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Author Topic:   When Will The End-Times Be And How Will We Know?
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 283 of 794 (877379)
06-14-2020 2:42 PM
Reply to: Message 279 by Phat
06-14-2020 12:53 PM


Re: What does the evidence show?
We point out what the Bible says when you try to claim it means something else Phat.
We don't say that a source is unnecessary; we say that the source is irrelevant and it is the CONTENT that is significant.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 279 by Phat, posted 06-14-2020 12:53 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 285 by ICANT, posted 06-14-2020 3:55 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 287 of 794 (877385)
06-14-2020 5:29 PM
Reply to: Message 285 by ICANT
06-14-2020 3:55 PM


Some folk ask truly pointless questions
The CONTENT of any message.
Edited by jar, : fix sub-title

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 285 by ICANT, posted 06-14-2020 3:55 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 288 by ICANT, posted 06-14-2020 9:20 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 289 of 794 (877387)
06-15-2020 7:28 AM
Reply to: Message 288 by ICANT
06-14-2020 9:20 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
ICANT writes:
So where could I find a source for Biblical doctrine CONTENT that would be accepted by you?
I very much doubt that YOU could.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 288 by ICANT, posted 06-14-2020 9:20 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 290 by ICANT, posted 06-15-2020 2:11 PM jar has replied
 Message 293 by Phat, posted 06-15-2020 6:19 PM jar has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 291 of 794 (877403)
06-15-2020 3:10 PM
Reply to: Message 290 by ICANT
06-15-2020 2:11 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
All doctrine just like all of the contents of the Bible are the product of human minds. Just as there is no such thing as "The Bible" there is no such thing as "The Biblical Doctrine".

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 290 by ICANT, posted 06-15-2020 2:11 PM ICANT has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 292 by Phat, posted 06-15-2020 6:12 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 294 of 794 (877411)
06-15-2020 6:19 PM
Reply to: Message 292 by Phat
06-15-2020 6:12 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
Again Phat; nothing but word salad and not a even an attempt at supporting what you wish to market.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 292 by Phat, posted 06-15-2020 6:12 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 297 by Phat, posted 06-15-2020 10:49 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 299 of 794 (877429)
06-16-2020 7:49 AM
Reply to: Message 297 by Phat
06-15-2020 10:49 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
Phat writes:
I believed and was changed---transformed---and yes....chosen.
How did you change? What was the evidence of that transformation?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 297 by Phat, posted 06-15-2020 10:49 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 10:25 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 306 of 794 (877443)
06-16-2020 11:41 AM
Reply to: Message 302 by Phat
06-16-2020 10:25 AM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
Phat writes:
The initial change was of an inner certainty.
Yet that did not send up RED FLAG Warnings?
Inner certainty should always be seen as a major warning and threat and something that needs to be tested.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 10:25 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 307 of 794 (877444)
06-16-2020 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 304 by Phat
06-16-2020 10:48 AM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
Phat writes:
Sure I do. Why cant he just admit that he isn't a believer since he claims that Jesus was a cultural mythos, that it is irrelevant anyway because Christianity is based only on humans following a message with no need of communion or transformation...yet he hangs on to that stupid club as a badge of honor telling him that he too is a Christian.
Too funny.
Phat, it is not a claim. I am a registered member of the Episcopal Church.
And neither you or anyone else has every explained how communion or transformation is possible.
Phat writes:
You dont get to simply say a slogan and promise to do the message and get accepted without dropping your bad habits at the door.
Yet the evidence seems to show that that is EXACTLY what the Apologists and the CCoI market. "Not perfect but forgiven!"
It's an easy sell.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 304 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 10:48 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 309 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 12:25 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 311 of 794 (877455)
06-16-2020 2:09 PM
Reply to: Message 308 by Phat
06-16-2020 12:19 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
LOL
Yes Phat, that was what the author of John inserted and marketed.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 12:19 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 314 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 2:51 PM jar has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 312 of 794 (877456)
06-16-2020 2:21 PM
Reply to: Message 309 by Phat
06-16-2020 12:25 PM


Re: Some folk ask truly pointless questions
And so your only response is to post nonsense that the Apologists try to market from the declared Apologists propaganda.
Phat writes:
And you never chose to accept it.
Chose to accept what? You have never offered anything to accept or reject.
Look at that so called definition. It is nothing but a collage of silly meaningless bumper stickers and even those are qualified.
"the renewing (of your mind)," (HUH?)
the adjustment of the moral and spiritual vision and thinking to the mind of God (HUH?)
which is designed to have a transforming effect upon the life (And demonstrated by ????????????????????????????)
There is simply nothing there Phat except empty platitudes that have absolutely no meaning.
Transformation is something that can be seen and evidenced. Transformation can only be changed behavior.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 309 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 12:25 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 313 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 2:30 PM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 316 of 794 (877462)
06-16-2020 3:02 PM
Reply to: Message 313 by Phat
06-16-2020 2:30 PM


Re: jar always asks HUH and knows darn well what I mean
Phat writes:
Do you mean that the scriptures in Romans are empty platitudes and bumper stickers?
Well, Romans was an interoffice memo. It was Paul speaking in terms that were agreed upon and exactly the same thing you seem to do quite often. Like you and the Apologists he very often does use word salad and it seemed to work just about like it does today.
Romans is a memo and should be treated like any interoffice memo. Bat as seen in your example above, what the Apologists and carny medicine men do is take pieces parts out of context and try to align bits from Romans with pieces parts from Titus or somewhere else but never take the next step, just as you did in the post I'm replying to now, to explain what the pieces parts mean.
Phat writes:
jar always asks HUH and knows darn well what I mean
Yet you NEVER actually explain what it means. You can't explain what it means even though there really is a meaning and that meaning negates almost all of your asserted beliefs.
Phat writes:
1) Do you believe that GOD exists?
I've answered that for you many, many, many times. Yes, I believe that GOD does exist even though I also understand that belief is illogical, irrational and pretty much irrelevant.
Phat writes:
Do you believe that Jesus was simply a human or do you believe He was more?
And yet again, I've answered that many, many, many times for you.
When Jesus was alive and living among us I believe he was simply human, nothing more.
Phat writes:
Are you so dense as to not see the description of the Holy Spirit in scripture?
Yes, there are hints of the Holy Spirit in the Pentacost tale. But it really is pretty much missing everywhere else and even there is is not characterized as a separate critter but more like inspiration.
And since you continue to claim that I know what you mean or some bumper sticker mean please treat me as an infant and explain it again.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 313 by Phat, posted 06-16-2020 2:30 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 322 of 794 (877510)
06-17-2020 7:29 AM
Reply to: Message 321 by Phat
06-17-2020 6:53 AM


Re: What Does "It" Mean?
Phat writes:
They will drop the alcohol and the cigarettes.
There you go again. What could possibly make you think Jesus would expect anyone to drop the alcohol when it was Jesus that made the better wine for the party, then he told his followers to take a drink in remembrance of him?
Can you not see that all you market is the God and Jesus YOU created?

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 321 by Phat, posted 06-17-2020 6:53 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 323 by Phat, posted 06-17-2020 7:49 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 324 of 794 (877514)
06-17-2020 8:26 AM
Reply to: Message 323 by Phat
06-17-2020 7:49 AM


Re: What Does "It" Mean?
Phat writes:
oh stop. You surely know that I am right.
Actually, I believe very strongly that you are wrong.
Phat writes:
You claim that I (and the apologists) market a certain Jesus and that you, on the other hand, simply report what the book says. I would argue otherwise...especially if you dare make an argument that Jesus was an imperfect human while on earth. I do not believe that.
LOL
But Phat, that is exactly what is written in both the Bible and in the Nicene Creed. Sure, there are also claims made in the Bible that Jesus was perfect but those claims are never supported by reasoning or logic or evidence.
Human wrote the Bible and it has contradictions, errors and fantasy.
You are free to assert most anything but argument requires that you provide support for those assertions.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 323 by Phat, posted 06-17-2020 7:49 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 326 by Phat, posted 06-18-2020 7:33 AM jar has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


(1)
Message 328 of 794 (877559)
06-18-2020 9:06 AM
Reply to: Message 326 by Phat
06-18-2020 7:33 AM


Re: What Does "It" Mean?
Phat writes:
To me, it would be a sad sobering day if what you guys said were true and that GOD were simply an abstract unproved possibility and that the charge remained defined by humans for humans with no promises of any reward in having fed, clothed, loved, encouraged and supported other humans with no supernatural Father figure ready to hand out rewards to me and my fellow believers for having run the race so well.
To even consider it as true in any way threatens my assurance that I unerringly believe. I will not doubt!!
They are, but why should I even bother putting up this argument. You dont want the God that I market even if He were real. (and of course He is. He is alive) And I need Him.
It frustrates me to no end that you would support a God Who allows people to remain unchanged and allowed to keep their own personality and lifestyle choices. Heaven is not all inclusive. If it were, God and I would have some issues. I would dare scold Him for being so liberal and tolerant. Heck, may as well allow Satan Himself back in!
The topic is "When Will The End-Times Be And How Will We Know?"
Those folk who market the "End Times" gambit ran away and have not been heard from again.
The post to which you are replying did make some pretty clear statements though and in fact you provided no argument other than the fact that you do not like for them to be true.
But if you really need to hold onto your beliefs, then why do you place them on the table to be challenged?
If you hope to persuade others that your beliefs should be adopted then you need to provide evidence and reasoning to support those beliefs.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 326 by Phat, posted 06-18-2020 7:33 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 393 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 345 of 794 (877703)
06-20-2020 1:07 PM
Reply to: Message 341 by Phat
06-20-2020 11:39 AM


Re: Burden Of Proof 101
Phat writes:
To me, it would be a sad sobering day if what you guys said were true and that GOD were simply an abstract unproved possibility and that the charge remained defined by humans for humans with no promises of any reward in having fed, clothed, loved, encouraged and supported other humans with no supernatural Father figure ready to hand out rewards to me and my fellow believers for having run the race so well.
To even consider it as true in any way threatens my assurance that I unerringly believe. I will not doubt!!
They are, but why should I even bother putting up this argument. You dont want the God that I market even if He were real. (and of course He is. He is alive) And I need Him.
It frustrates me to no end that you would support a God Who allows people to remain unchanged and allowed to keep their own personality and lifestyle choices. Heaven is not all inclusive. If it were, God and I would have some issues. I would dare scold Him for being so liberal and tolerant. Heck, may as well allow Satan Himself back in!
It is important for you to examine your worldview and test it as if you were opposed to it.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill StudiosMy Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 341 by Phat, posted 06-20-2020 11:39 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 346 by Phat, posted 06-20-2020 3:27 PM jar has replied

  
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