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Author Topic:   CATO Institute had a big IMMIGRATION AND NATIONAL IDENTITY survey, April 27, 2021
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 54 of 137 (888229)
09-10-2021 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by Percy
09-10-2021 10:29 AM


Re: Percy's support for border walls documented.
I will be happy to quote your past posts. It will come later, because, I am about to go to work. I need to use a pencil when quoting.

You will probably say the quotes are out of context. Wont stop me showing you what your positions were in the decisive period that they mattered.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by Percy, posted 09-10-2021 10:29 AM Percy has seen this message

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 55 of 137 (888230)
09-10-2021 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 52 by PaulK
09-10-2021 10:17 AM


Re: The CATO poll is about all immigrants.
The brand new April 2021 poll is about ALL immigrants.

(-You attacked me for conflating immigrants with different immigration status, and you add specifically said this poll is about American views of legal immigrants. You deny your stupid obsession, now?)

Americans rarely worry about whether an immigrant is legal or illegal.

You said the 2021 poll gives you no reason to assume that "immigrants" also includes illegal immigrants.

I would urge you to look closer. Those polled were asked questions that should clue you in. Read the questions carefully.

(


This message is a reply to:
 Message 52 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 10:17 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 57 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 11:14 AM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 56 of 137 (888231)
09-10-2021 11:06 AM
Reply to: Message 53 by Percy
09-10-2021 10:29 AM


Re: Percy's support for border walls documented.
Do you deny that you said that border lands west of the Rio Grande need a wall?

Do you deny that you felt that any border land, in Texas, will need either the river or a wall?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 53 by Percy, posted 09-10-2021 10:29 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 70 by Percy, posted 09-10-2021 2:35 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 58 of 137 (888233)
09-10-2021 11:28 AM
Reply to: Message 57 by PaulK
09-10-2021 11:14 AM


Re: The CATO poll is about all immigrants.
Let me help you here, PaulK

1st generation immigrants (the only actual immigrants) themselves think 60% of Hispanic immigrants are illegal. They as also think 41% of Asians are illegal.

2ng generation immigrants (children of an immigrant parent) think 52% of Hispanic immigrants are illegal and 35% of Asian immigrants are illegal.

That should clue you in that 26% of those polled (first & 2and generation immigrants are 26% of the nation) consider immigrants to include illegals.

What about the other 74% of us?

Third generation Americans or higher think 49% of Hispanic immigrants are illegal and 26% of Asians are.

So, the poll questions about "immigrants" will mean that BOTH illegal & legal immigrants are included in the word's definition, unless otherwise stated.

Does that help clear up your confusion?

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 57 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 11:14 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 59 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 11:45 AM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 60 of 137 (888235)
09-10-2021 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 59 by PaulK
09-10-2021 11:45 AM


Re: The CATO poll is about all immigrants.
You keep on bringing up dishonest irrelevancies to clutter and confuse the point.

(You started participating in the thread, by simply quoting Percy's dishonest evasions of my evidence, in The Trump Presidency Thread. I quoted Hillary Clinton telling Christiane Amanpour, in 2014, that she would d er port the children held in custody. But Percy continued to lie)

(You lied by claiming I was attacking Hillary Clinton's new political position AGAINST DEPORTATION, in the 2016 Univision debate. I was not against her ultimate position against deportation, but Ramos had to beat it out of her. You said I was using her campaign position to smear Democrats as "amnesty" supporters. Percy did not lie to the level you did)

(And I support amnesty but said the Democratic party was a deportation party)

This last discussion has do with you saying that I I conflated illegal and illegal immigration. You say that I put all under the term "immigrant", and you linked to the 2021 poll, and said you saw nothing in the text that should cause us to consider the term "immigration", in the questions, to invlude illegal immigration.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 59 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 11:45 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 62 by ringo, posted 09-10-2021 12:09 PM LamarkNewAge has taken no action
 Message 64 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 12:31 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 63 of 137 (888239)
09-10-2021 12:14 PM


PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
Perhaps we should spend the whole thread on responding to lies?

That is what I have had to do.

He said I was saying Democrats were in favor of amnesty.

The Trump Presidency thread was full of Percy and me arguing, and I was attacking Democrats for being a deportation party.

PaulK is a dishonest disruptor.

I ask that he be removed from the discussion.


Replies to this message:
 Message 66 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 12:44 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 65 of 137 (888241)
09-10-2021 12:40 PM
Reply to: Message 64 by PaulK
09-10-2021 12:31 PM


Re: The CATO poll is about all immigrants.
So now I call all immigrants, illegal immigrants?

Plus I call Democrats an amnesty party?

Get the hell out of this thread!


This message is a reply to:
 Message 64 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 12:31 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 67 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 12:53 PM LamarkNewAge has taken no action

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 68 of 137 (888244)
09-10-2021 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 66 by PaulK
09-10-2021 12:44 PM


Re: PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
Look,clown.

I was saying Democrats would flip flop.

I was also attacking the idea of hard borders. The fact that some Democrats call the wall racist hardly says anything about the larger Democratic position.

(Democrats attacked the Trump border wall, generally, but Biden wont take down any of it. He just says 'not another foot

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 66 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 12:44 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 69 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 1:14 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 71 of 137 (888250)
09-10-2021 2:44 PM
Reply to: Message 69 by PaulK
09-10-2021 1:14 PM


Re: PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
Democrats, including Pelosi, called the wall racist. Not all, or most, Democrats called it racist.

But the vast majority of Democrats attacked the wall.

You did not back up your claim that most of Trump's wall simply replaced existing barriers.

Democrats flip flopped, but the attack on Trump was just a utilitarian political tactic.

Concern for the immigrants was not directly tied to the wall. Defeating Trump was the motive for attacking his wall.

The wall will escape being torn down, it seems


This message is a reply to:
 Message 69 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 1:14 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 73 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 3:23 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
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Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 72 of 137 (888251)
09-10-2021 3:02 PM
Reply to: Message 70 by Percy
09-10-2021 2:35 PM


Re: Percy's support for border walls documented.
So where is your effort to back up your claim that I opposed benefits for immigrants?

You took my analysis of public opinion ( with immigrants the decisive supporters, with an otherwise divided public) on a hypothetical & theoretical trade off scenario, and called me racist for a factual report.

(The 58 to 41 public support for the hypothetical trade off was largely due to 67% immigrant support. Immigrants are 14% of the population)

I was factually pointing out that Democrats never seem to budge above 47% support for increasing immigration levels, despite any hypothetical policy trade off.

(And the trade off was a secondary issue, related to a fictional landmark immigration level increase, unlike the issue of support for benefits in a status quo situation)

I was pointing out the fundamental political problem with increasing immigration.

Your accusation of me is massively wrong, on every level.

As for my comment about your support for walls, I will provide the quotes after work. Paulk only covered about 5% of what you said, despite his claims that he provided the context. He missed an entire paragraph in the first linked post, in the Trump Presidency Thread.

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 70 by Percy, posted 09-10-2021 2:35 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 78 by Percy, posted 09-10-2021 4:52 PM LamarkNewAge has taken no action

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 74 of 137 (888254)
09-10-2021 3:51 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by PaulK
09-10-2021 3:23 PM


Re: PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
The wall was controversial and much opposed a decade before Trump

This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 3:23 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 76 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 4:13 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 75 of 137 (888255)
09-10-2021 4:00 PM
Reply to: Message 73 by PaulK
09-10-2021 3:23 PM


Re: PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
Stenny Hoyar said Pelosi called all walls racist and immoral.

So you are wrong


This message is a reply to:
 Message 73 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 3:23 PM PaulK has replied

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 Message 77 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 4:15 PM LamarkNewAge has taken no action

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 81 of 137 (888262)
09-10-2021 8:47 PM
Reply to: Message 76 by PaulK
09-10-2021 4:13 PM


Re: PaulK started this thread, in post 31, by telling blatant lies.
The Secure Fence Act of 2006 was what built "The Wall" before Trump.

138 members of Congress, most Democrats opposed it.

(The same bill in the Senate was coupled with a path to citizenship, but it hot removed in conference)

Democrats who voted for the 2006 wall law said it was something done to avoid more draconian anti immigration laws. A pragmatic vote for a bad thing.

Ron Paul opposed The Wall, E Verify and Mass Deportation, in a 2015 interview, after Trump announced his candidacy.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 76 by PaulK, posted 09-10-2021 4:13 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 90 by PaulK, posted 09-11-2021 1:38 AM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 82 of 137 (888263)
09-10-2021 8:59 PM
Reply to: Message 80 by jar
09-10-2021 8:07 PM


Re: It ain't what it says it's what readers THINK it says.
Give an example.

Dont imitate Percy, AzPaul, and PaulK.

Percy and AzPaul flat out refuse to back up accusations.

PaulK started(post 31) by ignoring Percy's pro wall sentences in one post, and he selectively quoted 10% of the words in another post.

He then said that I called the Democratic party an amnesty party.

Then he claims I somehow am calling immigrants offensive names.

HIS bizarre "evidence" is built around 2 lame, dubious pieces of logic:

First is that I simply said "immigrants are deported" instead of "illegal immigrants are deported", so therefore I consider all immigrants to be "illegal".

Yup. That is the extent of his first piece of evidence.

Second piece of PaulK's evidence was my argument with him that poll questions about immigration will always include ALL immigrants, unless otherwise stated. By telling him that Americans understand "immigration" to include ALL immigrants, including illegal immigrants, then I am saying all immigrants are illegal immigrants.

(This site is getting to be a joke. First graders have better arguments!)

Give me your evidence Jar (I almost want to start putting the E word on quotes, around here)

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.

Edited by LamarkNewAge, : No reason given.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 80 by jar, posted 09-10-2021 8:07 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 83 by jar, posted 09-10-2021 9:00 PM LamarkNewAge has replied
 Message 93 by PaulK, posted 09-11-2021 2:14 AM LamarkNewAge has replied

  
LamarkNewAge 
Suspended Member
Posts: 2236
Joined: 12-22-2015


Message 84 of 137 (888265)
09-10-2021 9:01 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by jar
09-10-2021 9:00 PM


Re: It ain't what it says it's what readers THINK it says.
So you have no examples.

What a shock.


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Replies to this message:
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