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Author Topic:   Testing The Christian Apologists
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6881
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


(1)
Message 421 of 468 (867492)
11-26-2019 8:29 AM
Reply to: Message 419 by Thugpreacha
11-26-2019 5:12 AM


Phat needs to actual learn about things before he talks about them
Weird that your response contained nothing about socialism. Just weir end of times references.
How about you quit making references to and condemning socialism into you understand what it is. Also, there are no major politicians advocating that the US become a socialist state.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 419 by Thugpreacha, posted 11-26-2019 5:12 AM Thugpreacha has not yet responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 422 by jar, posted 11-26-2019 8:46 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
jar
Member
Posts: 31770
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 2.6


(4)
Message 422 of 468 (867493)
11-26-2019 8:46 AM
Reply to: Message 421 by Theodoric
11-26-2019 8:29 AM


Re: Phat needs to actual learn about things before he talks about them
Social Security.
Medicaid.
Medicare.
Public Highways.
Municipal Police and Fire Departments.
Pension Funds.
Public Schools.
Public Libraries.
Bridges.
Municipal Water Systems.
Street Lights.
State Colleges.
The Internet.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios     My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 421 by Theodoric, posted 11-26-2019 8:29 AM Theodoric has not yet responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


(2)
Message 423 of 468 (867499)
11-26-2019 10:47 AM
Reply to: Message 413 by Thugpreacha
11-25-2019 2:50 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
Phat writes:

because many of us believe that Jesus speaks through the scriptures, teaching you as you study.


I keep asking you: If you're getting some kind of "special communication" from Jesus, why doesn't it manifest as the fruits of the Spirit (love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance)?

Phat writes:

There has been many a Bible study where we read passages we have read before and get a fresh interpretation.


Creationists - particularly the young, uneducated ones - call that "thinking outside the box". My standard response is: You shouldn't try to think outside the box until you understand the box. You should be trying to understand the text before you swallow any "fresh" outside-the-box "interpretations" (fairy tales) from apologists.

Phat writes:

I knew that you valued socialism more than the messenger.


So did the messenger.

Phat writes:

Your socialism will break down along with the rest of the world systems when the fossil fuels run out and the oceans rise.


On the contrary, socialism is our only hope.

Phat writes:

Watch Christianity take off and grow exponentially.


Wake up! You're dreaming. Christianity is already struggling. It will go the way of Zeus.

Phat writes:

Then you really will have a lot of nuts and false prophets to deal with, as will we.


We already have you and Faith.

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 413 by Thugpreacha, posted 11-25-2019 2:50 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 429 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:30 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 424 of 468 (867500)
11-26-2019 10:51 AM
Reply to: Message 415 by Thugpreacha
11-25-2019 5:31 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
Phat writes:

From what I understand, its basically collective ownership. Nothing is privately owned.


It's "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". Contribute what you can, get what you need. It's exactly what Jesus taught.

Phat writes:

Some areas of life remain sacred.


Ironic choice of words.

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 415 by Thugpreacha, posted 11-25-2019 5:31 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 426 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:18 PM ringo has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 425 of 468 (867501)
11-26-2019 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 417 by GDR
11-25-2019 6:29 PM


Re: Trying To Explain To jar once again...
GDR writes:

In our own country we have the province that espouses secular humanism, (the BQ leader promoted the ides that the province is secular and gained the most seats), is the province that wants to limit immigration and bans religious symbols.


That's just hypocrisy.

GDR writes:

In contrast it is churches across the country that have been most active in sponsoring refugee families both financially and with the help they need to settle here.


That's mostly because they have the organization.

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 417 by GDR, posted 11-25-2019 6:29 PM GDR has not yet responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13373
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 426 of 468 (867885)
12-04-2019 3:18 PM
Reply to: Message 424 by ringo
11-26-2019 10:51 AM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
ringo writes:

It's "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". Contribute what you can, get what you need. It's exactly what Jesus taught.

Apparently, Ananias and Saphira did not have the ability to let go of literally everything they owned. Many in today's world would have the same issue. Shall they all simply be struck dead for not surrendering everything to..wait for it..not Jesus or His Apostles but to a secular government ran by fallible humans? If that is the conclusion, I'm giving what I can, holding on to what I need, and may God strike me dead if I'm wrong.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 424 by ringo, posted 11-26-2019 10:51 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 427 by ringo, posted 12-04-2019 3:20 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply
 Message 428 by Theodoric, posted 12-04-2019 3:27 PM Thugpreacha has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 427 of 468 (867886)
12-04-2019 3:20 PM
Reply to: Message 426 by Thugpreacha
12-04-2019 3:18 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
Phat writes:

Shall they all simply be struck dead for not surrendering everything to..wait for it..not Jesus or His Apostles but to a secular government ran by fallible humans?


Nobody has said anything about surrendering everything to government.

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 426 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:18 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6881
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 428 of 468 (867888)
12-04-2019 3:27 PM
Reply to: Message 426 by Thugpreacha
12-04-2019 3:18 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
You seem to still have no grasp of the concept of socialism or democratic socialism. Are the same people feeding you your religious crap the ones feeding your utter lack of knowledge of socialism?

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 426 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:18 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 431 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:43 PM Theodoric has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13373
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 429 of 468 (867889)
12-04-2019 3:30 PM
Reply to: Message 423 by ringo
11-26-2019 10:47 AM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
ringo writes:

Christianity is already struggling. It will go the way of Zeus.

On this one, I am quite sure you will be proven wrong. Times will get tougher. People will organize into collectives to survive. Some collectives will be secular and some "spiritual". Within the spiritual groups will be both fake and real Christians. You will know them by their fruits and by their politics.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 423 by ringo, posted 11-26-2019 10:47 AM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 430 by ringo, posted 12-04-2019 3:36 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 430 of 468 (867891)
12-04-2019 3:36 PM
Reply to: Message 429 by Thugpreacha
12-04-2019 3:30 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
Phat writes:

Times will get tougher.


That happens all the time. The Roman Empire collapsed and Jupiter/Zeus is now forgotten.

Phat writes:

People will organize into collectives to survive.


We're already organized into collectives. They're called "nations".

Phat writes:

Within the spiritual groups will be both fake and real Christians. You will know them by their fruits and by their politics.


We already have that too. We can tell the "fake Christians" by their all-caps posts.

"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 429 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:30 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13373
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 431 of 468 (867892)
12-04-2019 3:43 PM
Reply to: Message 428 by Theodoric
12-04-2019 3:27 PM


Re: Wrestling With ringos socialist agendas. .
You are conflating two issues. One is what Jesus would have us do...that one im arguing with ringo exclusively. The other is your charge that I dont understand democratic socialism. I may be guilty of that one, but I can google with the best of them. As I have stated before, I am in favor of a moderate government. Let me keep control over some of my stuff. I'm not afraid to pay taxes, but I am afraid of any sort of collective responsibility which puts me on the hook of taking care of all of the poor impoverished masses globally. To whom much is given, much is required. The US middle class is shrinking precisely because the rest of the world is now interconnected and we were wealthier relative to them so now we are losing more percentage-wise as they escape poverty.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 428 by Theodoric, posted 12-04-2019 3:27 PM Theodoric has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 432 by Theodoric, posted 12-04-2019 4:59 PM Thugpreacha has responded

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 6881
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.3


Message 432 of 468 (867902)
12-04-2019 4:59 PM
Reply to: Message 431 by Thugpreacha
12-04-2019 3:43 PM


You should learn what socialism is before you talk about it
Then quit claiming that socialism has something to do with giving all your stuff to the government.
You are conflating two issues

No I am not. I am pointing out your continual misrepresentation of socialism. You do it repeatedly and knowingly.

but I can google with the best of them

Obviously either you can not or you are too damn lazy. Because you either have not or don't understand what you read.

The US middle class is shrinking precisely because the rest of the world is now interconnected and we were wealthier relative to them so now we are losing more percentage-wise as they escape poverty.

No. We are losing out because the billionaire class is hoarding all the money. 1000 dollars would change the life of most people in third world countries, dont you agree? If you gave 45 million people 1000 dollars of Bill Gates money. He would still have over 45 billion left. Tell me again how the poor people getting a better life is causing you economic pain.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 431 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-04-2019 3:43 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 433 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-05-2019 2:30 PM Theodoric has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13373
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 433 of 468 (867980)
12-05-2019 2:30 PM
Reply to: Message 432 by Theodoric
12-04-2019 4:59 PM


Re: You should learn what socialism is before you talk about it
Tell me again how the poor people getting a better life is causing you economic pain.
It seems pretty simple to me. The rich have manipulated the system so that they keep their money and leave the responsibility of helping the poor on the middle class. My point is that socialism will never be implemented as long as the wealthy keep their power. But when I point this out to ringo, he seems to suggest that if the "cushy" middle class sacrificed more, the poor would be better off and it would be no big deal for the middle to get knocked down a rung or two. I disagree.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 432 by Theodoric, posted 12-04-2019 4:59 PM Theodoric has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 434 by ringo, posted 12-05-2019 2:40 PM Thugpreacha has responded
 Message 437 by Theodoric, posted 12-05-2019 4:41 PM Thugpreacha has responded

  
ringo
Member
Posts: 17665
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 434 of 468 (867982)
12-05-2019 2:40 PM
Reply to: Message 433 by Thugpreacha
12-05-2019 2:30 PM


Re: You should learn what socialism is before you talk about it
Phat writes:

My point is that socialism will never be implemented as long as the wealthy keep their power. But when I point this out to ringo, he seems to suggest that if the "cushy" middle class sacrificed more, the poor would be better off and it would be no big deal for the middle to get knocked down a rung or two.


I don't necessarily advocate "implementing socialism". I advocate being a decent human being, which is also what Jesus advocated. Do what needs doing even if it means giving up that second ivory back-scratcher.

But what you're missing is that pulling up the poor benefits everybody. The poor get richer and pay more taxes, which reduces your tax burden.


"If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you...."
-- Rudyard Kipling

This message is a reply to:
 Message 433 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-05-2019 2:30 PM Thugpreacha has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 435 by Thugpreacha, posted 12-05-2019 2:52 PM ringo has responded

  
Thugpreacha
Member
Posts: 13373
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 435 of 468 (867985)
12-05-2019 2:52 PM
Reply to: Message 434 by ringo
12-05-2019 2:40 PM


Re: You should learn what socialism is before you talk about it
OK, that's a decent argument. I likely misunderstand socialism because I see it in the microcosm of union politics. If too many new people get hired, the union benefits because of more union dues, the company benefits because of cheaper labor, but the senior union members then have to share their hours and end up taking home less.

Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
~"We, humans, are engaged in an ongoing war of ideologies. I see it in this microcosm of EvC Forum just as I see it in the governments and attitudes of people throughout the world. Take your pick: Oppression or Seduction .
"~Thugpreacha

You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo

“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”
? R.C. Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith


This message is a reply to:
 Message 434 by ringo, posted 12-05-2019 2:40 PM ringo has responded

Replies to this message:
 Message 436 by ringo, posted 12-05-2019 3:12 PM Thugpreacha has acknowledged this reply

  
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