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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
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Author | Topic: The Right Side of the News | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
PaulK Member Posts: 17828 Joined: Member Rating: 2.5
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quote: Nonsense. Aside from the fact that Trump’s desperate attempts to avoid investigation continue with the Impeachment process (and in the attempts to keep his tax returns secret) one of the biggest weaknesses in the Mueller report is that Trump himself did not testify.
quote: He had none until a legal request was made. However I was asking about what he was doing to fulfill his promise to release them. Which makes your reaction very telling. And I note that you don’t answer about the deficit either.
quote: Which would be a lousy way to wriggle out of his promise even if it wasn’t a steaming stack of lies.
quote: Lock up the opposition for exposing corruption in government. You really do want the US to become a third-world dictatorship.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yes that's the only reason you all want him impeached, you don't like his personality, all the rest is just mde up. However, people who vote for him actually like him, doesn't mean we think everything he does is right, but he's a hundred million times better for the country than anybody running on the other side. And he's actually accomplished quite a bit for the country despite the efforts to obstruct him.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
oh never mind
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9207 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4
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Those are not criminal charges. Those were the grounds for impeachment. They are not criminal charges.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9207 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4
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I agree Dwise deserved a suspension, but you are a troll who should be suspended also.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Percy Member Posts: 22508 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.4
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Faith writes: You can tell" me that all you want, it's a shuck and a fraud. Clinton and Nixon were both charged with crimes from the Special Counsel. The only reason Trump wasn't is that they found none. You're thinking of the Independent Counsel Law, which was allowed to expire around 2000. Watergate preceded but drove passage of the original law, which followed the Watergate model, mainly the appointment of a special prosecutor independent of the Justice Department. The law was modified many times between 1978 when it was enacted and 2000 when it expired. Bill Clinton was investigated under this act. The key difference between between the Nixon and Clinton investigations as contrasted to the Trump investigation is that they were conducted by a special prosecutor who, being independent of the Justice Department, could charge the president with the types crimes laid out in the Constitution. Mueller was part of the Justice Department, reporting to Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, and had to follow DOJ guidelines of not indicting a sitting president. He instead recommended that Congress investigate the issues he found. --Percy Edited by Percy, : Add clarify.
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Percy Member Posts: 22508 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.4
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Faith writes: MAY THE TRUTH COME OUT. Your wish has been granted, many times. --Percy
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Mueller was part of the Justice Department, reporting to Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein, and had to follow DOJ guidelines of not indicting a sitting president. He instead recommended that Congress investigate the issues he found. \ How very very odd then that when asked if the rule against indicting a sitting President had affected the conclusions of his investigation he denied it emphatically. Then when interviewed by Congress affirmed it but then afterward specifically denied it again. But all Starr did was similar: he listed Clinton's criminal acts as a recommendation to Congress that they could be the basis of an impeachment. Only his list was very specific and very clear that they were indeed criminal acts. The Mueller report first concluded that there was no evidence of Russian collusion by Trump's campaign, and then in a second part listed a lot of things Trump had said that were not and could not be identified as criminal, insinuating that they were sorta kinda Obstruction of Justice. In contrast Starr KNEW that Clinton had committed obstruction of justice and very clearly identified it. To list such actions is not the same as indicting the President, it is still left to Congress to take that action. But the Mueller report found NO CRIMINAL ACTIONS WHATEVER. The House may decide to treat some of Trump's remarks as obstruction of justice whether they are criminally definable as obstruction of justice or not, and they can impeach him without such criminal charges anyway. They are supposed to impeach only on the grounds of treason, high crimes and misdemeanors but they are probably just going to make it up and not bother with such constitutional niceties. If they impeach him they aren't going to be able to do it on the basis of criminal charges because there aren't any. Or for that reason perhaps they will never impeach him. There has been no official vote to impeach and there may not be. It's all a big drama to pretend they have evidence against him though they don't, never have, never will.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Those are not criminal charges. Those were the grounds for impeachment. They are not criminal charges. OK, they were technically not criminal charges, but they wer eclearly identified as criminal actions. Nothing in the Mueller report identified anything as criminal actions, it was all vague innuendo, in the section on Obstruction of Justice. On collusion Trump was exonerated. Yes that is the right word for the report's finding no evidence of collusion. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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xongsmith Member Posts: 2587 From: massachusetts US Joined: Member Rating: 7.0 |
Faith asserts:
The Mueller report first concluded that there was no evidence of Russian collusion by Trump's campaign... Not true. He said there was INSUFFICIENT evidence, not ZERO. You are quoting Barr's summary, which was a lying mis-characterization - leave his lies out of this discussion."I'd rather be an American than a Trump Supporter." - xongsmith, 5.7d
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Sorry, yes "insufficient" evidence. Means the same thing as far as conclusions go: collusion could not be proved. And since no evidence whatever was reported the word "insufficient" is a weasel word anyway. In the end Trump was exonerated of collusion.
And I already posted the report by the Washington Post (Message 3137)on Mueller's clear statement that he was not saying that Barr's summary of the report's conclusions was inaccurate.. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9207 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4 |
You are such a troll. This has been explained to you numerous times that this is not true. Yet you persist. Troll.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Tangle Member Posts: 9516 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 5.1
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what's up Theo, you seem to be angry at the world?
Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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Percy Member Posts: 22508 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.4 |
Faith writes: This is a Kangaroo Court in violation of all normal legal proceedings. What laws of legal procedures are being broken? Here are the Constitutional paragraphs that mention impeachment:
quote: Do you see anything constitutional being violated? Can you cite any law being violated?
No impeachment has ever been conducted in such a way. I think you're probably referring to the lack of a vote by the full House officially beginning the impeachment inquiry and defining the process to be followed. You are correct, this is different from the Nixon and Clinton impeachment proceedings, but no such vote is required by the Constitution. Every impeachment will be different. Clinton's impeachment was not like Nixon's, and Nixon's impeachment (as far as it went) was not like Johnson's. This isn't the first difference and it won't be the last.
His lawyers should be told what is going on and allowed to prepare their defense. You're thinking of the trial in the Senate. This is the impeachment phase, not the trial phase.
MAY THE TRUTH COME OUT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Much of the truth is already out. May the Trumpists acknowledge the truth. --Percy
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9207 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4 |
Tired of the willfully ignorant.
Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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