When Will The End-Times Be And How Will We Know?

OK, but allow me to ask some questions.

Is my worldview unique or is it simply lumped in with the collective worldview of the apologists? For the record, I dont believe that Christianity should be conflated with politics, except in the altruistic sense of helping those less fortunate.

What specifically am I to oppose about my worldview? Having strongly believed that I came into communion with the living Christ, I would be hard pressed to throw that away. I would even go so far as to ask whats wrong with that belief?

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I've heard your answers. I disagree with some and agree with others. My Christian worldview is applicable to a subset of Christians yet is also personally unique. I DO believe that Jesus is Gods character and that it would be hard to throw that away and agree with a consensus that there is(are) many ways to God, Nirvana, Enlightenment or Inner Peace.

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To be honest, its not easy taking the opposing point of view.

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The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.Calvin Coolidge
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith

- You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. Anne Lamott
I Have Strong Arguments Which I Cant Say To You~CG

Who in this thread first posted "It is important for you to examine your worldview and test it as if you were opposed to it."? Start with each of the above.

I attempted to get a grasp of what it was that you guys were suggesting I do. After a bit of searching online in order to understand the task, I found this argument:
The Falsification Mindset: How to Change Your Own MindSome key points:

Basically, when you gain a perspective or theory, you tend to interpret everything as confirming that idea. Whatever seems to contradict it is tossed aside or somehow contorted to fit our beliefs. (Confirmation Bias)

As a way to cure this ill of self-confirming theories and belief systems, he (Popper) came up with what is now called falsificationism: the idea that a theory or belief system can only be scientific if it clearly lays out what specific evidence would prove it wrong.

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Reading further:
Why is falsification important?

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it helps you to avoid many cognitive biases that can hinder intellectual growth and good decision making

it makes you a clearer thinker by forcing you to be specific about what you think you know, and what evidence you have

it boosts your creative thinking by making you naturally more receptive to new ideas and helping you more quickly process them

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At this point, my gut level reaction was that if I can falsify my assurance that something is most definitely true, I have weakened my certainty of faith!

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In addition, I have never believed that Evidence is even a needed part of the equation.

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However, the article goes on to say:

quote:

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Our minds tend to run headlong toward safety and comfort. This is true with regards to physical safety and comfort but it’s also true of intellectual safety and certainty. If we feel like we know something for sure like we have a firm grasp of it we want to hold on to that feeling.
Because we want to hold on to that feeling, we tend to manufacture certainty by either stopping the search for new information (fearful that it might endanger our feeling of certainty) or interpreting new information in a way that keeps supporting our feeling of certainty.
Those practices stifles creative thinking, intellectual growth, and personal growth.

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I'm finally beginning to understand what you always meant when you told me to throw God away. I will say that this type of introspection can be quite uncomfortable and angst ridden.

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Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

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The only way I know to drive out evil from the country is by the constructive method of filling it with good.Calvin Coolidge
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
As the fear of God is the beginning of wisdom, so the denial of God is the height of foolishness.-RC Sproul, Essential Truths of the Christian Faith

- You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do. Anne Lamott
I Have Strong Arguments Which I Cant Say To You~CG

Yes, yes it can. Always best to do it as soon as possible.

The thing with most of the more sophisticated current religious beliefs is that they have evolved to be basically unfalsifiable. A vague, ambiguous and intentionally undefinable concept (GOD) that did/does things that are only subjectively experienced if detectable at all. Ask yourself why those who hold and cherish religious beliefs might design their concepts in this way...And by design I mean a process of meme adaption down the generations that we could call survival of the least falsifiable.

Speaking as a believer (and by this I mean someone who became (or thought he became) Born Again and filled with Gods Spirit) falsification of such a tangible and real experience will have to be allowed and initiated by the Spirit of God Himself. You guys just dont understand how personal and close God is to me. I'm not talking about the dogma, nor the teachings of the church-at-large nor of the fervent people surrounding me (at a 6 foot social distance) and singing to Him in church---though all of that serves to fuel a confirmation bias. I'm talking about my private prayer life and time of meditation, introspection, and communion.This is most definitely something I would not seek to falsify unless the Holy Spirit gave me a subtle thumbs up that it was not harmful to do so.Does that make any sense to you from your perspective and if not why not?

quote:

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Come, let us sing to the Lord; *

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let us shout for joy to the Rock of our salvation.

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Let us come before his presence with thanksgiving *

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and raise a loud shout to him with psalms.

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For the Lord is a great God, *

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and a great King above all gods.

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In his hand are the caverns of the earth, *

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and the heights of the hills are his also.

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The sea is his, for he made it, *

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and his hands have molded the dry land.

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Come, let us bow down, and bend the knee, *

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and kneel before the Lord our Maker.

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For he is our God,

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and we are the people of his pasture and the sheep of his hand. *

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Oh, that today you would hearken to his voice!

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Read that carefully Phat and think about what it actually says. It is "The Venite", the "Oh Come". It is a part of what is known as "Morning Prayer", a service to begin each Christian's day.But it is also in many ways directly opposition to the God that you market.

Of course we understand; it's a delusion, they're very powerful things. If you talked that way about anything else other than religion you'd be seeing a doctor. Religious delusions get a free pass in our society.Some of us have felt the same and managed to snap out of it. Some - like you - really want the delusion so it continues.Edited by Tangle, : No reason given.

As I listened to a few recordings and versions of the Venite, I began to meditate and commune with God as I understand Him. If you recall, I used to (and still do in my fleshier moments) accuse you of being obtuse and private in your refusal to discuss your own personal relationship with God,Jesus, and the Holy Spirit and because of your refusal I was led to believe that you didnt have a relationship. In fact, you always asked (and ask) me how such a relationship would even be possible.
The Venite 609So just now, I meditated on this morning prayer of which you speak. I paid attention to the beauty of the expression of faith that was more a discipline and less raw charismatic emotion. I thought to myself how, if God exists (which I believe He does) and if He judges the thoughts and intents of the human heart, singing such a prayer as a daily discipline would serve the purpose of emptying my mind of the daily wish list that I normally would discuss with God and would instead focus on my adoration and respect for Him rather than my expectation of a favoring cosmic Father whom I took for granted.

And that’s why such beliefs are designed to be unfalsifiable. You couldn’t bear the idea of them being falsified. You are far from alone in that. It does make sense. In psychological sense at least. But I’m sure that in my case if I held such beliefs there would be a nagging part of me wondering if the reason I was so resistant, and the reason the beliefs themselves seemed so designed to be avoid falsification, was because they weren’t actually true....

But how can you say with 100% certainty that it is a delusion? Why is the idea that my beliefs are a delusion itself not falsifiable?

I like the honesty. There should be a "nagging part" of us that remains unconvinced (or brainwashed, as it were)And I say "brainwashed" to make you guys laugh---the believers would not laugh. They would never entertain such a notion for it would threaten their very sanity.Look, I got saved in 1993 and have been quite convinced, resisting doubt, defending my faith as any good apologist would do, and encouraging others to share my faith with me. One strong reason that I choose to continue to believe the way that I do is because there have been many many times...too numerous to count---where scripture spoke to me in a way that no other book can or has done for me. You would likely chalk it up to confirmation bias, however.Have you ever known any friends who were or are strong believers? Do you get along with them?

But did you read it as I suggested?

quote:

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Come, let us sing to the Lord; *
let us shout for joy to the Rock of our salvation.

​

Let us come before his presence with thanksgiving *

​

and raise a loud shout to him with psalms.

​

For the Lord is a great God, *

​

and a great King above all gods.

​

In his hand are the caverns of the earth, *

​

and the heights of the hills are his also.

​

The sea is his, for he made it, *

​

and his hands have molded the dry land.

​

Come, let us bow down, and bend the knee, *

​

and kneel before the Lord our Maker.

​

For he is our God,

​

and we are the people of his pasture and the sheep of his hand. *

​

Oh, that today you would hearken to his voice!

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Because you think you're talking to an invisible being. That pretty much does it.

Of course! My late grandfather was a pretty devout Catholic. Current friend at work is a Muslim. And lots of people I am friends with are believers of one sort or another. I keep my fervent irreligiousness to debate sites generally!Edited by Straggler, : No reason given.