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EvC Forum Side Orders Coffee House The Trump Presidency

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Author Topic:   The Trump Presidency
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4173 of 4573 (879998)
07-27-2020 3:15 PM
Reply to: Message 4171 by jar
07-27-2020 9:54 AM


What Makes Christians Ignorant?
Im not a huge fan of trump, though most of my Christian friends who like him list two main reasons, and dont mention the obvious third reason.
1) He supports Israel
2) He is against abortion.
and the elephant in the room
3) Their small businesses did a lot better.
But perhaps you can again tell us what specifically makes a Christian ignorant.
If its the belief that Jesus rose from the dead and is alive today (as Spirit) then I think it is you who are ignorant. I fear that your brand of Christianity specifies only that we imitate Jesus and feed, clothe and encourage our fellow humans...not waiting for any 2nd coming or return and not trusting God through prayer and Communion. Your Christianity advocates doing, which is not a bad thing...but you deny the power of the living God. (and will ask me how to test for this power)
The Socratic teachers and their critical thinking which taught you to "throw God away" deceived you.
But it may not be too late for you to learn, if you can lay your pride on the altar.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4171 by jar, posted 07-27-2020 9:54 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4174 by jar, posted 07-27-2020 3:19 PM Phat has replied
 Message 4176 by Trump won, posted 07-27-2020 6:49 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 4183 by ringo, posted 07-28-2020 9:30 AM Phat has replied
 Message 4185 by Hyroglyphx, posted 07-28-2020 10:29 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4184 of 4573 (880041)
07-28-2020 10:25 AM
Reply to: Message 4183 by ringo
07-28-2020 9:30 AM


Re: What Makes Christians Ignorant?
True and yet not the whole story. Its not that I ignore what the Bible says. I ignore what you think the Bible says. You emphasize a message and not a messenger. I see the two as one. Jesus was and is the Word eternal. You dont get to have a secular humanist socialist world where humanism reigns and God and His Son dont actually exist. I may even give as much spare change away as you do...though I could do better. As far as the apologists go, count me as one. Show me my lies.
At best, you will showcase my flesh warring against the Spirit. You wont catch me lying about anything. You might catch me ignoring some things occasionally, however.
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4183 by ringo, posted 07-28-2020 9:30 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4188 by ringo, posted 07-28-2020 12:15 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4186 of 4573 (880043)
07-28-2020 10:38 AM
Reply to: Message 4174 by jar
07-27-2020 3:19 PM


Re: What Makes Christians Ignorant?
jar writes:
What makes so many Christians ignorant is that they were taught not to think; to trust source over content and belief over evidence and fantasy over reality.
You are a Christian.
Was Jesus eternal or was He simply Mary's son? What does the Nicene Creed say? What dis Joe Wood teach you? What does the evidence show?
Do you believe that He died and rose from the dead? Or do you simply believe that only GOD knows, that all of us will eventually do the same thing(with no need to change or be transformed by the renewing of our minds) and that we are all as good as Jesus? You say that evidence is over belief. I am gathering evidence that you represent the name of Christian any more than someone who believes that Jesus lives today in their heart, mind, and everywhere.
God is source. The Spirit is source. Your behavior and my behavior are content. Thus, you do have a point in that idea.I link source and content together just as I try and convince ringo that messenger and message are linked together.
As far as fantasy over reality, the jury is still out and likely wont have a decision to show us personally until after we die.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4174 by jar, posted 07-27-2020 3:19 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4187 by jar, posted 07-28-2020 11:01 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4283 of 4573 (881347)
08-22-2020 3:55 PM
Reply to: Message 4278 by ringo
08-21-2020 1:02 PM


Re: Bannon arrested for fraud
Surely you dont expect your precious Socialism and human altruism to extend to every single person on the planet. We all would be broke as a joke and inevitably a tyrant would emerge to run the whole show. Unless you have faith that humans can be honorable and good if only they would try it. (No God Needed)

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4278 by ringo, posted 08-21-2020 1:02 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4284 by jar, posted 08-22-2020 3:58 PM Phat has replied
 Message 4288 by ringo, posted 08-23-2020 10:18 AM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4285 of 4573 (881351)
08-22-2020 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 4284 by jar
08-22-2020 3:58 PM


Re: Bannon arrested for fraud
jar writes:
no God has EVER been able to do squat.
Including convincing you to believe in them.
You chose logic, reason, reality and evidence and continue to mock any reasoned argumentation.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4284 by jar, posted 08-22-2020 3:58 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4286 by jar, posted 08-22-2020 4:38 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 4287 by jar, posted 08-22-2020 4:40 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4289 of 4573 (881696)
08-27-2020 3:28 PM
Reply to: Message 4288 by ringo
08-23-2020 10:18 AM


Re: Bannon arrested for fraud
ringo writes:
Humans invented honor and goodness.
Luke 18:18-23 writes:
Now a certain ruler asked Him, saying, "Good Teacher, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?"
19 So Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. 20 You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery,' 'Do not murder,' 'Do not steal,' 'Do not bear false witness,' 'Honor your father and your mother.'"
21 And he said, "All these things I have kept from my youth."
22 So when Jesus heard these things, He said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell all that you have and distribute to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me."
23 But
Granted, this scripture not only supports the idea that humans do not have a corner on the market for goodness, but that humans who lack awareness would do well to sell all that they have. This scripture scares me, even though it proves my point that humans did not originate goodness. (Unless you argue that humans wrote the story and God had nothing to do with it, which sounds like something your evidence based thinking would try. )

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4288 by ringo, posted 08-23-2020 10:18 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4290 by Coragyps, posted 08-27-2020 3:35 PM Phat has replied
 Message 4291 by dwise1, posted 08-27-2020 4:50 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 4294 by ringo, posted 08-27-2020 9:35 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4292 of 4573 (881706)
08-27-2020 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 4290 by Coragyps
08-27-2020 3:35 PM


Re: Bannon arrested for fraud
Coragyps writes:
Humans did write the story, Phat.
There is no evidence that any god has ever existed other than in human minds.
I realize that any evidence is only in our minds(and hearts) and that you may well argue that atheists have the same love for others and that people who claim to know God are nothing special. All that I might say is that some things cannot be proven through evidence because there is no evidence (at least objectively)

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4290 by Coragyps, posted 08-27-2020 3:35 PM Coragyps has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4293 by jar, posted 08-27-2020 5:48 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 4296 by Coragyps, posted 09-05-2020 10:55 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4314 of 4573 (882383)
09-20-2020 8:15 AM
Reply to: Message 4307 by AZPaul3
09-18-2020 10:31 PM


Ruth Bader Ginsburgs Eulogy
Message 1 (I made a thread soley regarding Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburgs passing and political impact.)
I perked up when you mentioned employer rights. Overall I thought she dis an excellent job at providing a check and balance against the conservatives.
Our system works better that way.
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4307 by AZPaul3, posted 09-18-2020 10:31 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4337 of 4573 (882649)
10-03-2020 8:19 AM
Reply to: Message 4336 by Percy
10-03-2020 7:46 AM


Re: Re: I'm Only Human
Cryptically for them, that is true. Reality does not prefer one political party over another. And I'm with jar in that I will pray for POTUS while he remains with us, in office or out. I smell a rat, though. How is it that #POTUS and #FLOTUS both catch Covid19 and have such mild symptoms (as reported earlier) and suddenly he is taken to the hospital? Everyone I have known who caught COVID has recovered, but they report that it was like the absolute worst case of the Flu that they had ever had. It knocked them flat for one week and an additional week to recover enough to emerge from quarantine...and even after the 14 day window, it took yet another week to resume somewhat normal activities.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4336 by Percy, posted 10-03-2020 7:46 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4338 by jar, posted 10-03-2020 8:26 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 4339 by DrJones*, posted 10-03-2020 11:26 AM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


(1)
Message 4346 of 4573 (882681)
10-04-2020 3:51 PM
Reply to: Message 4336 by Percy
10-03-2020 7:46 AM


Taking Care Of Business
My friend Steve from Portugal sent me an entertaining yet sobering article from European media, I think.
The Reckless Indifference of the GOP | by umair haque | Eudaimonia and Co
Here is a better link to the author:
umair haque — Medium
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4336 by Percy, posted 10-03-2020 7:46 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4381 of 4573 (883203)
11-15-2020 9:54 AM
Reply to: Message 4380 by AZPaul3
11-15-2020 1:55 AM


Addressing "nature spirits" from Arizona
No comprende. What are Trump and the Elephant doing? Praying? Perhaps they should have included The Donkey....matter of fact, boot Trump out of that prayer...and insert the American people!

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4380 by AZPaul3, posted 11-15-2020 1:55 AM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4382 by DrJones*, posted 11-15-2020 12:51 PM Phat has replied
 Message 4385 by AZPaul3, posted 11-15-2020 1:16 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4383 of 4573 (883208)
11-15-2020 12:55 PM
Reply to: Message 4382 by DrJones*
11-15-2020 12:51 PM


Re: Addressing "nature spirits" from Arizona
my bad. I just had eye surgery and cant see so well. I doubt that the elephant is as devoted to destruction as Trump might be. Any of the mature elephants know that politics is cyclical. We need a bit of both extremes and if wise, strive to achieve a middle ground consensus. Any of you who believe otherwise are far too godless and liberal and need Jesus.,
But my opinion is that no dynamite is needed. Biden won. A majority elected him. Get over it.
Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4382 by DrJones*, posted 11-15-2020 12:51 PM DrJones* has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4384 by DrJones*, posted 11-15-2020 1:02 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 4386 by AZPaul3, posted 11-15-2020 1:19 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4399 of 4573 (883283)
11-25-2020 3:25 PM
Reply to: Message 4398 by ringo
11-25-2020 11:08 AM


Re: Trump's not your real problem
ringo writes:
The United States is a democratic republic.
And its telling how we are split roughly down the middle politically. Thank God no one side dominates!
On the one hand you would have conservative fascists and on the other you would witches running the place!

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killo
The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him. Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4398 by ringo, posted 11-25-2020 11:08 AM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4401 by ramoss, posted 11-25-2020 5:17 PM Phat has replied
 Message 4411 by ringo, posted 11-26-2020 11:43 AM Phat has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4409 of 4573 (883299)
11-26-2020 10:16 AM
Reply to: Message 4401 by ramoss
11-25-2020 5:17 PM


Re: Trump's not your real problem
Im being serious! But I like your sense of humor!
I likely will never coinvince you guys that the supernatural...errr I mean the UNEXPLAINED...is real. You might someday see it for yourself.
And no jar, I am not one of "them" that prefers fantasy over reality. I have seen enough evidence in my own eyes.
Anyway I hope all of you have a blessed Thanksgiving!

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killo
The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him. Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4401 by ramoss, posted 11-25-2020 5:17 PM ramoss has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18262
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 4410 of 4573 (883300)
11-26-2020 10:21 AM
Reply to: Message 4407 by Tangle
11-26-2020 8:19 AM


COVID at Church
I do agree with you that many doctrines of organized religion need to come out of the dark ages. Holy Communion may well protect us spiritually but it is wise to be cautious and acknowledge that science is science and not witchcraft.
We wear masks at church and we dont drink from the same cup. We use Lysol in the church bathrooms and floors. Once we determine that our brethren or sisters are not sick (imprecise to be sure...we don't check each others temperature) we let our guard down a bit, just as one would do with a close friend or family member. But my point is that we use caution and not just faith.
Our Pastor even caught COVID. He quarantined properly. We met over zoom for awhile and I believe we are doing it again. I dont attend every meeting.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.- Dr.John Lennox
The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killo
The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him. Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4407 by Tangle, posted 11-26-2020 8:19 AM Tangle has not replied

  
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