Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,817 Year: 3,074/9,624 Month: 919/1,588 Week: 102/223 Day: 0/13 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Did the Flood really happen?
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1726 of 2370 (878745)
07-03-2020 11:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1723 by ringo
07-03-2020 9:08 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
So what do you look for when making declarations that something in Adam's day did not happen?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1723 by ringo, posted 07-03-2020 9:08 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1733 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:39 AM dad has replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1727 of 2370 (878746)
07-03-2020 11:11 PM
Reply to: Message 1721 by Tanypteryx
07-03-2020 6:54 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
You declare events long ago fiction based on..?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1721 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-03-2020 6:54 PM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1729 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-03-2020 11:28 PM dad has replied
 Message 1759 by Capt Stormfield, posted 07-05-2020 11:18 AM dad has replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1728 of 2370 (878747)
07-03-2020 11:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1722 by ringo
07-03-2020 9:04 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
Science is not science when the basis is only beliefs. Again, origin sciences have only belief as a basis. Call it what you like.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1722 by ringo, posted 07-03-2020 9:04 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1732 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:30 AM dad has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 1729 of 2370 (878748)
07-03-2020 11:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1727 by dad
07-03-2020 11:11 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
You declare events long ago fiction
Nope, just your beliefs and stories. All fiction.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1727 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:11 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1730 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:37 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1730 of 2370 (878750)
07-03-2020 11:37 PM
Reply to: Message 1729 by Tanypteryx
07-03-2020 11:28 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
Whatever you declare fiction is fiction then. No reasons needed. I see.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1729 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-03-2020 11:28 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 1731 of 2370 (878752)
07-04-2020 12:33 AM
Reply to: Message 1721 by Tanypteryx
07-03-2020 6:54 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
Hi Tanypteryx
Tanypteryx writes:
It's fiction.
Were you there as an eye witness?
Do you know anyone that was and eye witness?
Do you have any written evidence of anyone that was there?
So all you have is your assumptions.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1721 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-03-2020 6:54 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1732 of 2370 (878770)
07-04-2020 9:30 AM
Reply to: Message 1728 by dad
07-03-2020 11:14 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
Science is not science when the basis is only beliefs.
And the basis is not beliefs. There is no place for beliefs in science - e.g. belief in God or belief in the Bible.
dad writes:
Again, origin sciences have only belief as a basis.
Nonsense. What you call "origin sciences" are no different from the sciences that produce your computer and your gasoline. They're all based on hard facts - hard facts that can be verified by anybody regardless of their individual beliefs. That's why people of all faiths - Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. - accept the fact of evolution and an old earth.
dad writes:
Call it what you like.
YOU can call it what YOU like but your opinions on what science is or "should be" have no bearing on reality.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1728 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:14 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1735 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:23 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1733 of 2370 (878772)
07-04-2020 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1726 by dad
07-03-2020 11:10 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
So what do you look for when making declarations that something in Adam's day did not happen?
You have it backwards again. We don't "make declarations" and then go looking for evidence to back them up. We look at the evidence and then draw conclusions from what we observe. (You should actually have learned about the scientific method in school when you were about ten years old.)
And, despite what you may have been told, when scientists form a hypothesis, they look for evidence to falsify it. If they don't try to falsify it, somebody else will.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1726 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:10 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1738 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:34 PM ringo has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1734 of 2370 (878777)
07-04-2020 10:42 AM
Reply to: Message 1725 by dad
07-03-2020 11:09 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
I linked to the appropriate papers. Read them.
In the extraordinarily unlikely eventuality that you really want to understand dendrochronology, see http://www.pbs.org/...xperience-archaeology/dendrochronology and About Tree Rings | Laboratory of Tree-Ring Research.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1725 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:09 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1736 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:23 PM JonF has replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1735 of 2370 (878781)
07-04-2020 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 1732 by ringo
07-04-2020 9:30 AM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
quote:
And the basis is not beliefs. There is no place for beliefs in science
I agree. So when all ages are based on a belief that nature on earth was the same, that is not real science.
When distances and sizes of stars are based on assuming time exists the same in all the universe, we know that the billions of years they cite are beliefs, and not real science. The criteria is whether claims and models are based on testing, observation, repetition, and factual evidence, it is not what you declare is a belief or not.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1732 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:30 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1751 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:14 PM dad has replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1736 of 2370 (878782)
07-04-2020 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 1734 by JonF
07-04-2020 10:42 AM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
No. You read them. Then post a relevant part using a link as support.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1734 by JonF, posted 07-04-2020 10:42 AM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1737 by JonF, posted 07-04-2020 1:34 PM dad has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1737 of 2370 (878783)
07-04-2020 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 1736 by dad
07-04-2020 1:23 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
You got what you asked for. I posted a relevant part and provided several links in support.
I suggest you start with the last two links in my message of this morning.
I'll gladly discuss the subject in depth when and if you demonstrate sufficient knowledge to engage in a discussion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1736 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:23 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1739 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:36 PM JonF has replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1738 of 2370 (878784)
07-04-2020 1:34 PM
Reply to: Message 1733 by ringo
07-04-2020 9:39 AM


the world that then was
The same nature in the past belief is not falsifiable.
Science does make declarations. In offering origin models as fact, they declare them to be valid. So can we go back and check the first life form? No. They look at this nature and how little lifeforms may act or evolve here. They have no capacity to go back and check if people recorded in history lived. They cannot go back and observe how fast trees grew. They just look at the present. They cannot go back and check what processes went on with isotopes. They look at processes that go on today. Basically their models are are 'what if' scenarios based on nature being the same (and there being no creation, since they use what exists now to model how it all came to exist)
There can be no denying it is belief based.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1733 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:39 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1741 by Tanypteryx, posted 07-04-2020 2:37 PM dad has replied
 Message 1750 by ringo, posted 07-04-2020 9:10 PM dad has replied
 Message 2090 by Larni, posted 08-09-2020 11:01 AM dad has not replied

  
dad
Member (Idle past 1338 days)
Posts: 337
Joined: 05-29-2020


Message 1739 of 2370 (878785)
07-04-2020 1:36 PM
Reply to: Message 1737 by JonF
07-04-2020 1:34 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
Read your links. Then post the relevant bit. Make some actual point.
Looking at your link I see this in the first one.
"Dendrochronology operates on the principle that in temperate climates, like the southwestern United States, trees grow one ring every year."
So this means, in case you missed it, that they operate on a same nature in the past belief for which they can offer no support, nor do they try.
Edited by dad, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1737 by JonF, posted 07-04-2020 1:34 PM JonF has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1740 by JonF, posted 07-04-2020 2:20 PM dad has replied

  
JonF
Member (Idle past 168 days)
Posts: 6174
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 1740 of 2370 (878787)
07-04-2020 2:20 PM
Reply to: Message 1739 by dad
07-04-2020 1:36 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
I gave you the relevant information.
Your different-in-the-past hallucination is not worthy of consideration. As I've pointed out and you've ignored, differences of the sort you need would have repercussions that would echo down the ages and be detectable today. We've looked. Those repercussions aren't there.
We don't assume the past was the same. We know the past was the same , based on hundreds of measurements.
There no reason to refer to those measurements in every paper.
Edited by JonF, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1739 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:36 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1745 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 5:40 PM JonF has replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024