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Author Topic:   Covid-19 and religion.
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 5 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


(1)
Message 31 of 143 (872773)
03-03-2020 6:45 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Phat
03-03-2020 3:40 PM


Re: Stocking up
Now we’ll have a rubbing alcohol shortage! Thanks, Oregonian! At least I have some gin.....

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 Message 28 by Phat, posted 03-03-2020 3:40 PM Phat has seen this message

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6737
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 32 of 143 (872929)
03-06-2020 11:39 PM


Hand Sanitizers
Coragyps, Your gin may or may not work.

Hot button ... hand sanitizers.

There are two kinds in the popular vernacular. One works on COVID-19, the other doesn't. And sooo many people get the two confused and refuse to recognize the difference.

One type of hand sanitizer is antibacterial, the other is alcohol-based.

COVID-19 is a virus. Antibacterial hand sanitizers WILL NOT work on viruses. Alcohol-based hand sanitizers WILL work on both bacterias and viruses.

The antibacterials popular on the US market today usually contain Benzalkonium Chloride. It is an antibiotic that breaks down the cell wall (peptidoglycan) of a bacterium but HAS NO effect on the protein shell of a virus.

Alcohol-based hand sanitizers are usually Ethyl Alcohol and dissolve both the peptidoglycan of bacterium and the protein shell of a virus IF the alcohol concentration is 70% or better.

If your fight against COVID-19 involves an antibacterial you are wasting your money.

*** Having said that ... just the act of washing your hands (with or without an antibacterial) IS effective against viruses and bacteria as it, if done properly, will get most of the bugs off your hands. Just any old soap and plenty of water will do. When you can't wash you hands an alcohol-based sanitizer is next best. Antibacterials are just a waste and are friggin dangerous.

Wash your hands, people! And keep your fingers out of your nose!

BTW, a 100% alcohol base IS LESS effective than a 70% alcohol solution because the presence of water serves to increase the dissolving power of the alcohol against the proteins and peptides of both bacteria and virus.

So, Coragyps, check you gin for alcohol-by-volume. If it's not 70% or better then it is best to drink the gin before/after/while you wash your hands. Much better outcome for both your hands and your head.

BTW2, antibacterial cleaning products are damn dangerous and should be banned the world over. Bacteria are smarter than we are and have evolved, and will continue to evolve, defenses against ANY type of antibiotic we throw at them. The ubiquitous use of antibacterials in daily cleaning products just serves to hasten the evolution of the super-bugs that we are now seeing around the world.

Let your doctor handle the antibiotics. Keep them out of your soaps and wipes and in their prescription-pill bottles where they belong.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.

Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.


Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by caffeine, posted 03-07-2020 3:27 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
caffeine
Member (Idle past 295 days)
Posts: 1800
From: Prague, Czech Republic
Joined: 10-22-2008


Message 33 of 143 (872931)
03-07-2020 3:27 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by AZPaul3
03-06-2020 11:39 PM


Re: Hand Sanitizers
COVID-19 is a virus. Antibacterial hand sanitizers WILL NOT work on viruses. Alcohol-based hand sanitizers WILL work on both bacterias and viruses.

Well, most bacteria and viruses. Viruses which lack a lipid envelope are quite resilient in the face of alcohol based sanitisers; as are some bacteria when they form resting spores.

This is irrelevant as regards coronavirus, I'm just nitpicking as usual.


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AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 6737
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.9


Message 34 of 143 (872932)
03-07-2020 4:57 AM
Reply to: Message 33 by caffeine
03-07-2020 3:27 AM


Re: Hand Sanitizers
Nitpick is good when it is accurate. Nitpick away, my man.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
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Phat
Member
Posts: 15992
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 35 of 143 (873053)
03-09-2020 10:40 AM
Reply to: Message 34 by AZPaul3
03-07-2020 4:57 AM


Cashing Out On Sanitizers
Today, the markets closed due to a massive selloff. On the bright side, had we bought stock in Clorox we would have had an 11% gain in the past couple of months.

“The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.”Calvin Coolidge
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith

- You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.
Anne Lamott
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.~Andre Gide

This message is a reply to:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 675 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 36 of 143 (873081)
03-09-2020 2:48 PM


In other news ...
AIPAC: Conference guests may have been exposed to COVID-19

quote:
March 5 (UPI) -- The American Israel Public Affairs Committee said attendees to its policy conference earlier this week, including U.S. lawmakers, may have come into contact with a person infected with COVID-19.

In a statement published Wednesday night on Twitter, AIPAC said a group from New York came into contact with a person confirmed to be infected with the coronavirus prior to attending the conference. The person infected did not, however, attend the Washington, D.C., conference, which ran from Sunday to Tuesday, the Israel lobbying group said.


and

Several lawmakers had contact with man at CPAC who got virus

quote:
WASHINGTON (AP) — The Capitol's attending physician said Monday that “several” members of Congress had contact with a person who attended a recent political conference and who subsequently developed COVID-19, the illness caused by the new coronavirus. They “remain in good health,” the physician's office said.

In a note to lawmakers, the attending physician's office said the ill individual had recalled “specific names of people he had contact with during the meeting.”

“Several of these individuals, Members of the Congress, were identified and were contacted on the evening of March 7” by the physician's office, the note said.

Their symptoms were reviewed, and the individuals were considered to be at “low risk” of contracting the disease, the statement said. It said all of the lawmakers the physician's office was monitoring “remain in good health.”

On Sunday, two members of Congress, Sen. Ted Cruz and Rep. Paul Gosar, said they are isolating themselves after determining they had contact with the person at the conference.


Watch this space ...

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
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... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
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Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Phat, posted 03-09-2020 3:38 PM RAZD has seen this message

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 15992
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 37 of 143 (873083)
03-09-2020 3:38 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by RAZD
03-09-2020 2:48 PM


US Update:

quote:
The number of people with the coronavirus in the U.S. more than doubled over the weekend, from 260 on Friday to more than 600 on Monday, causing school closures and other disruptions to daily life as the virus spread to new parts of the country.

The virus is now being reported in 36 states, with Louisiana Gov. John Bel Edwards announcing his state's first case on Monday. At least two cases are also present in Washington, D.C.

Financial markets have been rattled by the outbreak and a shakeup in the oil market, and trading on the New York Stock Exchange was halted for 15 minutes Monday morning when the S&P 500 index plummeted 7% just minutes after the open of business.

Worldwide, there are more than 110,000 COVID-19 cases, including more than 7,000 in South Korea, Italy and Iran, according to a dashboard created by the Johns Hopkins Whiting School of Engineering. France, Germany and Spain are now reporting more than 1,000 cases each.(...)
Of those who are exposed to the coronavirus, "there's a good chance many will become sick,"{...)
A recent World Health Organization report on more than 70,000 cases in China found that 80% of all COVID-19 cases were mild to moderate, with people over 60 being the most likely to develop a serious case.

"This virus is capable of spreading easily and sustainably from person to person," Messonnier said.



“The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.”Calvin Coolidge
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
“As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.”-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith

- You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.
Anne Lamott
Believe those who are seeking the truth. Doubt those who find it.~Andre Gide

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by RAZD, posted 03-09-2020 2:48 PM RAZD has seen this message

  
AnswersInGenitals
Member
Posts: 671
Joined: 07-20-2006
Member Rating: 3.5


(1)
Message 38 of 143 (873141)
03-10-2020 2:17 PM


Will Covid-19 save lives?
In 1989 the San Francisco bay area was hit with the Loma Prieta earthquake. 55 people were directly killed by the earthquake including several killed by the collapse of an elevated freeway. But the total death toll for that and that following few weeks was actually significantly reduced. This was due to reduced driving, people being more attentive to their activities, and the increased police presence (in part to counter any looting that might occur in evacuated areas) as well as reduced crime overall.

I’m guessing we’ll see the same effect occurring with the Covid-19, and maybe to an even greater extent. Reduced travel, and people avoiding outdoor activity should significantly reduce opportunities for accidents and other harmful events. Please don’t misunderstand me: I’m not trying to find a silver lining or anything positive about this pandemic. The financial and societal impacts are horrific and will be long lasting. I am just pointing out some facts that are rarely mentioned.


  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 715 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 39 of 143 (873143)
03-10-2020 2:41 PM


Inadequate containment of the virus
I happened to hear one hour of one of my conservative radio talk shows last night, Michael Savage, who was talking about how the response to this virus was inept in his opinion and if he was czar all traffic from China would have been immediately stopped dead for one thing, and I assume from all other countries that showed an outbreak.

He specifically addressed the handling of the cruise ship that had been sitting off the coast of San Francisco because of cases of the virus on board, and how they decided to bring it to Oakland and take the people to four military bases to be quarantined.

He said he had studied epidemics and written about them many years ago and that the only way to deal with them is absolute prevention of interaction with the main population of the country. ALL travel to and from affected countries is to be stopped dead immediately. The way he would deal with the cruise ship would be to dock it at Oakland as they did, but let absolutely no one leave. He said the ship should be requisitioned by the government as in a state of emergency, which is something they did in WWII I think he said, and turned into a hospital ship. Medical personnel, adequately suited up to protect themselves, should enter the ship to take care of the sick, and hospital gear should be brought in, but nobody should be allowed to leave until there was no more sign of the disease on board. Food of course would also be delivered to the ship.

He said it was an extremely bad decision to move the people to military bases because that means that military people will become infected and the epidemic will spread among them.

So he agreed with Trump's wanting the cruise ship to be completely isolated, and that it should have been enforced until all the sickness was gone. The decision to move people to military bases was made by I think the CDC and is only going to spread the disease first through the military and then through the country.

He mentioned the HIV outbreak in San Francisco a few decades ago and how they kept lagging about closing the bath houses which were a major source of the problem, a political misjudgment. When the bath houses were finally closed the epidemic started to wane, but many died anyway.

I think he's right, there shouldn't be any waffling, ALL ways the virus could get into the country should have been stopped dead in their tracks immediately. Trump acted sooner than many Presidents might have by his travel ban on January 31st, and his opinion that the cruise ship should be quarantined was right. Political waffling is what may allow the virus to spread throughout the country, which was not necessary if strict measures to contain it were followed.

Edited by Faith, : No reason given.


Replies to this message:
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vimesey
Member
Posts: 1316
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 40 of 143 (873145)
03-10-2020 2:49 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Faith
03-10-2020 2:41 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
But on the plus side, now that the virus is in the States, Trump is encouraging everyone to go to work, even if they’re ill. So that’s alright.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

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Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 41 of 143 (873168)
03-10-2020 4:51 PM
Reply to: Message 40 by vimesey
03-10-2020 2:49 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
...Trump is encouraging everyone to go to work....

Sad thing is, Trump doesn't need to do any encouraging. There is no mandatory guaranteed sick leave in this country. I will absolutely say that there are going to be a lot of people working minimum wage jobs who'll get sick but decide the rent still needs to be paid and the kids need groceries and will go on into work.


The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool. -- Richard Feynman

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 715 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 42 of 143 (873169)
03-10-2020 4:56 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Chiroptera
03-10-2020 4:51 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
All of which would be irrelevant if measures had been taken to keep the virus out of the country.

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Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by dwise1, posted 03-10-2020 5:13 PM Faith has replied
 Message 47 by frako, posted 03-10-2020 9:22 PM Faith has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 675 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 43 of 143 (873170)
03-10-2020 5:01 PM
Reply to: Message 39 by Faith
03-10-2020 2:41 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
... He said the ship should be requisitioned by the government as in a state of emergency, which is something they did in WWII I think he said, and turned into a hospital ship. Medical personnel, adequately suited up to protect themselves, should enter the ship to take care of the sick, and hospital gear should be brought in, but nobody should be allowed to leave until there was no more sign of the disease on board. Food of course would also be delivered to the ship.

A cruise ship is not designed for hospital usage. The air ventilation/AC/heating ducts (HVAC) run from room to room rather than isolated ducts for each room. The walls are constructed with no standard for zero air leakage between them.

The argument that base personnel would be infected is spurious, as these are the same people that would be sent on board for any conversion work, for providing food and for providing the medics.

He's just another blowhard who thinks that he knows enough to pretend to be an authority. Trump shut down travel between China and US but left Japan, Korea, etc travel go ahead.

Let the CDC make the appropriate decisions on how to handle the virus and keep politicians and blowhards out of it.

Enjoy


we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel•American•Zen•Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 39 by Faith, posted 03-10-2020 2:41 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 54 by Faith, posted 03-11-2020 8:11 AM RAZD has replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5112
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 44 of 143 (873171)
03-10-2020 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 42 by Faith
03-10-2020 4:56 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
Basic contingency planning, which is endemic in the military.

First level is Operational Risk Management (ORM). You figure what could possibly go wrong and you plan for it (eg, at a unit athletic event how to keep everybody properly hydrated and how to get EMT out there when needed).

Second level goes beyond that.

What is needed is complete truthfulness at the highest levels. Trump is not providing that. In his desperation to preserve the stock market (ie, the fake economy) he is spreading lies which will cost even more lifes.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 42 by Faith, posted 03-10-2020 4:56 PM Faith has replied

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vimesey
Member
Posts: 1316
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011
Member Rating: 3.8


Message 45 of 143 (873173)
03-10-2020 5:36 PM
Reply to: Message 41 by Chiroptera
03-10-2020 4:51 PM


Re: Inadequate containment of the virus
That is really sad. It echoes this interesting commentary piece on the BBC website: A problem unlike any Donald Trump has faced

Over here, even Boris has extended people’s entitlement to sick pay when they get hit by the virus. I wonder if that makes Boris a communist in Faith’s eyes...


Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
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