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Author Topic:   Brexit - Should they stay or should they go?
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 759 of 887 (862654)
09-09-2019 11:49 AM


Speaker John Bercow to step down
quote:
John Bercow says he will stand down as Commons Speaker and MP at the next election or on 31 October, whichever comes first.
Speaking in Parliament, Mr Bercow said his 10-year "tenure" was nearing its end and it had been the "greatest honour and privilege" to serve.
If there was no early election, he said 31 October would be the "least disruptive and most democratic" date.
Commons Speaker John Bercow to stand down - BBC News
There were rumblings about the Conservative party attempting to vote him out, so it appears that he beat them to the punch. Or maybe he just decided to bail before the No Deal Brexit deadline.

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 762 of 887 (862680)
09-10-2019 9:44 AM
Reply to: Message 761 by caffeine
09-10-2019 6:55 AM


Re: Brexit fact of the day
Johnson's government has managed to suffer more Commons defeats in one week than either Thatcher or Blair did in premierships that lasted more than a decade.
I wonder if there is an award for that.
I am curious what the next steps are going to be. Parliament is now in recess and Johnson is supposed to be going to the EU to broker a new deal. I doubt that will get much traction. His plan to use No Deal as a bargaining chip seems to now be gone. And he has emphatically stated he will not ask the EU for an extension despite technically now being mandated by law to do so if he has no new deal.
I am still wondering if the EU might just decide to end this charade and not grant another extension. Macron has hinted at this, although he may be grandstanding. But from where I sit, it seems the EU is holding all the cards right now. So I wouldn't be surprised if they simply denied the extension and told the UK that they either need to accept the deal already in place or revoke Article 50. Put all the onus on them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 761 by caffeine, posted 09-10-2019 6:55 AM caffeine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 763 by caffeine, posted 09-10-2019 2:48 PM Diomedes has not replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 769 of 887 (862718)
09-11-2019 9:43 AM


Suspension of Parliament ruled unlawful
quote:
Boris Johnson’s suspension of the UK Parliament is unlawful, Scotland’s highest civil court has ruled.
A panel of three judges at the Court of Session found in favour of a cross-party group of politicians who were challenging the prime minister's move.
The judges said the PM was attempting to prevent Parliament holding the government to account ahead of Brexit.
A UK government appeal against the ruling will be heard by the Supreme Court in London next week.
The Court of Session decision overturns an earlier ruling from the court, which said last week that Mr Johnson had not broken the law.
Brexit: Scottish judges rule Parliament suspension is unlawful - BBC News
My guess is this will likely be over-ruled by the Supreme Court. But still, another slap in the face to Boris.

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 773 of 887 (863291)
09-24-2019 8:03 AM
Reply to: Message 772 by Heathen
09-24-2019 7:11 AM


Re: Supreme Court Rules against UK Govt
It's clear Johnson massively overplayed his hand since he became Prime Minister. There is going to be a large amount of turmoil now in British Politics.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 772 by Heathen, posted 09-24-2019 7:11 AM Heathen has not replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


(2)
Message 775 of 887 (863464)
09-26-2019 8:59 AM
Reply to: Message 774 by Heathen
09-26-2019 3:39 AM


Re: Johnathan Pie nails it again...
My favorite line in reference to Boris:
"He's the perfect storm of hubris, incompetence, deceit and shit hair!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 774 by Heathen, posted 09-26-2019 3:39 AM Heathen has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 776 by RAZD, posted 09-26-2019 10:19 AM Diomedes has replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


(1)
Message 777 of 887 (863493)
09-26-2019 2:14 PM
Reply to: Message 776 by RAZD
09-26-2019 10:19 AM


Re: Johnathan Pie nails it again...
My favorite line in reference to Boris:
"He's the perfect storm of hubris, incompetence, deceit and shit hair!"
Reminds me of someone ...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 776 by RAZD, posted 09-26-2019 10:19 AM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 778 by Heathen, posted 09-27-2019 2:19 AM Diomedes has not replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 784 of 887 (864756)
10-16-2019 9:26 AM


A possible Brexit deal in sight?
Several news papers are stating that a Brexit deal between Boris Johnson's administration and the EU may be on the brink of success.
Newspaper headlines: Johnson 'on brink of Brexit deal' amid late talks - BBC News
At first I thought it might just be smoke and mirrors. But several EU leaders have confirmed that talks are yielding some positive momentum and that a deal may be on the verge of being ratified.
Of course, said deal would still have to pass parliament. But it looks like Boris may have 'some deal' ready for the special session of parliament this weekend.

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 786 of 887 (864813)
10-17-2019 9:04 AM


UK and EU agree to new Brexit deal
quote:
A Brexit deal has been agreed between UK and EU negotiating teams before a meeting of European leaders in Brussels.
Prime Minister Boris Johnson tweeted: "We've got a great new deal that takes back control."
The two sides have been working on the legal text of a deal, but it will still need the approval of both the UK and European parliaments.
Brexit: EU and UK reach deal but DUP refuses support - BBC News
Of course, this would still have to be approved by Parliament. And that is a big 'if' since the DUP has stated they won't support it.

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 790 of 887 (865028)
10-20-2019 10:12 AM
Reply to: Message 789 by AZPaul3
10-19-2019 4:07 PM


Re: Letwin? Let Lose? Let Confuse?
OK, so what the hell just happened? What is this Letwin Amendment?
From what I see this Letwin thing said Parliament would not vote on Boris’ Brexit deal until it discussed and passed the Brexit deal. Say what?
In a nutshell, the Letwin Amendment is an extra 'insurance policy' for the Benn Act, which essentially makes it clear that the Prime Minister has to ask the EU for an extension to the Article 50 deadline. The concern was that they didn't want a vote on the deal prior to the PM asking for the extension because they thought Boris might find a way to circumvent the extension request.
Interestingly, Boris has indeed sent a letter to the EU asking for an extension. But it was unsigned. He then also sent a second letter, which was signed, telling the EU that he thinks an extension is a mistake. So its an interesting case of a world leader basically sending bipolar signals to the EU.
I am actually quite curious what the EU will do at this point. From my point of view, I think it might actually be in their best interest to reject the extension request. That would put all the onus on the UK to either accept the new deal, leave without a deal or cancel Article 50.
Most of what is going right now in the UK is political maneuvering. All political parties are trying to engineer a scenario that they think will be most beneficial for them in the election that is likely to come.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 789 by AZPaul3, posted 10-19-2019 4:07 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 792 of 887 (865150)
10-21-2019 11:33 AM


Speaker Bercow blocks vote on Johnson's Deal
quote:
The Commons Speaker has refused a government request to hold a "yes" or "no" vote on its Brexit deal.
John Bercow said a motion on the deal had already been brought before MPs on Saturday, and it would be "repetitive and disorderly" to debate it again.
Saturday's sitting saw an amended motion nodded through by MPs, which withholds approval of Boris Johnson's deal until it has been passed into law.
The PM agreed a deal with the EU last week, but it must be approved by MPs.
Speaking in the Commons, Mr Bercow said he came to the decision on the basis of a parliamentary convention dating back to 1604.
He cited Parliament's rulebook, Erskine May, which says a motion that is the same "in substance" as a previous one cannot be brought back to the Commons during the course of a single parliamentary session.
Brexit: MPs' vote on deal ruled out by Speaker John Bercow - BBC News
Another setback for Boris.

Replies to this message:
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Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 794 of 887 (865621)
10-28-2019 10:17 AM


EU agrees to Brexit extension until January 31st
quote:
EU leaders have agreed in principle to extend Brexit until 31 January 2020 - meaning the UK will not leave as planned on Thursday.
EU Council President Donald Tusk said it was a "flextension" - meaning the UK could leave before the deadline if a deal was approved by Parliament.
It comes as MPs prepare to vote on proposals by Boris Johnson for an early general election on 12 December.
Brexit: Johnson agrees to Brexit extension - but urges election - BBC News
Looks like The Never Ending Story is going to continue a while longer. And you Brits will likely be having an election shortly.

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


(1)
Message 795 of 887 (866827)
11-16-2019 11:37 AM


Jonathan Pie - UK Election 2019
A couple of good Jonathan Pie rants here:

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 797 of 887 (867732)
12-02-2019 12:13 PM


Boris Johnson Set for 68-Seat Majority According to YouGov Poll
quote:
Boris Johnson’s Conservative Party is on track to win its biggest majority in more than three decades, according to the most hotly anticipated poll of the general election campaign.
The Tories will win a majority of 68 seats in the Dec. 12 election, according to a YouGov poll which used a technique that more closely predicted the 2017 election than standard surveys. Such a majority would allow Johnson to deliver on his promise of getting his Brexit deal through Parliament by Jan. 31, and could also give him some freedom to make compromises in subsequent negotiations with the European Union.
Boris Johnson Set for 68-Seat Majority According to YouGov Poll
I have to admit, that is somewhat surprising. I had actually assumed we might be headed for a hung parliament. But sounds like Labour and Corbyn are not doing a good job at wooing voters.
Edited by Admin, : Fix URL where scraping yielded uninformative text.

Replies to this message:
 Message 798 by vimesey, posted 12-02-2019 12:41 PM Diomedes has not replied
 Message 799 by caffeine, posted 12-02-2019 4:43 PM Diomedes has replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 803 of 887 (867790)
12-03-2019 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 799 by caffeine
12-02-2019 4:43 PM


Re: Boris Johnson Set for 68-Seat Majority According to YouGov Poll
I don't find this surprising at all - this was the obvious and expected outcome.
Brexit supporters in the north and midlands who supported Labour last time in the safe and comforting support that Brexit was going through anyway no longer feel that security. A lot of voters are sick and tired of the whole Brexit mess, and Johnson is in the luxury position of being able to promote a simple 'let's get Brexit done' message; and present himself as the man who's been sensibly fighting for that against an obstinate and out of touch elite. Labour have no simple message to contest with that.
Remember that the Tories only need about 40% of the vote to get a convincing majority. How could this election go any other way?
I honestly don't have enough requisite information on the demographics and voting patterns of the UK. But I guess my surprise was that with all the talk about Brexit and the Tories bungling things during May's tenure as PM, I had assumed that there would have been a shift in sentiment. Clearly that was not the case.
Interestingly, despite the fact that I watch BBC World News all the time here in the USA, their coverage of the UK election was very minimal. Also a surprise. Maybe they adjust what is shown in the USA versus what they televise in the UK. But honestly, it has been mostly crickets with regards to the election or the campaign.
Swinson is a fucking moron.
Once again, very minimal knowledge of Jo Swinson or her platform. I know initially she stated she would 'cancel Brexit'. Maybe not the best verbiage to use. And I think she also said she won't back Corbyn.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 799 by caffeine, posted 12-02-2019 4:43 PM caffeine has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 804 by caffeine, posted 12-04-2019 2:23 PM Diomedes has replied

  
Diomedes
Member
Posts: 995
From: Central Florida, USA
Joined: 09-13-2013


Message 805 of 887 (867967)
12-05-2019 12:01 PM
Reply to: Message 804 by caffeine
12-04-2019 2:23 PM


Re: Boris Johnson Set for 68-Seat Majority According to YouGov Poll
People were indeed disgusted with May's bungling of Brexit, but she's already gone. Johnson has come in presenting himself as the sensible voice of normal people willing to take care of things and 'get Brexit done'. He wants to use this election to say to people 'I just want to get on with things and enact the will of the British people, and look how all these politicians are interfering and making a mess'. Important thing to realise is that most people are just tired of Brexit.
Brexit fatigue is certainly something that has been mentioned by various pundits. Although I thought there might have been enough backlash to warrant another referendum. But clearly at this stage, it appears the majority just want it done and would prefer to move on. Regardless of the risks.
Swinson threw herself into this campaign in the deluded but, as far as I can see, genuine belief that the Liberal Democrats can actually win. This is pretty absurd on its face. The electoral arithmetic has always been against the Liberal Democrats, and I struggle to understand how she could not be intimately familiar with this fact - given her job.
Politicians, generally speaking, have big egos. So I can't say that mindset surprises me. Many people often have a cognitive dissonance regarding how they perceive the world versus what the reality of the situation actually might be. I think social media actually makes this situation even worse since it isolates people in their own bubbles, where their views and opinions are just re-enforced by those that have like-minded views.
Ultimately, it does appear some form of Brexit will now be a done deal. I only wonder if Johnson comes to power with a big majority, will he push for additional concessions on his existing deal or just go with what he has? Being that now he can use the threat of No Deal with more efficacy if he does indeed get a big majority, it might give him confidence into pressing the EU for additional changes to the existing deal. Time will tell.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 804 by caffeine, posted 12-04-2019 2:23 PM caffeine has seen this message but not replied

  
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