Should we teach both evolution and religion in school?

I have no doubt that "dad" will never return. He has done his "religious duty", misguided though it may be. Here it is encapsulated:

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Transcribed from images posted by Ed Babinski on Facebook
Images taken from Quora

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Why do people get angry when I try to share the word of God with them? I only do it because I care about them deeply and don't want them to end up in hell. I feel like some people avoid me because of this. Is there any way to get through to them?

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by Doug Robertson, studied at University of Maine
Updated Dec 11 2018

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The entire process is not what you think it is.

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It is specifically designed to be uncomfortable for the other person because it isn't about converting them to your religion. It is about manipulating you so you can't leave yours.

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If this tactic was about converting people it would be considered a horrible failure. It recruits almost no one who isn't already willing to join. Bake sales are more effective recruiting tools.

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On the other hand, it is extremely effective at creating a deep tribal feeling among its own members.

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The rejection they receive is actually more important than the few people they convert. It causes them to feel a level of discomfort around the people they attempt to talk to. These become the "others". These uncomfortable feelings go away when they come back to their congregation, the "Tribe".

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If you take a good look at the process it becomes fairly clear. In most cases, the religious person starts out from their own group, who is encouraging and supportive. They are then sent out into the harsh world where people repeatedly reject them. Mainly because they are trained to be so annoying.

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These brave witnesses then return from the cruel world to their congregation where they are treated like returning heroes. They are now safe. They bond as they share their experiences of reaching out to the godless people to bring them the truth. They share the otherness they experience.

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Once again they will learn that the only place they are accepted is with the people who think as they do. It isn't safe to leave the group. The world is your enemy, but we love you.

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This is a pain reward cycle that is a common brainwashing technique. The participants become more and more reliant on the "Tribe" because they know that "others" reject them.

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Mix in some ritualized chanting, possibly a bit of monotonous repetition of instructions, add a dash of fear of judgment by an unseen, but all-powerful entity who loves you if you do as you are told and you get a pretty powerful mix.

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Sorry, I have absolutely no wish to participate in someones brainwashing ritual.

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So then he came, he didn't quite see, he pissed everybody off, and he walked away feeling completely vindicated because everybody hates him.But wait, nobody hates him simply because he's a "Jesus Freak" (and everybody who hates damned fool religious nuts for being the totally hateful pieces of slime that they truly are), but rather because he truly and simply is such a totally hateful piece of slime.But there is room for improvement.Will "dad" seek it?Sorry, not likely. But then that is the great pleasure of the pessimist:

• 99% of the time we have the smug satisfaction of being correct.
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• 1% of the time we are very pleasantly surprised.

Are we going to be smugly correct?Or are we going to be very pleasantly surprised?Edited by dwise1, : extraneous last line replaced

Hi David. I read with interest this post of yours and felt inclined to add my 2 cents worth.
I think that I get the concept of "The Tribe" but feel that my definition is limited to Christians who claim to have been "Born Again". Thus jar is not a tribal member unless he too is a missionary and quite good at being a stealth operative--he ranks evidence ahead of belief, which hinders his ability to accept the Spirit...in fact he continually asks what "Accepting Jesus" or "Feeling The Spirit" or "Being In Communion with The Spirit even mean. Tribal members never ask such questions. Also regarding our suspended member Faith, I hesitantly even included her in The Tribe due to the fact that she was not an effective missionary. But then again, I have many hangups I need to correct in myself, so I will at this point shut up.

Absolutely correct. Not only do I never get an answer to such questions, the Tribal members can't answer because they honestly have no clue what the answer could possibly be. The Tribal members don't question; don't think, don't look at evidence or reality.The whole existence of the Tribal members is within the bubble closed off from facts, reality, evidence, truth, honesty and in the comfort of the fantasy and god they create.

This is on the same plain as the other topic I just responded to you at. The fact is that I sense God's presence when I pray. The reality is that God exists and seeks to know us. The evidence is that More gets done at a soup kitchen full of prayer warriors than simply a bunch of liberals talking football, women, and politics.
The truth is that Jesus Christ is alive. Honesty may suggest that we both are correct in our approach. You cant lump me in with a bunch of goats simply because I value the first part of the greatest commandment despite being "unable to explain it" tro you or anyone else. If you guys cant figure it out, go talk about football, politics, and women while you feed, clothe, and encourage the least of these. I'm sure that He won't kick you out of Heaven for such behavior. The difference between us is that you don't care what "God" you create and assume He could care less if you know Him or not...whereas the One whom I create is very interested in my development as a human, a member of global society, and how I feed His sheep. Edited by Phat, : added point

I've know many that think like this. They are convinced that all of you are going to hell simply for not agreeing with them and/or attending their church. In fact, I think I once thought this way earlier in my "Christian walk."The fact is that God seeks only for you to trust Him rather than mock the entire idea that He is real. He likely would have us loving each other despite our differences rather than ostracizing each other as American Politics has conveniently done for itself. This point is likely true. During my many years here at EvC, I will admit that I seek the intellectual humanist crowd here to at least understand my God rather than mock Him as a figment of my limited imagination. I'm not worried that they(you) will go to hell, however. I'm more concerned that you find no need to understand Heaven or what it means to be called out and chosen by the Creator of all seen and unseen. Perhaps in that regard jar is more effective here using the God that he markets. And you of all people know the basic character and personality of Jesus Freaks. I used to get on your case for ranting at Faith when you were a bit tipsy. Not that she didn't deserve it! I find that I get along better here at EvC than I do with tribal members. I rarely hang out with them unless we are feeding, clothing, and encouraging the community somewhere. I won't say that I am any more intelligent than most of them are but I will say that I ask questions that most of them won't ask. I will admit that I actually like being rejected. It energizes me and challenges me. Sitting in a room full of people who agree with my definitions of God never challenges me at all.

Phat, you can't explain it because you have never figured it out yourself. If you had figured it out then you would be able to explain it.The key fact is also pointed out by you in your earlier post. Tribal members don't ask such questions.The Goats in the Matthew 25 parable were all followers of Jesus.

I'm not so sure its that easy. Do you think it's silly or pointless to talk with Jesus every day and several times a day? Should they prepare a rubber room for me?

How do you know that you are talking with Jesus?Stop and think Phat. Not unless there is a reason to believe you are a physical danger to yourself or others.You are still placing SOURCE over content. What is important is how you respond to the "conversations", how you react to the CONTENT of the talks. It must be CONTENT over source. That does Jesus tell you to do in those conversations?And that's really the difference. The extreme result of placing SOURCE over content is "Got Mitt Un". It is "The Peoples Temple Agricultural Project"; the Spanish Inquisition, the Russian pogroms, the cultural genocide of the 18th and 19th century and even continuing today.If all you get from the conversations is "Whatta good boy you are.", "Way to go!", "You get a gold star today!" then they are most likely harmless. If they make you feel better then they are good. If they make you do more for the least of these then that's even better. It's CONTENT over source.

Nope, that's not a fact. At best it's an impression. Nope, that's not reality. It's more like wishful thinking. Show us that evidence. Nope, that isn't the truth. It's just a mantra.

Evolution is not taught in schools, only a mathematically irrational, mythical misinterpretation of evolution is taught in schools. If evolution was correctly taught in schools, there would be fewer drug-resistant infections and failed cancer treatments.

Except you are applying it far too liberally. It's not just one single "Christian Tribe", nor one single "'born again' Christian Tribe", nor one single "fundamentalist Christian Tribe." Instead of "Tribes", why not just call them "Legion" because they are so many? Many whom you would assume would be in the same "tribe" as you aren't. That is because Christian sects (especially on the Protestant branch of that religion's evolution) repeatedly and almost continually splinter off into new branches over the most minor of petty disagreements.Eg, Ed Babinski's 1986 cartoon on this point: A young woman in my Country Two-Step class (whenever that can come back) is a fundamentalist Christian, but she and members of her small sect hate it when we confuse them with those people. In fact, even though outside observers cannot distinguish their sect from dozens of other such sects, the members of each sect believe that the others are all apostates who spread false teachings and hence are not saved. A joke that I posted at Message 948 illustrates that:

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Once I saw this guy on a bridge about to jump. I said, "Don't do it!" He said, "Nobody loves me." I said, "God loves you. Do you believe in God?"
He said, "Yes." I said, "Are you a Christian or a Jew?" He said, "A Christian." I said, "Me, too! Protestant or Catholic?" He said, "Protestant." I said, "Me, too! What franchise?" He said, "Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Baptist or Southern Baptist?" He said, "Northern Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist or Northern Liberal Baptist?"

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He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist." I said, "Me, too! Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region, or Northern Conservative Baptist Eastern Region?" He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region." I said, "Me, too!"

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"Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1879, or Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912?"

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He said, "Northern Conservative Baptist Great Lakes Region Council of 1912." I said, "Die, heretic!" And I pushed him over.

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So the chances of two random "born again" (or any other kind of "true") Christians being in the same "Tribe" are extremely small. Even though a great many such "Tribes" will have nearly identical characteristics and engage in nearly identical tactics. But that still does not make them the "same Tribe", especially among themselves between the different "Tribes".My point to "dad" in Message 1441 was that he is obviously engaging in that kind of tactic, which is not meant to convince anybody except himself. And part of what he is trying to convince himself about is the pernicious myth of "us poor persecuted Christians", which is a martyr complex that leads them to engage in hostile social misconduct that inevitably generates hostile reactions thus making their "persecution" a self-fulfilling prophesy (and to add insult to injury, they then accuse us of actually hating God instead of them -- no, we hate them personally because they are personally so hateful and insist on acting hatefully). We've all seen "dad" doing that. Besides refusing to engage in discussion, he became increasing defiant with the moderators, basically daring them to persecute him through censorship.So why was he here if not for the reasons given in that essay I quoted? And if he had other -- possibly even legitimate -- reasons for being here, why has he disappeared? Obviously, he had gotten what he came for, yet another feeding of his "Christian martyrdom fantasy syndrome."

US only National (as opposed to the regional or local sects) Baptists:
Alliance of Baptists
American Baptist Association
American Baptist Churches in the USA
Association of Reformed Baptist Churches of America
Association of Welcoming and Affirming Baptists
Baptist Bible Fellowship International
Baptist Missionary Association of America
Central Baptist Association
Christian Unity Baptist Association
Conservative Baptist Association of America
Continental Baptist Churches
Converge (formerly Baptist General Conference)
Cooperative Baptist Fellowship
Enterprise Association of Regular Baptists
Free Will Baptist
Full Gospel Baptist Church Fellowship
Fundamental Baptist Fellowship Association
Fundamental Baptist Fellowship of America
General Association of Baptists
General Association of General Baptists
General Association of Regular Baptist Churches
General Conference of the Evangelical Baptist Church, Inc.
General Six-Principle Baptists
Independent Baptist Church of America
Independent Baptist Fellowship International
Independent Baptist Fellowship of North America
Institutional Missionary Baptist Conference of America
Interstate & Foreign Landmark Missionary Baptist Association
Landmark Baptists
Liberty Baptist Fellowship
National Association of Free Will Baptists
National Baptist Convention of America, Inc.
National Baptist Convention, USA, Inc.
National Baptist Evangelical Life and Soul Saving Assembly of the U.S.A.
National Missionary Baptist Convention of America
National Primitive Baptist Convention of the U.S.A.
North American Baptist Conference
Old Regular Baptist
Old Time Missionary Baptist
Original Free Will Baptist Convention
Primitive Baptist Universalists
Primitive Baptists
Progressive National Baptist Convention
Reformed Baptist
Regular Baptist
Separate Baptist
Separate Baptists in Christ
Seventh Day Baptist General Conference
Southern Baptist Convention
Southwide Baptist Fellowship
Sovereign Grace Baptists
Two-Seed-in-the-Spirit Predestinarian Baptists
United American Free Will Baptist Church
United American Free Will Baptist Conference
United Baptist
World Baptist Fellowship

Question, jar.Are these not associations of churches instead of separate cults? Couldn't a specific church belong to many of these or are these separate doctrines?

The ones listed above are the Nationally recognized flavors under the basic banner of "Baptist". There are even more regional and local labeled chapters of Club Baptist.Each of the ones mentioned as well as the regional and local examples consider themselves as unique and either culturally, politically or dogmatically separate from all the other Chapters of Club Baptist. The differences though are not all doctrinal; political, cultural and ethnic difference also play a significant role.

The Bible even mentions similar divisions. And...Now to be fair, jar brings up the fact that the Bible was written, edited, redacted and preached by and through man. In fact, I found a clever meme on Facebook...let me see if I can reproduce it here: Update Your Browser | FacebookThus to summarize, what we can learn about God can only be spread through the human conduit. jar has always argued this, but my beef with him (at least currently) is that he lets logic reason and perceived reality get in the way of spiritual expression.