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Author Topic:   Coronavirus and Pandemics
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(1)
Message 46 of 955 (873623)
03-17-2020 6:37 PM
Reply to: Message 28 by Percy
03-17-2020 11:06 AM


Re: A Question About Masks
Thanks for the responses about mask use.
Just saw Opinion | Why Telling People They Don’t Need Masks Backfired - The New York Times in today's New York Times:
quote:
Third, of course masks work maybe not perfectly and not all to the same degree, but they provide some protection. Their use has always been advised as part of the standard response to being around infected people, especially for people who may be vulnerable. World Health Organization officials wear masks during their news briefings. That was the reason I had bought a few in early January I had been conducting research in Hong Kong, which has a lot of contact with mainland China, and expected to go back. I had studied and taught about the sociology of pandemics and knew from the SARS experience in 2003 that health officials in many high-risk Asian countries had advised wearing masks.
The link about masks being advised around infected people is to a CDC recommendation about masks: Interim Recommendations for Facemask and Respirator Use to Reduce 2009 Influenza A (H1N1) Virus Transmission. Summarizing, the CDC recommends against them unless you're caring for known, probable or suspected infected people.
The Times opinion writer is questioning the logic of this recommendation. Restating the author's logic, if it's advisable to wear a mask even when caring for someone who is only suspected of being infected because of their symptoms, why isn't it also advisable when around people who you have no idea whether they have symptoms or not? How can you know you won't round the corner of an aisle in the grocery store just as an irresponsible and symptomatic person begins coughing? Avoiding possible infection by a virus with a 2% or 3% mortality rate seems to strongly encourage mask use.
I haven't been around smokers in years, but I recall how the cigarette smoke people exhale spreads out into the room. Can anyone truthfully say they've ever been in the presence of a smoker and not been able to smell the cigarette smoke? Infected people's exhalations spread out in the exact same way. If it's possible that someone in your vicinity is infected (my state has 13 known cases so far), doesn't it make sense to wear a mask?
Here's an image from February of Dr. Bruce Aylward, senior WHO adviser, explaining the China epidemic:
It doesn't seem as if the CDC and the WHO are on the same page regarding masks.
One more thing, and I think someone already mentioned this. Yes, you need an N95 rated mask or higher to stop viruses. They're really small. But I don't think viruses are often free-floating in the air. I think they're usually in small liquid globules that can easily be blocked by even a poor mask.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


(1)
Message 47 of 955 (873624)
03-17-2020 6:40 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Faith
03-17-2020 5:56 PM


Re: Advice for dealing with the virus, and a possible antiviral aid?
Yes, that looks pretty accurate. But don’t confuse soap with fat: soap was fat, but has been chemically broken into pieces by the action of, typically, something like lye (sodium hydroxide). The original fat is not an amphiphile, so you can’t wash your hands too effectively with it - it won’t rinse off. Soap attaches to fatty materials, but being amphiphilic, it will still go into water and wash off your skin.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by Faith, posted 03-17-2020 5:56 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 48 of 955 (873626)
03-17-2020 6:45 PM
Reply to: Message 47 by Coragyps
03-17-2020 6:40 PM


Re: Advice for dealing with the virus, and a possible antiviral aid?
Disappointing then but maybe some other information will restore my hope.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 47 by Coragyps, posted 03-17-2020 6:40 PM Coragyps has not replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 49 of 955 (873627)
03-17-2020 6:46 PM
Reply to: Message 46 by Percy
03-17-2020 6:37 PM


Re: A Question About Masks
And whatever your view on masks, shop around a bit. I really can’t believe that $65.00 is a fair price on an anti-viral mask, even if the ads on the Internet offer them for that.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 50 of 955 (873632)
03-17-2020 7:55 PM
Reply to: Message 47 by Coragyps
03-17-2020 6:40 PM


Coconut oil as an antiviral
But of course its merely being a fat wouldn't make it antiviral or any fat would do, so I looked for the reason they claim antiviral properties for it and found this article about coconut oil as an immunity booster:
Coconut is actually comprised of 50 percent lauric acid, which the body converts to monolaurin, an antiviral agent that fights off a variety of pathogens and viruses. Many of the viruses and pathogens coconut oil has been found to prevent include the following: herpes, influenza, cytomegalovirus, HIV, listeria monocytogenes, helicobacter pylori, and harmful protozoa such as giardia lamblia. ... coconut oil is truly a wonderful tool to keep in your immunity kit of wellness as a more natural solution. Though it hasn’t been found to be a proven cure for any disease, the antiviral properties in coconut oil have been through extensive research.
Worth keeping around as it says but not very encouraging as a strong preventative, especially since you wouldn't want to eat much of it anyway.
It may be more useful as a topical aid for seborrhea and candida rash. Oh and some antiviral usefulness on the skin too.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 51 of 955 (873635)
03-17-2020 8:55 PM


A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
Interesting. I got the Kindle booklet by Michael Savage titled "Dieases Without Borders" because it's about boosting immunity against viruses among other diseases. It was written during the Obama administration and I'm reading the first chapter which blasts Obama for his "open borders" policy which is bringing back old diseases we'd eradicated, and bringing in new diseases, all because of an influx of people who are not being subjected to any kind of testing or restrictions.
So here we're in the Trump administration and the same Leftist mentality that was hard at work undermining the nation under Obama is resisting Trump's attempts to close the border and protect Americans. Such wonderful insanity we are enduring from the Left, and we only get objections to it from the Right. Amazing. And you all don't think the Left is out to destroy the nation?
So I'm going to read this book to find out if he has any advice that might improve our resistance to this pandemic.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Replies to this message:
 Message 52 by Coragyps, posted 03-17-2020 9:12 PM Faith has replied
 Message 56 by Percy, posted 03-18-2020 8:21 AM Faith has replied
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Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


(2)
Message 52 of 955 (873636)
03-17-2020 9:12 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by Faith
03-17-2020 8:55 PM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
The wisdom of Michael Savage. That’ll be a pretty damn short book.
Oh, by the way, I found a real scientific article that documents the monolaurin content of mother’s milk and its antibacterial properties. Human mommies produce much more than cow mommies do.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by Faith, posted 03-17-2020 8:55 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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vimesey
Member
Posts: 1398
From: Birmingham, England
Joined: 09-21-2011


(1)
Message 53 of 955 (873640)
03-18-2020 2:21 AM
Reply to: Message 52 by Coragyps
03-17-2020 9:12 PM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
I hadn’t heard of Michael Savage before, so I looked him up.
I read he said this:
Now, the illness du jour is autism. You know what autism is? I'll tell you what autism is. In 99 percent of the cases, it's a brat who hasn't been told to cut the act out. That's what autism is. What do you mean they scream and they're silent? They don't have a father around to tell them, "Don't act like a moron. You'll get nowhere in life. Stop acting like a putz. Straighten up. Act like a man. Don't sit there crying and screaming, idiot.
My stepson is autistic. I know a number of other autistic children and adults and have come to learn something of the condition.
Michael Savage is a piece of shit.

Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?

This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 54 of 955 (873641)
03-18-2020 2:41 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by vimesey
03-18-2020 2:21 AM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
Well, that was not something to recommend him, I'll agree with you about that. I'd hever heard him say that myself. I sometimes find him hard to listen to, he can be all over the map with his opinions, on the one hand he can say something brilliant, on the other so off the wall I have to turn off the radio. He gets on rants against other talk show hosts which I can't stand. But when I think I'm going to have to completely write him off he comes along and says something important. I certainly agree with him about what Obama did. He's a crackpot and he's a genius, and quite a character. He drives me crazy but I can never completely give up on him.
This is a small book, only cost $3 and he did study nutrition and epidemiology so I'm hoping it has some good suggestions.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 55 of 955 (873642)
03-18-2020 2:47 AM
Reply to: Message 52 by Coragyps
03-17-2020 9:12 PM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
Let me know if you find something about the monolaurin antiviral properties of coconut oil.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by Coragyps, posted 03-17-2020 9:12 PM Coragyps has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(1)
Message 56 of 955 (873648)
03-18-2020 8:21 AM
Reply to: Message 51 by Faith
03-17-2020 8:55 PM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
You have a unique talent for identifying and promoting sources of misinformation.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 51 by Faith, posted 03-17-2020 8:55 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 58 by Faith, posted 03-18-2020 1:33 PM Percy has replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 57 of 955 (873653)
03-18-2020 9:49 AM


We have always been at war with Eurasia
From the New York Times:
Trump Now Claims He Always Knew the Coronavirus Would Be a Pandemic
For weeks, President Trump has minimized the coronavirus, mocked concern about it and treated the risk from it cavalierly. On Tuesday he took to the White House lectern and made a remarkable assertion: He knew it was a pandemic all along.
'Course that'll work well with his cult: if Trump says he knew it was serious all along, then by god once again he's shown himself to be the Wise and Benevolent Leader.
In a related vein:
From the Guardian:
'We have a responsibility': Fox News declares coronavirus a crisis in abrupt U-turn
Fox News, the rightwing channel that is a favorite of Donald Trump and conservatives across the US, spent the first weeks of the Covid-19 outbreak downplaying the threat of the virus.
Hosts often claimed that those warning of the danger were panic pushers, or engaged in mass hysteria. Some on Fox News even claimed it was all an effort to try to bring down the president.
But in recent days Fox News has performed an abrupt U-turn, and declared coronavirus a crisis.
According to the article, Tucker Carlson was one of the few hosts to try to treat coronavirus with the seriousness it deserved.

But [Frederick] Douglass was not gone; he was merely dead. -- David W. Blight

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 58 of 955 (873663)
03-18-2020 1:33 PM
Reply to: Message 56 by Percy
03-18-2020 8:21 AM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
What I quoted from the book was certainly not misinformation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 56 by Percy, posted 03-18-2020 8:21 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
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LamarkNewAge
Member (Idle past 737 days)
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 59 of 955 (873669)
03-18-2020 2:36 PM
Reply to: Message 51 by Faith
03-17-2020 8:55 PM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
Michael Savage also says that vitamin pills only work when you only take one or a few specific targeted ones. Multi vitamins or multiple supplements don't get absorbed.
Reminds me that I really need to order algae based Omega 3 fat pills. Been going years without any omega 3 in my system.
We all have to choose our targets wisely.

This message is a reply to:
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LamarkNewAge
Member (Idle past 737 days)
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 60 of 955 (873671)
03-18-2020 2:46 PM
Reply to: Message 53 by vimesey
03-18-2020 2:21 AM


Re: A Small Book about Boosting Immunity
Savage was using hyperbole when he said 99 percent.
He is concerned about the right things medically most of the time but other times he goes too far.
He is one of the few that is concerned about organ damage caused by anti psychotics and the reckless disregard psychiatrists routinely show toward the mentally ill. Savage has spoken against discrimination against the mentally ill like few ever will.
The fact is that many autistic people fall into a trap of becoming what society imposes on them. I feel like this is an issue where everything can be easily taken out of context no matter what is said. Savage was wrong at times and especially some soundbites but he is the best radio host on mental illness issues there is.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by vimesey, posted 03-18-2020 2:21 AM vimesey has replied

Replies to this message:
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