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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House Conservative Racism

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Author Topic:   Conservative Racism
PaulK
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Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 889 of 953 (863075)
09-19-2019 5:12 PM
Reply to: Message 887 by Faith
09-19-2019 4:52 PM


Re: Where is the birth certificate Faith?
If you refuse to change your mind just because of the evidence that is really your problem.
The fact remains that there is solid evidence - the newspaper announcements, the birth certificate, the sworn statements - supporting the fact that Obama was born in Hawaii.
You have nothing half as good.
Your interpretation of the grandmother’s statements is hardly solid. It’s as easily a misunderstanding or a mistake.
You haven’t produced this allegedly forged birth certificate. But you have said that it isn’t the long form certificate that we have seen here - and that would be the original.
The mailman’s story is hardly conclusive. There is no evidence that even makes it plausible that Obama was there. A misidentification is by far the most likely explanation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 887 by Faith, posted 09-19-2019 4:52 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 891 by Faith, posted 09-19-2019 5:18 PM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 890 of 953 (863076)
09-19-2019 5:14 PM
Reply to: Message 888 by Faith
09-19-2019 5:07 PM


Re: Obama's birthplace
quote:
Ideology came up because I'm being falsely accused of "hate" and "racism" for believing he was born in Kenya. This implies I have those attitudes toward Obama and that they explain why I believe he wsas born in Kenya. ideology also doesn't explan it, I'm simply saying my object5ions to him are ideological and have nothing to do with hate or racism.
Then why do you cling to this belief in spite of the evidence ? There has to be some reason.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 888 by Faith, posted 09-19-2019 5:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 894 of 953 (863080)
09-19-2019 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 891 by Faith
09-19-2019 5:18 PM


Re: Where is the birth certificate Faith?
quote:
See. As long as you continue to claim your interpretation is the correct one I'm going to answer that mine is.
I but I didn’t. All I claimed is that both interpretations fit what we see and hear of the interview.
quote:
The birth certificate is the long one, I just didn't recognize it. It's folded in half. I just have to go dig it out of my blog and copy out what was said about it. Three letters that should be identical throughout the form aren't, which is hard to explain based on the way the old manual typewriters worked.
It looked OK to me when I checked it. And you still haven’t produced a shred of evidence of forgery other than your opinion.
quote:
I'll go dig it up eventually but this kind of discussion takes a toll on my motivation.
If you try to defend a hopelessly shaky position it isn’t going to go well. If you have decent evidence, holding it back is the last thing you want to do.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 891 by Faith, posted 09-19-2019 5:18 PM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 898 of 953 (863099)
09-20-2019 5:56 AM
Reply to: Message 897 by Faith
09-20-2019 5:44 AM


Re: Obama's birthplace
quote:
I was only going to post on a few letters that don't seem to fit what an old typewriter would do: that is, the same letter should appear the same wherever it occurs in the text: if one is high all should be high, if one is faded looking because it didn't strike hard enough every use of that letter should look like that.
With an electric typewriter maybe. With a manual typewriter then obviously the strength of the strike is down to the operator. The vertical positioning of the letters can be affected by the shift key, too.
And another thing - if the ribbon is unevenly inked (usually due to use) you’ll see faint letters when the part of the ribbon being used is low on ink.
Edited by PaulK, : Thought of ribbon issue

This message is a reply to:
 Message 897 by Faith, posted 09-20-2019 5:44 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 899 by Faith, posted 09-20-2019 6:15 AM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 900 of 953 (863101)
09-20-2019 6:17 AM
Reply to: Message 899 by Faith
09-20-2019 6:15 AM


Re: Obama's birthplace
If the operator hit the key lightly isn’t that what you would expect ?
And I don’t see why the region of low ink couldn’t be narrow enough for a single character.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 899 by Faith, posted 09-20-2019 6:15 AM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 904 by Theodoric, posted 09-20-2019 8:37 AM PaulK has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 905 of 953 (863108)
09-20-2019 9:54 AM
Reply to: Message 902 by Theodoric
09-20-2019 8:29 AM


Re: You know nothing about typewriters
We have a,ready seen the certificate inMessage 740
I’ve eyeballed it and the variations look like those you’d expect from a manual ribbon typewriter and not two distinct machines (or typists). For the latter you’d ideally want a difference in the typeface or at least consistent differences between supposedly genuine and supposedly forged parts. And I don’t see either.
For instance the ‘O’ in the first instance of Oahu is raised and faint. In the second instance it is less raised and isn’t faint. The raising looks like the typists hand to me, they aren’t getting the shift quite right for the ‘O. The faintness could be the strike or the ribbon, i can’t tell. Both instances should be genuine, so it’s further evidence that the variations are normal.
The O in OBAMA isn’t raised. However, the raising is due to the shift key, and since the name is all-caps it’s likely that the shift lock would be used, and that would get it right. There are other raised capitals, but none in the names, just as we’d expect if that were the case.
So another piece of evidence collapses.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 902 by Theodoric, posted 09-20-2019 8:29 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 907 by Theodoric, posted 09-20-2019 11:06 AM PaulK has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 909 of 953 (863113)
09-20-2019 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 906 by Faith
09-20-2019 10:51 AM


quote:
So you've satisfied yourselves that you got it right and I got it wrong no matter what I say,
Of course it does matter what you say. The fact that what you said was obviously wrong despite its vagueness is the reason why I rejected your claims.
quote:
and of course Theodoric got everything I said wrong, but no matter, he must be right anyway.
Considering only his comments about typewriters, his observations are in line with my own experience - and since I’ve offered analysis in support of ny views - which is more than you’ve even tried it seems rather clear that you’re wrong.
quote:
As I said I've dropped this subject.
Except that you didn’t. And if you had any confidence in your evidence of forgery you wouldn’t be running away now.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 906 by Faith, posted 09-20-2019 10:51 AM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 912 of 953 (863141)
09-21-2019 4:34 AM
Reply to: Message 906 by Faith
09-20-2019 10:51 AM


Since you claim that it doesn’t matter what you say, i’m going to prove you wrong.
In Message 891 you claimed:
Three letters that should be identical throughout the form aren't, which is hard to explain based on the way the old manual typewriters worked
(Note that you agree that it is a manual typewriter)
In Message 897 you expand in that:
I was only going to post on a few letters that don't seem to fit what an old typewriter would do: that is, the same letter should appear the same wherever it occurs in the text: if one is high all should be high, if one is faded looking because it didn't strike hard enough every use of that letter should look like that
So let us look at the document again. Can we make sense of these variations assuming two typewriters - one for the genuine parts, one for the forgery ? Or does it make more sense to attribute it to the known variations associated with the use of a manual ribbon typewriter ?
The high letters are the O in Oahu - twice. The A in Africa, and the K in Kansas.
The K is especially interesting because it is particularly high and the top is cut off. There are 5 other Ks and none of them is raised.
In fact there is no real consistency - even the O in Oahu is at different heights in the two examples.
This really doesn’t fit the forgery hypothesis well. There is no way that Kansas is going to be the only forged or the only genuine word containing K. Africa is not much better, and even the variations in Oahu are a problem.
On the other hand, every one is an initial capital - they all appear where the shift key would be used, and none appear where the shift lock would be used instead. The evidence perfectly fits with the alternative explanation that the operator sometimes didn’t got the shift key in quite the right position - which is known to happen with manual typewriters.
As for faint letters, there are odd singletons like the a in African and the i in University - but there are enough other examples to show that there is no consistency. The top bar of the E in the first HUSSEIN is weak, but not in the second, or in East. Again, the forgery hypothesis fails.
It is clear that the consistency required by the forgery hypothesis is utterly lacking. Any serious analysis would have seen that. There is no evidence here of anything wrong at all.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 906 by Faith, posted 09-20-2019 10:51 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 913 by Faith, posted 09-21-2019 5:00 AM PaulK has not replied
 Message 931 by Stile, posted 10-24-2019 4:20 PM PaulK has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 928 of 953 (865382)
10-24-2019 2:47 AM
Reply to: Message 925 by Faith
10-24-2019 12:41 AM


Re: Yup racist donnie policies
quote:
Satan seems to spend quite a bit of time at EvC.
Yes, lying to cover up the many sins of the Right. Unfortunately for you we’re too deluded to believe obvious lies.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 925 by Faith, posted 10-24-2019 12:41 AM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 945 of 953 (866335)
11-10-2019 3:25 AM
Reply to: Message 939 by Faith
11-09-2019 8:30 PM


Re: The demand for evidence is sometimes just a smoke screen to hide the main point
So the important thing is that you are a nasty liar who will smear anyone daring to report things you don’t want known.
Yes, we knew that. No need to belabour the point.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 939 by Faith, posted 11-09-2019 8:30 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 946 by Faith, posted 11-10-2019 4:05 AM PaulK has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 947 of 953 (866338)
11-10-2019 4:17 AM
Reply to: Message 946 by Faith
11-10-2019 4:05 AM


Re: The demand for evidence is sometimes just a smoke screen to hide the main point
Provoked by nothing ?
We have a report of chat logs from assorted right wingers.
You dismiss the report of the contents as paranoia, claim that it displays hatred, suggest that it only shows that the Right don’t want to live in a nation run by the Left and end up by suggesting that instead of reporting the facts we should find ways you could get around a non-existent tyranny. (Message 933)
You do not at any point engage with the substance of the report, which you probably haven’t even read.
And then, after all that you dare to suggest that asking you to support your claims is just a smokescreen and that all you are doing is presenting the Right Wing view. Message 939 Well we can see what that view is, thank you very much.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 946 by Faith, posted 11-10-2019 4:05 AM Faith has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 951 of 953 (866355)
11-10-2019 10:21 AM


Faith’s reading problems do not excuse her from the need to provide evidence. They do not excuse her invention of falsehoods to dismiss material she has not read. Or in short her physical weaknesses do not excuse her moral failings.
Faith is probably jubilant at the closure of this thread, finally a victory for Satan! By her lies she has made a small step to silencing the truth. But only a very small step.
Her main goal here - as in the other political threads is to cover up the Deplorable nature of much of the Right. True, she usually succeeds only in showing her own deplorable nature. But that is not a reason to give her what she wants.

  
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