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Author Topic:   COVID vaccine works - we're saved!
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(1)
Message 1046 of 1110 (910508)
04-25-2023 7:07 PM
Reply to: Message 1034 by Kleinman
04-25-2023 12:47 PM


Re: Excess Mortality
Kleinman writes:
You still refuse to post a quote from your links that shows how many people died with covid and also had comorbidities. Should a person with terminal cancer and dies be reported as dying from covid, or should covid be considered a contributing factor?
...
You posted the links. Post quotes from your links that you think are relevant.
It was just one link and you weren't clear about precisely what data you needed. Is the data in this link what you want: Comorbidities and other conditions. I have no idea what point you're trying to make regarding comorbidities, so only you know if that data is what you want.
If you think you have something relevant in your links, why don't your quote it? Why are incidence rates higher for several months for people wearing masks when compared to people not wearing masks? You posted the graph.
You've lost the plot. You hinted that papers on masks causing worse covid outcomes existed:
Kleinman in Message 1028 writes:
What about when the death rates are higher with masks than without masks? What's your spin on that?
So I found a couple papers that seemed to be what you were referring to and posted them. Are they about the kinds of effects you're thinking of?
About this again:
You posted a graph that shows an increased incidence of covid infection in people wearing masks than in people not wearing masks.
Again, I posted no such graph. If you're really so sure I did then it should be easy for you to find.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1034 by Kleinman, posted 04-25-2023 12:47 PM Kleinman has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1049 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-25-2023 7:17 PM Percy has replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 1050 of 1110 (910512)
04-25-2023 7:17 PM
Reply to: Message 1038 by Kleinman
04-25-2023 4:02 PM


Re: Dr. Fauci Speaks
Kleinman writes:
Whatever
I think what you meant was, "Pardon me, my mistake."
This incorrect notion came from somewhere. Joe Biden made the claim. Where do you think Joe Biden gets his expert advice?
For the third time, I think Biden got it wrong all by himself. For some reason you keep rehashing this.
Percy:
I don't understand why anti-vaxxers like you and Jensen try to disguise the fact that you're anti-vaxxers.
Percy is an expert in vaccines.
Why not just be truthful about your position? It's not like you're fooling anyone.
Try to explain how comorbidities affect the data for the death rate from covid.
You are very repetitive. Does the link I provided have the data you want?
Go ahead, take whatever advice Fauci has to offer.
Again, this is just you talking to yourself.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1038 by Kleinman, posted 04-25-2023 4:02 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1052 by Kleinman, posted 04-25-2023 7:39 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 1053 of 1110 (910515)
04-25-2023 7:42 PM
Reply to: Message 1049 by Tanypteryx
04-25-2023 7:17 PM


Re: Excess Mortality
Tanypteryx writes:
I think he's referring to your Kansas graph, maybe?
Could be, since he doesn't seem to understand it, not realizing that the yellow line is continuous and represents the same 24 counties all the way from its origin to the right hand side. The only thing that changes is that on July 1 those 24 counties opted-in on the state's mask mandate.
But if that's the graph he means then I still don't know how he's misinterpreting it. He's going to have to tell me.
Or if it's some other graph then if he tells me which graph he means and why he thinks it shows masks causing worse covid outcomes then I'll address it.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1049 by Tanypteryx, posted 04-25-2023 7:17 PM Tanypteryx has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1055 by Kleinman, posted 04-25-2023 7:57 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(1)
Message 1080 of 1110 (910638)
05-01-2023 9:01 AM


The Brain and Long Covid
The March, 2023, issue of Scientific American included an article on The Brain and Long Covid. I know at least one person with long covid (3 years and running) and possibly one other (after a couple months he still can't get back on the tennis court, but it's too early to be sure this is long covid).
According to the article about 16 million US adults are affected by long covid. Symptoms include pain, extreme fatigue and brain fog. Around 2 to 4 million have been severely enough affected to be forced out of work. Around 20% of people who come down with covid go on to develop long covid symptoms, sometimes for extended periods of time.
Increasingly long covid is being recognized as a neurological disease, that some kind of nerve dysfunction is involved, often related to the autonomic nervous system. Long covid is a potentially debilitating syndrome, and everyone should be doing all they can to avoid catching covid, both for themselves and for all those around them. That means tailoring one's behavior to circumstances. Get vaccinated, get your boosters, and when in an area of higher case rates consider using additional approaches such as isolation and masking. There's no such thing as 100% protection, but these actions to reduce the likelihood and severity of covid, and thereby of long covid.
Covid isn't done with us, and so we shouldn't be done with covid, either. Inflammation of the nervous system is suspected of playing a significant role, including by immune cells called microphages, but scientists are only beginning to narrow in on causes. Apparently the virus can linger in the brain for months, long after the infection is deemed over.
My friend with long covid caught it in April of 2020, long before the vaccine, but he's averse to doctors and refused vaccination. He was making a slow comeback last year when he caught covid again, and he now spends most of his time on the coach.
My other friend with possible long covid announced last year that he had a robust immune system and didn't need vaccines. After catching covid a few months ago he still hasn't resumed normal activities.
--Percy

Replies to this message:
 Message 1081 by Tangle, posted 05-01-2023 10:17 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(1)
Message 1085 of 1110 (910699)
05-06-2023 10:50 AM
Reply to: Message 1083 by Tangle
05-06-2023 4:10 AM


With all the deaths still occurring (covid is expected to be the 3rd leading cause of death in the US this year) it is puzzling that that so many still minimize the threat.
A common argument is that because the elderly, especially those with comorbidities, were the group most affected that the pandemic wasn't really a big deal, but there are several problems with this.
First, the lives of the elderly are valuable, too.
Second, nearly 25% of deaths in the US were of people younger than 65.
Third, long covid is affecting a great many people. Around 30% of those who become ill with covid get long covid, but that includes people who take longer than a few weeks to recover fully. I'd have to guess at how many have permanent long covid, but I would put it at around 10%.
Fourth, they've discovered that covid has a serious neurological component, causing brain damage that people aren't aware of at the time. It is possible that those who think they fully recovered could suffer neurological symptoms and/or deficiencies down the road. For instance, it wouldn't be surprising to find that as people age dementia is found to be more common in those who once had covid.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1083 by Tangle, posted 05-06-2023 4:10 AM Tangle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1086 by Theodoric, posted 05-06-2023 11:01 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 1087 of 1110 (911028)
06-02-2023 3:55 PM


Public Health and Safety
The article https://www.nbcnews.com/...nths-arrest-warrant-was-rcna87372 reports that V.N., a Washington state woman who refused treatment for tuberculosis and refused to isolate, was arrested today. She'll be detained in a "negative pressure" room in the Pierce County jail until her treatment is complete and she's no longer a contagion threat.
About 600 people die of tuberculosis in the US every year. The number would be much higher but for the fact that we take the threat of tuberculosis very seriously and work hard to prevent its spread. But people die of tuberculosis anyway. I just found out yesterday that a former boss, younger than me and in the midst of beginning a high-tech startup, died of tuberculosis last month.
Tuberculosis is an example of government doing what is necessary to maintain public health, and it baffles me that so many people did not want government to do its job in the case of covid, which killed at a rate at least a thousand times higher than tuberculosis in 2020 and 2021.
Likely around 10,000 people will die of covid this year, many, many more than tuberculosis. It is beyond me that the threat doesn't convince people of the need for vaccinations and boosters, and to vote in public officials who work to reduce the likelihood that people could be infected by other members of the public.
--Percy

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(4)
Message 1097 of 1110 (911458)
07-06-2023 6:47 AM
Reply to: Message 1089 by Porkncheese
07-04-2023 6:17 AM


Re: High deaths from covid injections... The new normal
Porkncheese writes:
If they really cared for the health of the civilians and had nothing to hide then they would investigate this.
I don't see how you can care about this when pigs are flying and interfering with air traffic and causing plane crashes and the deaths of thousands. The only reason you don't hear about it is because our governments are ignoring it. If they really cared for the lives of their citizens they would be investigating this.
Omigod, a pig just crashed through my picture window. That's all the evidence you need.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1089 by Porkncheese, posted 07-04-2023 6:17 AM Porkncheese has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1099 by Omnivorous, posted 07-08-2023 8:59 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(2)
Message 1100 of 1110 (912438)
09-01-2023 12:51 PM


"They're back!"
The quote is from the 1986 move Poltergeist 2, but of course I'm talking about the virus. Reports are coming in from across the country of rising covid rates with different variants in different regions. All the articles say we shouldn't be concerned.
The more recent virus variants have followed a trend of becoming less lethal, but there's also hints of it becoming more infectious and less vulnerable to vaccines and our immune systems. Hopefully the articles are correct that there's no reason for concern, but if I haven't already said it somewhere in this thread I'll say it now: We might be done with the virus, but the virus isn't done with us.
Predicting the future is a fool's game, but I'll try anyway. I think there will be an uptick in covid infections this winter, but because of the milder symptoms most people won't get tested or if they do they're results won't be reported, so we'll have a really poor handle on how bad it is. The only hard statistics we'll have is hospitalizations, which will tick up, especially for the older community. Hospitalizations of older people may be the only way we'll know how bad it is.
And don't forget long covid. Long covid is a very, very bad thing. You do not want to risk long covid.
Prudence dictates taking measures to reduce the odds of catching covid. Even the milder forms of covid we now see can be lethal to anyone - the older you are the worse it might be. Certainly anyone over 60 should get the new vaccine booster when it becomes available.
--Percy

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(7)
Message 1106 of 1110 (913555)
11-13-2023 11:58 AM


Republican Aversion to Covid Vaccine
If I haven't already said it in this thread then I'll say it now: the covid pandemic had an outsized effect on red states. I just became aware of a scientific study published in July of this year that makes this point even more clear: Excess Death Rates for Republican and Democratic Registered Voters in Florida and Ohio During the COVID-19 Pandemic
As the study's title says, they looked at Republican and Democratic voters in Florida and Ohio. They found that excess mortality was "significantly higher for Republican voters than Democratic voters after COVID-19 vaccines were available to all adults, but not before."
How significantly higher was the excess mortality? After May, 2021 (in other words, well after covid vaccines became available), "the excess death rate among Republican voters was 43% higher than the excess death rate among Democratic voters." The study concludes that vaccination attitudes can not only have fatal results, but also affected "the severity and trajectory of the pandemic in the US."
Emphasizing this, obviously many of the people who died of covid echoed some of the false statements made in this thread, such as that the vaccines don't work and that the vaccines killed more people than covid. This is proof once again that believing in lies and fantasies can kill you.
About deaths from the covid vaccines, Have vaccine side effects resulted in any deaths? | COVID Vaccine Facts says that there were 310 million doses given by June of 2021. This would be approximately 150 million individuals, since most of the vaccines were originally a two-dose set. 5343 deaths of people after taking the vaccine were reported to the VAERS system, which just accepts reports and does not investigate cause. VAERS is just a starting point for finding problems.
But in the US 2.8 million people die every year of all causes, so among the 150 million people who took the vaccine during the six month period of the study there would normally be around a 650,000 deaths, or about 110,000 deaths per month. Inevitably many of these deaths would occur within weeks of taking the vaccine. 5343 deaths reported to the VAERS system is an incredibly small number, and the CDC has attributed only 9 deaths to the vaccines, specifically to the J&J vaccine that has a slight tendency to cause blood clots.
--Percy

Replies to this message:
 Message 1107 by AZPaul3, posted 11-13-2023 1:31 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied
 Message 1108 by Percy, posted 11-19-2023 12:39 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 1108 of 1110 (913592)
11-19-2023 12:39 PM
Reply to: Message 1106 by Percy
11-13-2023 11:58 AM


Re: Republican Aversion to Covid Vaccine
I earlier predicted that the covid infection rate would show itself this winter as hospitalizations, and that's turning out to be the case. As reported by COVID Map Shows Where Hospitalizations Have Risen Most, the CDC has recently released data showing covid ticking up. Some might detect a very modest red/blue state difference. Here's a map:
Key:
Dark Orange:>20% increase
Lignt Orange:10-20% increase
Yellow:Stable (between %10 decrease and 10% increase)
Lignt Green:10-20% decrease
Dark Green:>20% decrease
Now let's put all the states in a table and include how they voted in the last presidential election:
Alaska>20% increaseTrump
Arizona>20% increaseBiden
Hawaii>20% increaseBiden
Iowa>20% increaseTrump
Minnesota>20% increaseBiden
Montana>20% increaseTrump
Nebraska>20% increaseTrump
New Mexico>20% increaseBiden
North Dakota>20% increaseTrump
Tennessee>20% increaseTrump
Vermont>20% increaseBiden
Virginia>20% increaseBiden
Washington D.C.>20% increaseBiden
West Virginia>20% increaseTrump
Wisconsin>20% increaseBiden
Alabama10-20% increaseTrump
Arkansas10-20% increaseTrump
Illinois10-20% increaseBiden
Indiana10-20% increaseTrump
Kentucky10-20% increaseTrump
Michigan10-20% increaseBiden
Mississippi10-20% increaseTrump
Ohio10-20% increaseTrump
Oklahoma10-20% increaseTrump
Pennsyvania10-20% increaseBiden
Puerto Rico10-20% increaseNo Vote
Texas10-20% increaseTrump
Utah10-20% increaseTrump
Virgin Islands10-20% increaseNo Vote
California10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Colorado10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Connecticut10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Delaware10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Georgia10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Idaho10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Kansas10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Louisiana10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Maine10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Maryland10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Missouri10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Nevada10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
New Hampshire10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
New York10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
North Carolina10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Oregon10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
South Carolina10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
South Dakota10% decrease to 10% increaseTrump
Washington10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Wyoming10% decrease to 10% increaseBiden
Florida10-20% decreaseTrump
Masschusetts10-20% decreaseBiden
Rhode Island10-20% decreaseBiden
New Jersey>20% decreaseBiden
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1106 by Percy, posted 11-13-2023 11:58 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22695
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


(1)
Message 1109 of 1110 (913688)
11-29-2023 9:13 AM


Covid and Life Expectancy in the US
As reported by many news outlets over the past couple years, life expectancy in the US and other countries dropped during covid but has rebounded since. But according to New CDC life expectancy data shows painfully slow rebound from covid, the rebound in the US has been less than in other similar countries and continues to rise only very gradually here.
In 2019 life expectancy was 78.8 years in the US, then dropped to 76.4 in 2021. It has since risen to 77.5 for 2022. For other western nations the drop was smaller than ours and the rise larger and faster. Why?
The US covid experience was more severe than other peer countries, with the US experiencing the highest death rate per capita among wealthy nations becausen large regions of the nation were highly skeptical and resistant to shutdowns, masking and vaccines. These regions tended to suffer the brunt of the covid impact. The changes are best illustrated in a graph:
Sweden's life expectancy in 2022 was 83.1 years, more than 5½ years longer than the US.
--Percy

Replies to this message:
 Message 1110 by Theodoric, posted 11-30-2023 11:02 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
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