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Author Topic:   NvC-1: What is the premise of Naturalism in Biology?
JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(2)
Message 9 of 452 (875785)
05-06-2020 9:05 AM


"I had no need of that hypothesis" - Pierre-Simon Laplace

If and when when we observe some phenomenon that is not or we have reason to believe cannot be explained in naturalistic terms we will look for something else. Until then look for something else. Until then Occa Razor excludes non-naturslistc explanations.

But, of course, positing an all-powerful entity that can and does interfere with our Universe in any manner at any time for unknown reasons makes it impossible to carry out any scientific investigation. The Universe might completely change, making any previous observations invalid in the present. What7would you say to Pons and Fleischmann if they said cold fusion used to work but God intervened and it no longer works?

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


  
JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 24 of 452 (875814)
05-06-2020 7:04 PM
Reply to: Message 17 by Richard L. Wang
05-06-2020 4:07 PM


Re: The DN’s premise – Life consists of matter only
Not a premise.

A strong conclusion from centuries of scientific observation. Tentatively held, as are all scientific conclusions, but no evidence yet that we should change that.

You're sounding more like a preacher than a scientist, and you are obviously unfamiliar with scientific practice or findings. FWIW.


This message is a reply to:
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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 37 of 452 (875843)
05-07-2020 5:38 PM
Reply to: Message 30 by Richard L. Wang
05-07-2020 4:21 PM


Re: Re – 19(PaulK): DN strictly controls science and education
Can one teach creationism in classrooms of public schools?

In each of several legal cases creationism has been found to be religion, and may not be taught in public schools.

Can one publish creationism papers on scientific journals?

Yes, if it meets the published standards of the journal and passes peer review.

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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 38 of 452 (875844)
05-07-2020 5:39 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by Richard L. Wang
05-07-2020 4:27 PM


Re: The DN’s premise (continued 1)
The first point that life consists only of matter is the fundamental premise of Darwinian-Naturalism.

Nope. You're a pretty slow learner.

This message is a reply to:
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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 49 of 452 (875886)
05-08-2020 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Richard L. Wang
05-08-2020 4:08 PM


Re: Re – 28/40(Stile) & 24(JonF)&36(Tangle)&39(AZPaul3)
So you have no argument for your claim that it's a central axiom?

Didn't think so.


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JonF
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Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(1)
Message 50 of 452 (875887)
05-08-2020 7:51 PM
Reply to: Message 45 by Richard L. Wang
05-08-2020 4:16 PM


Re: The DN’s premise (continued 2)
Start from the end of my post 32: DN can be described as
1. Life consists only of matter;
2. Information either supervenes upon the physical or can be reduced to a physical account;
3. Life operates by the laws of physics;
4. No supernatural power, no God.

Nope. You are a very slow learner. And you are making it very obvious you have no evidence for your claims. I.e. you're a bog-standard creationist.

If the second point is correct...

It's meaningless without an operational definition of whatever you mean by "information". Pony one up.

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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


(2)
Message 60 of 452 (875946)
05-10-2020 10:51 AM


In his ignorance he doesn't know that evolution theory has moved significantly beyond neo-Darwinism. Neutral theory for example.

Of course creationists usually don't even know about neo-Darwinism.


  
JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 71 of 452 (875969)
05-10-2020 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by Richard L. Wang
05-10-2020 3:33 PM


Re: Re – Tangle(56&58&61): Let’s move on. Warning: I set up a trap ahead
Dupe.

Edited by JonF, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 72 of 452 (875970)
05-10-2020 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 67 by Richard L. Wang
05-10-2020 3:33 PM


Re: Re – Tangle(56&58&61): Let’s move on. Warning: I set up a trap ahead
Start with an operational definition of your "information".

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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 77 of 452 (875976)
05-10-2020 5:05 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by Richard L. Wang
05-10-2020 4:48 PM


Re: Re-GDR(64): The opposite of materialism is idealism, I don’t …
I prefer to use Naturalism, which states that all natural phenomena occur naturally and are driven by the natural forces and natural laws

What you prefer doesn't matter. What is reality does.

Reality is that science doesn't use naturalism as you define it, so any argument you make based on your definition of naturalism is fatally flawed. The appropriate term is "methodological naturalism".

But you have been told many times why your definition isn't appropriate for this discussion. With no reaction from you.

Are you really incapable of learning?


This message is a reply to:
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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 93 of 452 (876031)
05-11-2020 9:15 PM
Reply to: Message 92 by GDR
05-11-2020 8:34 PM


Re: Re – Tangle(56&58&61): Let’s move on. Warning: I set up a trap ahead
And, since Percy closed his second thread proposal and gently chastised him here, he posted his third thread proposal.

Really slow learner.


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JonF
Member
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 150 of 452 (876450)
05-20-2020 9:51 AM
Reply to: Message 149 by Richard L. Wang
05-20-2020 9:27 AM


Re: Re-Admin(114): Still, we need a new topic and NvC-3 is a good topic
This is “life consists of matter and information”.

Meaningless until you provide an operational definition of your "information".

This message is a reply to:
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