What Does Critical Thinking Mean To You?

I have a licensed counselor. He is on the state board of problem gambling.Through talking with him in sessions, I learn much of the research done and the methods such as The Stages Of Change Model and Rational Recovery.He is a good therapist, but I am a stubborn old coot. I often go around the same mountain several dozen times before I realize that i'm not getting anywhere. My therapist explained the addictive pattern in the brain and much of the stuff that I share here at EvC. He even suggested medications, which I have tried in the past but reject overall--they cause harm as well as good. Thanks for your input. I believe now that I am turning the corner on my problems.(many of them, anyway) The evidence is being gathered and quantified and is not yet in, however. Barring any relapse or other addictive behavior, my brain should begin changing back to how it is supposed to be. I need patience, accountability to health professionals, and good friends and relationships rather than just my internet ones. Thanks for your critique, though.

It is wise to be cautious about "still small voices". Especially if you hear them while sober.

How would you apply critical thinking to scripture? Is there any evidence that scripture has errors? (NT only,please) Must it be so? Faith is based on a conclusion, however...so you may have a point. Well...God gave us brains for a reason, I suppose.

Here it is two years later and my brain still has not changed yet. I am getting close, however and I do see a counselor. As I have said in several other threads, the change will happen beginning in roughly 60 more days and continue through the first of the year. Science tells us that a subject only changes when they want recovery and when they feel safe.I dont have a job at this time, so I hope that I feel safe enough. I am taking responsibility and looking for a job, however.

I started this topic way back in 2014. The reason that led me to peruse the archives for this topic were primarily that I saw Juvenissun engaging in the following exchange: Forum: Geology and the Great Flood
Topic: Did the Flood really happen?
RE: Message 2087 Should not critical thinking be the primary tool in a science forum with which to arrive at an agreeable methodology and consensus for further testing and examination?

I think that your public response to him is unwarranted. Forum Guidelines specifically state to ovoid personal attacks. At least let the guy post a few months before attacking his character. Which is and of itself not very Christian of you.But getting back to this specific thread, let me go back and reread our exchanges here and comment farther. But then you take evidence-based Critical Thinking too far when you use it to define a belief. As an example, what importance to you attach to the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ to your definition of whats important within your particular chapter of Club: Christian?

Did God serve a valuable purpose before He was "thrown away"? How about after?

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Does Jesus serve a valuable purpose as a simple tale told around a campfire?

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Do you agree with ringo that it is all about the message rather than the messenger?

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What critical thinking led you to the following assertions:

All apologists are basically liars

Christianity could well evolve into a secular humanist altruism, throwing Jesus away, and still maintain its brand within your club.

The Bible and/or bibles written were and are totally authored, edited,and redacted by humans. Human wisdom is basically all we have.

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jar writes:

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When it comes to the supernatural are there any other options than accepting things on Faith?

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In other areas do all religions ask people to shut off reasoning?

I would imagine that we are not required to park our brains at the door. I disagree that evidence should bee the default standard in regards to spiritual claims. If it is, I will be quite satisfied with subjective evidence. I need only convince myself beyond a reasonable doubt. I have no burning need to prove to the scientific community that I am relatively of sound mind (except for that belief in the supernatural )

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Edited by Phat, : No reason given.

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"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
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We must realize that the Reformation world view leads in the direction of government freedom. But the humanist world view with inevitable certainty leads in the direction of statism. This is so because humanists, having no god, must put something at the center, and it is inevitably society, government, or the state.- Francis A. Schaeffer

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The whole war between the atheist and the theist comes down to this: the atheist believes a 'what' created the universe; the theist believes a 'who' created the universe.
- Criss Jami, Killosophy

You are talking about quite a large group of people. Might I just say that it is quite as likely that you yourself are (perhaps unknowingly) a liar and a conman. You drive people away from a relationship with Jesus Christ. You have said that even if Jesus never existed and was simply a story told around a campfire the message still has value. Value to whom? Do you or do you not believe that God could care less if we even believed in "Her"? Is that not the same thing as throwing away all of the stories, apologetic marketing books and videos, human opinions, and church denominational propaganda and simply doing for the least of these? Again with the insults. You need the Holy Spirit, old man. You know darn well that I understand you better than anyone else at EvC (at least in regards to Christian beliefs) and if I am being willfully ignorant, it is simply resistance to what you teach. I think there is more to the story.

This is your opinion and is why you will forever be a questioning and doubting believer. Granted evidence is nearly impossible according to your standards but the fact that you see no reasoned argumentation from myself or other apologists simply shows your bias as to how YOU see Christianity within your own chosen world view. So in other words if you do the best you can for the least of these and follow the message, it is irrelevant whether or not you can have a relationship with God. And you justify it by knowing that nobody can tell you how such a relationship is even possible, much less yourself. The deceiving spirits worked their magic well through the Socratic teachers who got you to question and doubt the party line.I don't yet know what caused you to despise *all* of the apologists, though. Many of them are quite good and I never read them to learn how to think yet find that I arrived at the same conclusions that they did without knowing what they were going to say. To me, this is a confirmation of truth within Biblical Christianity that we can all arrive at similar truths independently.And they make sense too. They just sit well with us. We will claim that it is the Holy Spirit. You will claim that we lie to ourselves and engage in fanciful thinking. This is the lie that you believe. You don't think its possible to even know God and defend your logic by rhetorically asking yourself how you would even know which God you were talking to (or made up). I have told you before that I have no problem with this aspect of your belief. The Holy Spirit impresses on my heart the charge. When I obey it, He moves through me into the lives of others. When I ignore it (Him) I feel like crap. Reality is not what you think. It is not confined to what science can measure and objectify. I still have a little hope that you will put aside your bias and hatred for what apologetics teaches and open your mind enough to see the evidence for yourself.Why cant you just accept that we might be right? What would you do if the God we "made up" actually turns out to be real? What is so threatening and distasteful about the basic apologetic message?