Testing The Christian Apologists

So we agree that regardless of belief, 'all you need is love. Given that all you need is love, the argument is not that god is redundant, it's that religion is redundant - including Christianity.

It's not about me!!! It's about what your book says. GDR tells us that Jesus tells us love is all you need, therefore relious belief is redundant. That's not an argument, that's just you saying something you want to be true. Uh? It's not about me. Please follow the argument.

Yes, by ignoring what it says and believing what you want to believe instead. There's nothing scientific or philosophical in pointing out what Jesus says in your book. You're more than a little confused - this is not my thread.

Hey Phat, does free will exist in heaven?

It's beyond time you and GDR stopped pretending you speak factually about stuff you're actually clueless about.
​
Re-read what you've written, it would look embarrassing in a Tolkien novel. Exactly. No-one is an expert on heaven so you just make it up.But my question was about free will. Does it exist in heaven? Am I free covet my neighbouring angel's ox there?You see, you grant freewill some sort of totemic importance here which appears to evaporate once you enter the pearly gates. I can't see that paradise includes crime because crime requires a victim and suffering so how come it's necessary to have free will here?
​ Double standards perhaps?

I have no idea how this more than usually bizarre statement is supposed to help your case. It's certainly true that without 'sicko queer predators in the clergy' these revolting offences wouldn't have happened.But of course they did. And they did it on a global scale supported by a corrupt institution devoted to promoting its own interests ahead of those of the communities it pretends to protect.It's not new, it's very old; it's institutionalised and it hasn't changed. For as long as people like you try to downplay the extent of the abuse and corruption it will continue.“Sexual abuse in the Catholic Church has been reported as far back as the 11th century, when Peter Damian wrote the treatise Liber Gomorrhianus against such abuses and others. In the late 15th century, Katharina von Zimmern and her sister were removed from their abbey to live in their family's house for a while partly because the young girls were molested by priests.[30]In 1531, Martin Luther claimed that Pope Leo X had vetoed a measure that cardinals should restrict the number of boys they kept for their pleasure, "otherwise it would have been spread throughout the world how openly and shamelessly the Pope and the cardinals in Rome practice sodomy."[31]”Catholic Church sexual abuse cases - WikipediaHere in the Uk we had an independent inquiry which “ examines the extent of institutional failings by the Roman Catholic Church in England and Wales to protect children from sexual abuse and examines the Church’s current safeguarding regime. It draws on evidence from the Inquiry’s three case studies on Ampleforth and Downside Abbeys and their respective schools, Ealing Abbey and St Benedict’s School, and the Archdiocese of Birmingham.”The Vatican refused to help. Nothing has changed. The Holy SeeIn 2018 and 2019, the Inquiry asked the Apostolic Nuncio (the Holy See’s ambassador to the United Kingdom) and the Holy See for information relevant to both the public hearing on Ealing Abbey and St Benedict’s School and the final hearing on the Roman Catholic Church, held in late 2019. The Holy See is a foreign state and the Apostolic Nuncio’s diplomatic status means that neither the institution nor the individual can be compelled to provide a statement to the Inquiry or to give evidence. Despite efforts by the Inquiry, very limited information was forthcoming. Much of the information that was provided was already in the public domain. After several months of correspondence, the Holy See belatedly confirmed it would not provide a witness statement. This response appears to be at odds with the May 2019 Papal pronouncements from Rome in which Pope Francis asserted that there needed to be “concrete and effective actions that involve everyone in the Church” regarding its approach to child sexual abuse.[18]The Holy See’s limited response on this matter manifestly did not demonstrate a commitment to taking action. Their lack of cooperation passes understanding.”Just a moment...I suggest you read it.

Ok, let's forget the 16th century, care to comment on the 20th century? Are you Laughing Out Loud about those child sex abuses too?

‘Give me a child till he is seven years old and I will show you the man.’St Ignatius Loyola, the founder of the Jesuit Brotherhood

So you've finally gone full dick-head fundamentalist nutter. Does it feel nice to be out?

Same shit different day.You just can't conceive of the idea that people that don't live inside you fantasies don't think of things the way you do can you?None of this makes sense. It's just more of your half-understood pseudo-psychological religious waffle.

wtf are you talking about? There is no such thing as a 'deeper truth' and the only thing I surrender to is a nice scotch.Did you even start that thinking skills course?

You gave up weeks ago. You have no intention of finishing it.

Life is its own meaning. If you put aside your fantasies, you might discover it.

I see the question, I don't see the answer?