The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
GDR, Plato, as well as many other nations, both ancient and modern, believe that the soul is an immortal entity.
The vast majority of Christian churches believe this same concept.
The Apostles, as well as God's true church, does not believe this, because it is not Biblical.
In the OT the Word "soul" comes from the Hebrew nephesh. It refers to a breathing animal.
Notice in Genesis 2:7 that Adam became a breathing soul after God breathed the breath of life into him.
Before God breathed life into the soul (Adam) it (soul) had neither consciousness nor awareness.
The creatures in Acts1:21, 24; 2:19 and 9:10, 12,15, 16, as well as numerous other places are from "nephesh", a soul.
Ezekiel 18:4, 20 states very clearly that the soul can indeed die.
In Matthew 16:25-26 the Greek word for soul (psuche) is used for both life and soul.
25 "For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it."
26. "For what is a man profited, if he should gain the whole world, and lose his own soul (life)? Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul (life)."
I am going to finish this, but it will have to wait for an hour or so.
Two of the workers at the animal shelter where I volunteer are sick. I must go check on the welfare of several horses. Someone called and reported them as being neglected.
GDR, most of the world believes that when we die we live on in another form or substance. The vast majority of Christian churches also teach this.
They teach that we are still conscious after death. Most of them teach that only our physical body dies.
The men who wrote the Holy Bible record a completely different perspective.
Very carefully read Job 14:10-15; Psalms 146: 3-4; Ecclesiastical 9:4-6, 10, as well as numerous other passages.
What these passages prove to us is that when an individual dies his very thoughts perish.
They show us that they have no consciousness; that the living know they will die but the dead no nothing.
When we die our wisdom and knowledge perishes. We can longer devise, plan, or scheme.
Job asks God to appoint him a set time and remember him.
Job states that he would wait his appointed time in the grave until his change came. His change will occur at the first resurrection when he would be raised with a spirit body as a born again son of God. A member of the God family.
King David was a man after God's on heart. He is mentioned more times in the Bible than anyone, even Abraham and Moses.
Peter tells us in Acts 2: 29, 34 that David is still dead and buried, and that He has not ascended to heaven.
Read Hebrews 11, the faith chapter. Notice that all these great men of faith died without receiving the promise.
That promise was/is eternal life. But they will receive this promise at the first resurrection.
Jesus said that no man had ascended to heaven. John 3:13.
Pagans teach that everyone lives on after death. The Holy Bible doesn't.
The Bible teaches only Christ can bring us back to consciousness.
The owner of the horses is on his way home. I will show that members of the God family will receive a spiritual body, just like their heavenly father.
GDR, take a look at Exodus 33:18-23. Moses was allow to see Jesus in all His glory. But, he was only allowed to see the backside of Him.
One could not even look on His face because he would die.
The prophet Daniel was allowed to see the angel Gabriel in his spiritual body. Daniel 10; 6.
Daniel describes him as having a body like beryl; face as the appearance of lightning; eyes as lamps of fire; arms and feet like polished brass; and, a voice as a multitude.
The Apostle Paul states those who become members of the God family will judge (rule over them) angels. 1 Cor. 6:3-5.
Romans 8:17 states that we will be joint-heirs with Christ. That we will be glorified together.
As Christ is so shall we be.
Read the rest of this chapter, especially vs. 29.
All who become members of the God family will then conform to the image of Christ. We will conform to the spiritual image of Chrict.
2 Peter 1:4 states that we will be partakers of God's devine nature.
Philippians 3:21 tells us that Christ will change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto His glorious body.
As sons of God we will inherit all things. The entire universe will be at our disposal.
We will then set about beautifying the entire universe.
God's occupation is that of a Creator. And so will we be.
There is now more than 200 galaxies for every human who has ever lived. This is a very conservative estimate.
Each member of the God family will have countless angels under them to assist them with their work.
As members of the God family we will have dominion over all things.
In Psalms 147:4 God knows the numbers of stars, and He calls all the stars in the universe by name.
In order for us to exercise dominion we must have a spiritual body in order to withstand the raging thermo- nuclear furnaces of more than 60 billion trillion sun's and every subatomic particle of every atom in the universe.
There's much more than this but this is all I have the time for.
GDR, most of the world believes that when we die we live on in another form or substance. The vast majority of Christian churches also teach this.
They teach that we are still conscious after death. Most of them teach that only our physical body dies.
The Biblical message is we are renewed bodily.
YOu are reading something into your quotations that just isn't there.
Here is a verse that is consistent with the NT covenant.
Paul writes this in his first letter to the Corinthians. Chap 1:10.
quote: to be put into effect when the times reach their fulfillment—to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ.
"All things in heaven and earth" That includes all things on earth. Revelation talks of the New jerusalem aoming to Earth and we are taught to pray "Your Kingdom come on Earth as in Heaven.
All through the NT there is talk of the resurrection of the dead, which of course begs the question of what is resurrection. That's easy to answewr. We jusy look at the resurrection of Jesus in a physical body that was like but also unlike His body prior to His death on the cross.
A bigger point is that in many ways it doesn't matter. What happends next is God's business. We are called to live Christ like lives based on God's love for us in this life. I suggest that it is a good idea to let God worry about the next one and just get on with loving our neighbour.
He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God.
GDR, Plato, as well as many other nations, both ancient and modern, believe that the soul is an immortal entity. The vast majority of Christian churches believe this same concept. The Apostles, as well as God's true church, does not believe this, because it is not Biblical.
Remind us again of which church is Gods "true church".
It wouldnt happen to be The United Church of God which evolved from Herbert W.Armstrongs Worldwide Church of God. Comments?
The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed
GDR, after Jesus was resurrected He did not have a physical body. He could walk right through walls.
After coming from the tomb, Jesus told Mary Magdalene:
John 20:17 "Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my father:"
Jesus, while not in His glorious spiritual body, was not in a physical body.
The Apostles were to be witnesses of His resurrection. They could not be witnesses if they were dead from seeing Him in all His glory.
Remember in Exodus 33 when Jesus told Moses that no one could no see Him in all His glory and live?
Jesus (as the Word) appeared to a number of men in the OT. But, He took on the body of a normal man. He can take on any body that He chooses.
The doctrine that Jesus was resurrected into a physical body is nothing more than philosophical concept.
It covers the fact that is our very life and not our puny body that we want to get back in the resurrection.
1 Corinthians 15:50
"Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inheritthe Kingdom of God; neither does corruption inherit incorruptible.
Vs. 53 "For this corruptible must put on incorruptible, and this mortal must put on immortality.
How anyone can read the entire chapter and not understand the the corruptible (flesh and blood) must put on the incorruptible (spirit body) is beyond me.
When Christ returns and sets His Kingdom up on earth He will still not at that time be in His fully glorified body.
His brightness would destroy all who are still mortal.
1 John 5:3 "For this is the love of God, that we keep His Commandments: and His Commandments are not grievous." Do, you believe that God's 10 Commandments are still binding?
You contradict yourself.
The commandments are not binding. "We" keep them for the love of God.
"We" who keep the commandments are God's church, not "we" who believe in the Trinity or "we" who believe this or that about "souls".
And John didn't mention "ten" commandments.
Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
GDR, after Jesus was resurrected He did not have a physical body. He could walk right through walls. After coming from the tomb, Jesus told Mary Magdalene: John 20:17 "Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my father:" Jesus, while not in His glorious spiritual body, was not in a physical body.
He also told Thomas to touch him. He ate fish. He walked with the two on the road to Emmaus and they clearly saw Him as a physical being. Yes, there was something different about His renewed physicality but He was physical.
He has told you, O man, what is good ; And what does the LORD require of you But to do justice, to love kindness, And to walk humbly with your God.
Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.
"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed. Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
GDR, Jesus could also drink and eat, but this was not His glorious spiritual body.
Decades after Jesus' resurrection the Apostle John wrote This:
1John 3:2 "Beloved, now we are the sons of God, and it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when He shall appear, we shall be like Him; for we shall see Him as He is.
John had seen Jesus after the resurrection, and he knew for certain that the body Jesus was then in was not His Glorious body.
When John wrote this he was a begotten Son of God, but not yet a born son of God (born again).
People misunderstand the concept of "born again."
Those who are resurrected as born again sons of God are spirit beings.
John describes those born again in John 3:3-8. They are invisible to mortal eyes.
In Revelation 1, John, in a vision, saw the risen Christ.
Vs.14-16 "His head and His hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and His eyes were as a flame of fire;
And His feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; His voice as the sound of many waters.
And He had in His right hand seven stars: and out of His mouth went a sharp two-edged sword: and His countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength."
His countenance (face) would have destroyed all witnesses of His resurrection.
Ringo, love is what binds the 10 Commandments together. Love for and from God is what gives us the motivation to respect and keep His laws.
The two greatest Commandments are to "love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind."
"This is the first and great commandment."
"And the second is like unto it, 'thou shall love thy neighbor as thyself."
"On these two Commandments hang all the law and prophets."
The other 8 Commandments are only possible for us to keep if we truly love God and our fellow humans.
Which of the other 8 Commandments can we toss away if we truly love others?
Can we steal from them? Lie to them? Commit adultery against them? Which Commandments does God say it is now okay to continually break?
Nine of the 10 Commandments are reiterated in the NT, in various places.
The 4th Commandment (keep the Sabbath) was strictly observed for all to see.
There are several instances of the church meeting on the Sabbath.
Here are just two that involves the Gentiles:
Acts 13: 42 "And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath."
If the Sabbath had indeed been done away with, why didn't Paul just tell them this?
He could have easily told them that there was no need to wait until the next Sabbath; that he would preach to them the following day, which would be the first day of the week.
Acts 13: 44 "And the next Sabbath Day came almost the whole city to hear the word of God."
There is no place in the NT where the Sabbath is said to no longer be in effect.
Read Hebrews 8: 6-13. It plainly states that God's laws will be put into our minds, and written in our hearts.
This is the exact opposite of being done away with.
For those in the first resurrection this will happen during this current age.
For the vast majority of all who has ever lived this will occur during the second resurrection.
™ Version 4.2
(1)