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Author Topic:   Anti-theist
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 615 of 895 (894751)
05-28-2022 8:43 AM
Reply to: Message 614 by AZPaul3
05-27-2022 7:35 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
AZPaul3 writes:
That's your bible, Phat. The paulene version of the jesus religion.
Rewriting slightly, don't know if you'll agree: "That's your bible, Phat. The Paulene version of the Jesus religion myth."
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 614 by AZPaul3, posted 05-27-2022 7:35 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 616 by AZPaul3, posted 05-28-2022 8:53 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied
 Message 617 by jar, posted 05-28-2022 9:01 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 635 of 895 (894834)
05-30-2022 3:33 PM
Reply to: Message 624 by Dredge
05-29-2022 8:43 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
Dredge writes:
Jesus gave "the keys of the kingdom of heaven" to one man - Peter - thereby making Peter the head of the Church. (Matt 16:18-19)
Naturally the community of the church founded by Peter would write an account establishing their church as the one true church ordained by God. The accounts written by other communities say no such thing. That you cite one book of the Bible while ignoring the silence of all the rest is telling.
Violent, hateful and pitifully inhumane. Catholic.
You sound pretty adept at the hate game yourself.
You're in essence saying, "You're as hateful as me," in response to AZPaul3 effectively making the point that yours is a Paulene church. You agree to the hate but ignore the main point.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 624 by Dredge, posted 05-29-2022 8:43 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 636 of 895 (894835)
05-30-2022 3:55 PM
Reply to: Message 627 by Dredge
05-29-2022 9:19 PM


Re: Prayer For The Universe
Dredge writes:
jar writes:
Phat, I'm simply reporting what is actually written in the Bible stories. In the stories Jesus told his disciples that the End Times would be during their lifetime. Time passed. All the first crop of disciples was dying off yet there was no End Times or signs of End Times. Jesus prophesy failed.
Where is that prophesy of Jesus in the Bible?
Jar's reply wasn't specific, but I think he means Matthew 24 where Jesus relates many prophecies and then says:
quote
Matthew 24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 627 by Dredge, posted 05-29-2022 9:19 PM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 637 by Tangle, posted 05-30-2022 4:21 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 728 of 895 (895602)
07-07-2022 2:43 PM
Reply to: Message 727 by ringo
07-07-2022 12:45 PM


Re: A few videos that No one will watch
[tongue-in-cheek]
ringo writes:
I've been trying to tell you, financial collapses happen all the time.
Phat's is the correct view of reality, which is contained in Youtube videos - we all know that!
How do you fight a war after a financial collapse? And if you can still fight wars, why can't you still do all of the other things that humans do?
We all know that financial collapses send everyone back to living in caves.
And humanity has never had challenges before?
But these are different.
I'll say this again, on the off-chance that it might get through your thick skull:
Images of Don Quixote tilting with windmills come to mind.
I don't know why you keep asking the same questions over and over again. Do you expect to get different answers?
It *is* a puzzlement.
[/tongue-in-cheek]
I keep hearing about a "crash" that happened in 2008 - but I never even noticed it at the time. (It may have been when I didn't have a TV.)
Waxing serious for a moment, there was a huge financial collapse that began in 2007 brought on by the subprime mortgage scandal. Here in the States there was a recession that lasted from the end of 2007 through the middle of 2009. Like you our family was largely unaffected because my wife and I both kept our jobs, though both our companies had layoffs and froze wages. Lehman Brothers failed. Merrill-Lynch was forced to find a buyer, which turned out to be Bank of America. General Motors required a federal bailout. 25 banks failed, nearly overstressing the FDIC. Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae were taken over by the federal government. The Fed had to print a lot of money. Morgan Stanley was restructured. Bear Stearns had to be acquired by JPMorgan Chase. There was a federal rescue of Citigroup. (All these failures are still familiar to me, but I couldn't recall all of them at once and had to refresh my memory by looking them up.)
But it was a pretty difficult time for a lot of people, and many lost their homes (some at the same time they lost their jobs) because they'd been granted mortgages beyond their ability to pay. The triggering factor for the financial crisis was when it was realized, rather suddenly, that most of the bundles of subprime mortgages called mortgage-backed securities deserved junk status.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 727 by ringo, posted 07-07-2022 12:45 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 747 of 895 (897225)
08-31-2022 3:30 PM
Reply to: Message 745 by Phat
08-30-2022 3:43 PM


Re: Something Positive
Phat writes:
Its not Trump I agree with, it's conservative platforms like continuing with oil and gas until we get green off the ground, which most experts say will take between 10 and 20 years.
No one who's taken seriously is arguing for abandoning fossil fuels before alternatives are in place. Where conservatives and liberals differ is the degree to which government should play a role in encouraging the transition.
Its keeping the place running instead of making ourselves feel the pinch while China burns coal and goes full ahead.
As new technologies are increasingly adopted they inevitably become cheaper. That's what happens with everything, from cars to rockets to computers. The price of solar is a fraction of what it was 30 years ago, same for wind, same for batteries. To the extent China stays married to fossil fuels they fall further behind. They also remain a major contributor to climate change while making the planet a dirtier place for everyone.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 745 by Phat, posted 08-30-2022 3:43 PM Phat has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 759 of 895 (897533)
09-07-2022 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 756 by Phat
09-07-2022 12:05 PM


Re: Keyword: Son. We are sons, not slaves.
Please get help. I'm sure that from inside yourself it feels like you're making sense, but you're not. I don't believe your claims of improved health. If you really believe you're getting healthier then you're fooling yourself. It isn't possible that you're getting healthier at the same time that you're sinking more and more deeply into irrationality and senselessness.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 756 by Phat, posted 09-07-2022 12:05 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 761 by Phat, posted 09-08-2022 11:10 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 780 of 895 (897702)
09-10-2022 8:52 AM
Reply to: Message 777 by Phat
09-09-2022 9:35 PM


Re: How I feel about religion
You are way past the point in life when you should be taken in by the equivalent of used car salesmen. I was just looking at a summary of Shapiro's views. I didn't know he believes homosexuality should be classified as a mental illness.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 777 by Phat, posted 09-09-2022 9:35 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 781 by Theodoric, posted 09-10-2022 11:23 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 800 of 895 (897779)
09-12-2022 9:32 AM
Reply to: Message 799 by ringo
09-11-2022 3:43 PM


Re: Hatred Of Thinking?
You keep commenting on Phat's lack of comprehension, but he brings that same lack of comprehension to your comments about his lack of comprehension. It's like explaining thinks to a chatbot. For example, here are some Cleverbot responses to things you've said recently:
ringo writes:
Nor will any human. We can assign meaning. We can't "discover" it.
Cleverbot writes:
I am a human
...
ringo writes:
The idea of Christianity that I am expressing comes straight from the Bible, straight from Jesus Himself, according to the only evidence of Him that we have. You're mocking the Bible and you're mocking all we know about Jesus.
Cleverbot writes:
Well some of it.
...
ringo writes:
So you put yourself on an equal footing with the Gospel writers?
Cleverbot writes:
That computers can argue.
...
ringo writes:
That was the standard that Charles Manson used. I think we're going to use a higher standard.
Cleverbot writes:
You said you were human.
I submit that Phat is making just as much sense.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 799 by ringo, posted 09-11-2022 3:43 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 801 by ringo, posted 09-12-2022 11:40 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied
 Message 802 by nwr, posted 09-12-2022 1:13 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 864 of 895 (911863)
07-28-2023 7:53 AM
Reply to: Message 861 by Phat
07-28-2023 6:50 AM


Re: Premature Conclusions
Phat writes:
Just because you have never found evidence nor reason for inspiration does not mean that you should remain angry...
I didn't sense any anger. Did AZPaul3 say he was angry somewhere?
...over a belief that you have only come to judge based on what others tell you.
If anyone here is guilty of forming beliefs from what others say instead of from the facts on the ground, it's you.
Like most people here, the beliefs I hold now formed slowly over time. Actually, it wasn't so much the forming of beliefs as it was the falling away of beliefs I came to realize were not true.
When I was maybe 10, for some reason a book about the French Revolution sat face up on the floor in our hallway for a few months. I had read some it and understood that what we knew of the French Revolution came from people who had been there and observed events, and from artifacts and documents. Then on Sunday while reading the Bible I wondered how we knew about the events of the first couple chapters of Genesis. Who were the observers and what were the artifacts and documents? One day I realized there were no answers to these questions.
Those who understand they're accepting a religion on faith are thinking clearly.
Those who believe their religious beliefs have been proven are fooling themselves.
Those who believe that for which there is evidence tend to have more time on weekends.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 861 by Phat, posted 07-28-2023 6:50 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(1)
Message 877 of 895 (911957)
08-04-2023 11:53 AM
Reply to: Message 875 by Morbus O'Somebody
08-03-2023 12:33 PM


Re: Continuation of discussion with AZPaul3
Morbus O'Somebody in Message 875 writes:
The idea that religion is all about believing in the literal existence of a literal being called God or the literal truth of fairy tales such as the Garden of Eden or Noah's Flood just keeps the God-is-God-ain't debates chewing up bandwidth. And if you've acquired a taste for that kind of low-hanging fruit, there must be plenty of Scripturebots and fundies online on whom you can vent your immature wrath.
I might not be getting you're meaning. Are you saying there are a lot of religious nuts out there not worth arguing with? If so, then moving on to this paragraph:
You & I aren't religious because we didn't get anything out of religion and don't need religious language to make sense of our experience. It's not because we're right and religious people are wrong.
If you ignore the religious nuts and only include the reasonable and rational people then there's no one to discuss with. How do you argue with someone who says, "I believe Jesus is the Son of God, delivering His love and providing a path to salvation. I have no proof of this, but it's what I believe and it is important to me. It doesn't matter to me who else believes this. What's important to me is that I believe this and that I do my best to follow the path of Jesus."
But if they add, "Oh, and by the way, the Earth is only 6000 years old because the literally inerrant Bible says so," now you've found someone you can discuss with.
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 875 by Morbus O'Somebody, posted 08-03-2023 12:33 PM Morbus O'Somebody has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22700
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.7


(2)
Message 880 of 895 (911978)
08-06-2023 6:37 AM
Reply to: Message 878 by AZPaul3
08-05-2023 3:48 PM


Re: Demands Be Damned
AZPaul3 writes:
Finally, the combination of these two, the requirement to believe the fantasy and the requirement to act within the fantasy, has caused no end of evil for the human species.
I look at it a little differently. Religion *can* be good, often has been good, but when push comes to shove, when the pressure is on, religion tends to side with the devil. Jonestown. The pope's cooperation with fascism. Waco. Creationism. Racism. Jimmy Swaggert. Jim Bakker. Peter Popoff. Actually, almost any televangelist. The list goes on and on.
The way I see it isn't that religion is straight out evil. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's not. It's just that too often it's not.
There are many things in the world that are both good and bad, but many of them are a net good. I'm not sure whether in the overall scheme of things religion is a net good or a net bad, but I am sure that when it's bad it can be very, very bad.
The reason religion can be so bad is because it isn't run by God. It's run by people, and we all know how bad things can get when things are run by people.
There's a little TV show called Young Sheldon, I don't know if it's much watched, but the most recent season contained an apropos religious lesson. Mary was a devout member of the church, worked for the pastor for years, but when it became known that her son was having a child out of wedlock and Mary stood behind the young couple she was forced out of the church at a time when she needed it most. That's religion. In practice "Judge not that ye be not judged" becomes "Judge early and often." Religion's motto should be "Hypocrites of the world unite!"
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 878 by AZPaul3, posted 08-05-2023 3:48 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
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