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Author Topic:   Did the Flood really happen?
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1705 of 2370 (878696)
07-03-2020 10:29 AM
Reply to: Message 1701 by dad
07-02-2020 5:27 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
Why don't they see evidence of a same nature either?
They do, obviously. Everywhere they look, same same. And you can't provide a single solitary scrap of evidence that suggests that nature changed.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1701 by dad, posted 07-02-2020 5:27 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1708 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:39 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1706 of 2370 (878697)
07-03-2020 10:33 AM
Reply to: Message 1700 by dad
07-02-2020 5:26 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
What have you got against superior extra sensory perceptions of the past?
To begin with, there's no such thing - i.e. there is no evidence that such a thing exists.
I don't remember seeing a discussion of that here. Maybe you should start one.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1700 by dad, posted 07-02-2020 5:26 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1709 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:41 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1707 of 2370 (878699)
07-03-2020 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 1699 by dad
07-02-2020 5:25 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
dad writes:
None of the little gang members can stand alone.
Obviously you haven't read any of it. Hint: It isn't about standing alone. It's about how they hold each other up.
Come back when you have leared something, son.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1699 by dad, posted 07-02-2020 5:25 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1710 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:47 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1712 of 2370 (878718)
07-03-2020 3:18 PM
Reply to: Message 1708 by dad
07-03-2020 12:39 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
They don't really look for anything else but what they believe existed.
That's obviously false. For example, Darwin read Lyell's book on geology while he was on the voyage where he made his observations. He had no idea "what to look for" to back up a theory that he han't even thought of yet. And Lyell had no idea "what to look for" that would back up a theory that hadn't even been thought of yet.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1708 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:39 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1717 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:10 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1713 of 2370 (878720)
07-03-2020 3:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1710 by dad
07-03-2020 12:47 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
dad writes:
In the case of the correlation gang here, name you best point. I can knock it out.
There are threads and threads full of RAZD's correlations. Feel free to go over there and knock any of them out.
dad writes:
Who cares if misreading ratios in two separate rocks yields totally imaginary dates that could never be proven?
It isn't just about rocks though. It's about lake varves and ice cores and tree rings.... Go ahead and explain how the age of a tree ring can just "happen" to correspond with the age of an ice core on the opposite side of the world.

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1710 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:47 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1715 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:07 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1714 of 2370 (878721)
07-03-2020 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 1709 by dad
07-03-2020 12:41 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
You mentioned the communication that used to exist, not me.
You talked about fables and I pointed out that the fables (talking animals) are in the Bible, not in science. And fables are fiction, so I wasn't talking about anything that "used to exist".

"I'm Fallen and I can't get up!"

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1709 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 12:41 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1716 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:09 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1722 of 2370 (878740)
07-03-2020 9:04 PM
Reply to: Message 1717 by dad
07-03-2020 5:10 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
Then they were pre origin science.
Again, no such thing. Science is science. I just follows the evidence. It does not decide ahead of time - like you do - what the evidence "should" be.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." --John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1717 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:10 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1728 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:14 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1723 of 2370 (878741)
07-03-2020 9:08 PM
Reply to: Message 1716 by dad
07-03-2020 5:09 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
If you claim that communication with angels or Adam in the garden and animals is not true, then you need some proof.
You keep getting it backwards. We don't look for negative evidence. That would be like saying we can't find France so it doesn't exist. That kind of silly conclusion is for you, not for science.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." --John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1716 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:09 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1726 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:10 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1724 of 2370 (878742)
07-03-2020 9:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1715 by dad
07-03-2020 5:07 PM


Re: KT layer versus 4500 years ago
dad writes:
Show us an example of how varves agree with tree rings somewhere say around 10,000 years ago. I'll look at it.
I told you, it's all in RAZD's threads. You've had ample opportunity to look at it.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." --John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1715 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 5:07 PM dad has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1732 of 2370 (878770)
07-04-2020 9:30 AM
Reply to: Message 1728 by dad
07-03-2020 11:14 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
Science is not science when the basis is only beliefs.
And the basis is not beliefs. There is no place for beliefs in science - e.g. belief in God or belief in the Bible.
dad writes:
Again, origin sciences have only belief as a basis.
Nonsense. What you call "origin sciences" are no different from the sciences that produce your computer and your gasoline. They're all based on hard facts - hard facts that can be verified by anybody regardless of their individual beliefs. That's why people of all faiths - Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, etc. - accept the fact of evolution and an old earth.
dad writes:
Call it what you like.
YOU can call it what YOU like but your opinions on what science is or "should be" have no bearing on reality.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1728 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:14 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1735 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:23 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1733 of 2370 (878772)
07-04-2020 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 1726 by dad
07-03-2020 11:10 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
So what do you look for when making declarations that something in Adam's day did not happen?
You have it backwards again. We don't "make declarations" and then go looking for evidence to back them up. We look at the evidence and then draw conclusions from what we observe. (You should actually have learned about the scientific method in school when you were about ten years old.)
And, despite what you may have been told, when scientists form a hypothesis, they look for evidence to falsify it. If they don't try to falsify it, somebody else will.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1726 by dad, posted 07-03-2020 11:10 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1738 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:34 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1750 of 2370 (878805)
07-04-2020 9:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1738 by dad
07-04-2020 1:34 PM


Re: the world that then was
dad writes:
The same nature in the past belief is not falsifiable.
Sure it is. All you'd have to do is show evidence of a changed nature.
Maybe you're confusing "not falsifiable" with "not false". It's true that you can't falsify something that is not false.
dad writes:
In offering origin models as fact, they declare them to be valid.
You're backwards again. I'm sensing a trend.
The models are observed to be valid - i.e. they're confirmed by the evidence. THEREFORE, they're considered to be fact. It's all about the evidence. Evidence first, then conclusions.
dad writes:
They cannot go back and observe how fast trees grew.
Sure they can. They can look at trees living and dead. They can look at wood from trees that were cut down before any trees that are still living were alive. They can even look at fossil trees. We have a beautiful specimen in our local museum, polished like a gravestone and you can count the rings as if it was cut down yesterday.
And don't forget the correlations between completely different methods. Are you ever going to take an honest look at RAZD's correlations?

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1738 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:34 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1753 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 2:39 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1751 of 2370 (878806)
07-04-2020 9:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1735 by dad
07-04-2020 1:23 PM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
So when all ages are based on a belief that nature on earth was the same...
It's not a belief. It's a conclusion based on the available evidence. You're the one who believes nature changed when you don't have a shred of evidence for that.
But I'm glad you agree that belief is a bad thing.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1735 by dad, posted 07-04-2020 1:23 PM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1754 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 2:40 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1756 of 2370 (878814)
07-05-2020 9:00 AM
Reply to: Message 1754 by dad
07-05-2020 2:40 AM


Re: Just as the fact that there is no "Bible" ...
dad writes:
If I offered support for a different nature in the past it would not be using science since science does not know either way.
Well, you just admitted that you don't know. You're pretty arrogant to assume that nobody else knows either.

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1754 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 2:40 AM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1761 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 12:49 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 440 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1757 of 2370 (878815)
07-05-2020 9:20 AM
Reply to: Message 1753 by dad
07-05-2020 2:39 AM


Re: the world that then was
dad writes:
If you claim that belief in a same nature in the past is falsifiable, then show us how.
I did. All you have to do is present some evidence that nature changed.
And then, of course, you'd have to propose some explaination for HOW it changed - i.e. how God did it. But that goes against your belief system, doesn't it? Your belief system inherently precludes science.
dad writes:
ringo writes:
The models are observed to be valid - i.e. they're confirmed by the evidence
No. They are not. They rest only on beliefs.
Denial is not an argument. Say something worthwhile.
dad writes:
Looking at a dead tree does not tell us how fast it used to grow.
It may not tell YOU anything. It does tell "us".

"I've been to Moose Jaw, now I can die." -- John Wing

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1753 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 2:39 AM dad has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1764 by dad, posted 07-05-2020 12:57 PM ringo has replied

  
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