posted 10-05-2019 2:10 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3011 of 5796 (864892)
10-18-2019 12:36 AM
Reply to: Message 3010 by Faith
10-17-2019 9:40 PM


Re: Trump not asking about Biden in request for "favor"
quote:
This whole Ukraine phone call thing is at the very least a misunderstanding on the part of the Democrats, which of course they maximize, though very likely in reality it is the usual intentional fake news.
The devotion to lying among Trump’s followers is truly amazing.
quote:
Trump was not referring to Biden at all in his asking for the "favor," that was about the ONGOING investigation into the interferences in the 2016 election which involved Ukraine and some Democrats on behalf of Clinton
Trump asked for both. And made it plain that his personal lawyer was deeply involved. And indeed, the first is a crazy fishing expedition. Why is the President doing such a thing ? Why is he saying that it is very important (other than important to you, if you want this missiles?)
These are personal favours asked for political advantage.
quote:
So Percy in Message 3513 on the Trump Bashing Thread has it all wrong because he's just following the Democrat line, and so are others who keep insisting Trump was asking for "dirt on Biden." That was NOT the case at all. Biden didn't even come up until later. He was referring to the ONGOING investigation by Barr and others into the 2016 corruptions involving collusions between Clinton and the Democrats with Russians and Ukrainians.
By later you mean Trump’s next paragraph of speech. So, not much later at all. And what ongoing investigation? Why is Giuliani involved? And why is this so urgent it has to go through the President? That’s not at all ordinary, especially for a mere rumour that is almost certainly false.
quote:
Mulvaney was not "admitting" that there was a quid pro quo at all, he also was talking about the ongoing investigation in terms of USUAL PROCEDURES when asking foreign countries to aid in such an effort.
No sane person could believe that. It is not at all normal for the President to directly ask for assistance in an investigation. Especially not as a favour. Even less so with the implied threat of withholding military aid. And certainly not for the President’s personal lawyer to be involved.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3010 by Faith, posted 10-17-2019 9:40 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 3056 of 5796 (865054)
10-20-2019 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 3050 by Faith
10-20-2019 1:51 PM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
quote:
The topic is Gregg Jarrett's book claiming the Mueller investigation was a witch hunt in which the whole thing was drummed up out of thin air to try to catch Trump in something
Well that’s a lie for a start.
quote:
Your concern about right wing ideology is not relevant in this context.
I think that the Satanic ideology of the Right is very relevant.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3050 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 1:51 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3057 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 2:32 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 3059 of 5796 (865058)
10-20-2019 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 3057 by Faith
10-20-2019 2:32 PM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
quote:
All the various events Jarrett's book discusses about how the Mueller investigation was a witch hunt with no justification whatever, have been discussed to death already on the conservative media, and the interview I heard with Jarrett makes his book sound like it will be a very thorough discussion of all those elements.
Yawn. The justifications are well known. Therefore the claim that there was no justification is false.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3057 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 2:32 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3060 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 2:59 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3061 of 5796 (865063)
10-20-2019 3:09 PM
Reply to: Message 3060 by Faith
10-20-2019 2:59 PM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
quote:
May the truth come out.
That’s exactly what you don’t want.
So come on, tell me why all the inappropriate contacts with the Russians - and the attempts to conceal them - don’t exist. Manafort, the Trump Tower meeting, Flynn and the rest.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3060 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 2:59 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3072 of 5796 (865120)
10-21-2019 12:29 AM
Reply to: Message 3071 by Faith
10-20-2019 11:13 PM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
Faith, you need to understand that being a liar doesn’t put Trump above the law. Simply saying that he hasn’t committed crimes is not going to work in any court. The Republicans haven’t corrupted the system that much.
There is pretty good evidence of fraud (differences in financial information given to lenders and to the tax authorities) and it wouldn’t be surprising if there were more.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3071 by Faith, posted 10-20-2019 11:13 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3139 of 5796 (865295)
10-23-2019 2:51 AM
Reply to: Message 3138 by Faith
10-23-2019 2:37 AM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
Even if the Mueller report had found nothing, there would still be a valid purpose for it. And it did find strong evidence of Obstruction of Justice as everyone knows. Even Trump knows it, which is why he keeps trying to trash Mueller. (And you have to know about. That vile habit of Trump’s is one of the reasons you love him so much)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3138 by Faith, posted 10-23-2019 2:37 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3140 by Faith, posted 10-23-2019 2:55 AM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3142 of 5796 (865299)
10-23-2019 3:25 AM
Reply to: Message 3140 by Faith
10-23-2019 2:55 AM


Re: The Muller Witch Hunt Exposed
quote:
There was no obstruction of justice and if there had been the report had an obligation to say so clearly, but all there is in the report is innuendo about things Trump said which do not amount to obstruction of justice.
No, there was an obligation to lay out the evidence for the House to decide. And that is what Mueller did. The House declined to impeach then, but that decision was waffected by political considerations. The Senate would almost certainly refuse to convict because partisan politics has taken over from principles.
quote:
Starr's report on Clinton clearly said he had in fact obstructed justice.
Yeah. Let’s talk about that. Starr failed to come up with anything in the Whitewater investigation. Instead of closing down the investigation he started on the unrelated Troopergate. That also turned up nothing, but Clinton got caught lying about Monica Lewinsky. Is that really the comparison you want to make ?
quote:
Instead it resorted to vague insinuations which should not have been in such a report at all.
It was not Mueller’s job to cover up for Trump, which is what you mean.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3140 by Faith, posted 10-23-2019 2:55 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3144 by Faith, posted 10-23-2019 3:28 AM PaulK has replied

  
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