Did the Flood really happen?

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All you have to do is present some evidence that nature changed.

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Unless you can prove it was the same there is no need. We believe what we choose. The claim that nature was the same is not falsifiable. (able to be proved to be false). Science cannot prove it false or true!

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you'd have to propose some explaination for HOW it changed

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Since science doesn't know either was no one needs to or can show how some unknown nature in the past changed. All that is needed is to realize science only believes and does not know.

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you'd have to propose some explaination for HOW it changed

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Showing a one liner that has no content or specifics to be false is not denial.

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...It does tell "us".

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How does a dead tree tell you how fast it used to grow 4600 years ago exactly?

It is arrogant of you to pretend science knows when being shown unable to demonstrate it.

Not a scientific basis, sorry. Maybe keep playing in the sand or whatever.

You switch from tree rings to deep space. You seem to be all over the map here. OK, so light is seen here in the area of the solar system only. We do not go out into the universe and see it at source, you realize this much?Now, we also do not know what time is like out there at all. We do not see time or space. So what time is involved in anything happening out there is absolutely unknown.You with me so far? Edited by dad, : No reason given.

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Now that is a really silly thing to say. Unless we can show that it didn't change, you will assume that it did?

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Unless you know and can prove that the nature you use in all models of the past was as you claim, I have no reason to assume it was. None at all. In fact, Scripture and even ancient history to some extent records that it was not the same. So I do not consider it a question, we already have the record. When you claim otherwise I naturally demand real evidence.

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So tomorrow you'll come to EvC assuming that it has changed to the website for Major League baseball?

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I think that nature follows certain forces and laws and as long as that nature exists, we can expect those laws to be valid.However, I also happen to know that one day soon that nature will change again! So I will not be the one hiding under rocks wishing to die when predicted changes occur. ( I hope).

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The pattern of the rings - e.g. wide narrow narrow wide extra-wide, etc. - can be compared from tree to tree.

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Let's see a close up of tree rings over 5000 deep? Let's look at that pattern for that time. We wait.If you pass that bar, we will then ask the question 'have you any reasons that fast growing trees in the different past nature would not have a similar pattern, though the rings represent parts of a month or week or day rather than seasons'?

It's not up to me to prove your beliefs.

You have comprehension issues if you think Razd's belief based arguments demonstrated anything.

No one thinks Scripture is reliable to those who have rejected God.Razd did not cover how trees grew in the past. By the way I don't see him around..?

Because reality involves more than imagination and belief.

How long do we know it was the same on earth? Certainly the world described in early Sumer seemed different, since they have people living many centuries. They also had spirits living with us in Egyptian records. That would not be natural now.

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OK, so first off, who is *we*?

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We are those living on earth. We choose what we believe generally.

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Science in this context means the collective critical thought process and data analysis of the scientiofic community-at-large correct?

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No.Definition of science1 : the state of knowing : knowledge as distinguished from ignorance or misunderstandingNot the state of having hunches beliefs of feelings or assumptions.You are welcome to your beliefs. Present them as such.

Sorry to hear that, he was a lively debater.

The main reason that stuff seems unchallenged is because dissent was quashed and opposing opinions.There is nothing in the thread I could not deal with handily.

Scripture and ancient historical records of the past.

Then post your best shot from it and watch the action.