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Author Topic:   Israel Declares War For The First Time Since 1973.
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 91 of 378 (913298)
10-22-2023 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 88 by Phat
10-22-2023 4:11 AM


Re: War Update from BBC
What AZLogic calls revisionist B.S. is an insult from a man who lacks the wisdom to make such a judgement.
My judgement, or lack thereof, has nothing to with the fact that Israel is an overlord installed by Britain and the USofA based on millennia-old religious claims. It was not their land to give. To insist there were legitimate reasons, some lame excuses to destroy a society in place of another, is revisionist bullshit.
Like the Ukrainians, Palestine has been fighting their subjugation by the invasion of a hostile outside power. Except Palestine has been doing so for near 70 years as the world watches an entire society being slowly ethnically cleansed out of existence.
Religion and Spiritual Legend are every bit as important to some people as Physics and Science is to AZPaul3.
Yes, indeed. That is a major part of the problem. You use reasoning and deadly force from religious fantasy to disrupt and disorder entire societies without regard for the reality. The result, Phat, has been more of the blood evil your religion forces onto humanity.
So how is your religion/spiritual legend working out for the mid-east? Bloodshed. Evil and bloodshed. Nothing but war, evil and bloodshed.
The guidance of your religion has produced the only fruit it can. Evil. Do you feel righteous? Do you feel victorious?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 88 by Phat, posted 10-22-2023 4:11 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 95 by Phat, posted 10-23-2023 10:14 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 92 of 378 (913309)
10-23-2023 5:38 AM
Reply to: Message 89 by Phat
10-22-2023 4:15 AM


Re: War Update from BBC
What likely irks you is that your party will never have the authority to make anyone or any culture make peace and allow compromise.
My 'party' is humanity, Phat. What irks me is that your religion created this atrocity and now seeks to shed more blood with it. I can see the religious evil spewing from my TV.
The Palestinian people will suffer more devastation now and more repressive cleansing when this war is over. No one will cry. No one will care. They are of no value. Your evil will continue.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 89 by Phat, posted 10-22-2023 4:15 AM Phat has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 96 of 378 (913315)
10-23-2023 10:33 AM
Reply to: Message 95 by Phat
10-23-2023 10:14 AM


Re: The Mid East War Ramps Up
You obviously are against Jesus Christ ...
Who?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 95 by Phat, posted 10-23-2023 10:14 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 175 of 378 (913554)
11-13-2023 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 173 by Phat
11-13-2023 3:03 AM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
Of course it's plausible. It's war.
Is it real?
Why would Israel lie? Given the horrendous visuals of dead civilians already suffered in this war why would they what to attack a hospital while the world watched if there is no need? Hamas is known for the use of human shields. Placing a major command bunker under a major hospital is not a stretch of credulity for Hamas.
Yeah, it's probably there.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 173 by Phat, posted 11-13-2023 3:03 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 177 of 378 (913563)
11-14-2023 7:28 AM
Reply to: Message 176 by Percy
11-13-2023 4:39 PM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
ignore

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 176 by Percy, posted 11-13-2023 4:39 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 178 of 378 (913564)
11-14-2023 7:46 AM
Reply to: Message 176 by Percy
11-13-2023 4:39 PM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
... they must first evacuate all civilians in the hospital to another medical facility ...
How?
Right now the IDF can't get near the place. The reality on the ground is not IDF but Hamas control of the surrounding area.
If there is a major Hamas command and control center under this hospital there is only one way the IDF can neutralize it, direct military force. Hamas has already said they will not talk, they want war.
Israel can try to contain the bunker but do nothing to assault it.
They can use bunker busters that penetrate 100s of feet and destroy everything on the surface including the hospital.
Or, find the tunnels leading into the complex and go on a grueling bloody rat crawl that will probably collapse parts of the hospital.
Which do you prefer?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 176 by Percy, posted 11-13-2023 4:39 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 179 by Percy, posted 11-14-2023 8:38 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 180 of 378 (913566)
11-14-2023 10:51 AM
Reply to: Message 179 by Percy
11-14-2023 8:38 AM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
What is required is for both Israel and the Palestinians to recognize that the people they oppose are not going away and that they're going to have to find ways to live peaceably with each other.
I don’t think that can happen. There is too much religion involved. We can only hope.
This whole mess is based on acceptance of millennia-old religious land claims without regard to the present occupants, in a region where the two religions had such deep divisions and non-stop wars for near 1300 years. What could possibly go wrong?
Humanity, as I see us acting, is not yet ready to be humanist. The religious poison in the power struggles is not abating.
Palestine is a social and political thorn in the heart of Israel. They are a belligerent captive population under occupation. As has been so recently demonstrated, Israel will not be safe until the occupied population can be placated, which is not happening. Over the last 70 years Israel has opted for a slow ethnic cleansing process against Palestinian society and culture. The present attack by Hamas is an opportunity for Israel to respond with such force as to greatly further their cleansing goal. I expect them to push their attack as far and as fierce as possible until they are forced to stop by world action. That means USofA action telling them to stop and threatening sanctions.
After that, hopes and prayers will be followed by some blankets and bags of grain. The politicians will wring their hands in worry and concern and a political accommodation will be stated. As usual, nothing much will have changed for the Palestinians who will still be a belligerent captive population under occupation, just 15,000 people less. Palestine will be told, once again by the international community, they must cease their struggles and submit to Israeli occupation.
God gave Israel the land and they have every right to fight for it.
Palestinian land was stolen from them by the most unclean of infidels and by the will of Allah they will fight to get it back.
Fast forward another generation …
I don't see an endgame. There is too much religion involved.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 179 by Percy, posted 11-14-2023 8:38 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 181 by Percy, posted 11-14-2023 11:29 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 182 of 378 (913568)
11-14-2023 1:20 PM
Reply to: Message 181 by Percy
11-14-2023 11:29 AM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
So in this case we should do or not do what? What actions should we take to avoid playing any role, directly or indirectly, in crimes against humanity that may be taking place in both Israel and Gaza today?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 181 by Percy, posted 11-14-2023 11:29 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 185 by Percy, posted 11-15-2023 9:27 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 236 by Percy, posted 12-04-2023 5:32 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 186 of 378 (913579)
11-15-2023 12:02 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by Percy
11-15-2023 9:27 AM


Re: This Sums Up The General Attitude
If God exists, they are not his people.
With the tortured history of Israel's relationship with their god they could use a break. Maybe Jehovah/Allah is going to torture the Palestinians for a few centuries.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by Percy, posted 11-15-2023 9:27 AM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 229 of 378 (913695)
11-29-2023 6:51 PM
Reply to: Message 226 by marc9000
11-29-2023 4:44 PM


Re: To The Victors Go The Spoils
Then why does Biden, and about half the Democrat party, continue to support them?
There are more important considerations than a public opinion popularity contest. And you know this. You're just trying to throw more bombs. Powder puffs. Duds.
It's interesting that these students are brainwashed by college professors, most of who aren't Muslims, but are atheists.
It is interesting that those taught to think freely, unencumbered by religious demagoguery, chose against your violent religious preference. Fancy that.
They're unified in their hatred of Judeo-Christianity.
If there is hatred toward some specific religious nation, you might want to consider what, of their actions over the last 70 years, has so offended the world society.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 226 by marc9000, posted 11-29-2023 4:44 PM marc9000 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 231 by marc9000, posted 11-29-2023 7:21 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 232 of 378 (913698)
11-29-2023 8:02 PM
Reply to: Message 231 by marc9000
11-29-2023 7:21 PM


Re: To The Victors Go The Spoils
Too bad my question did not have a thing in this world to do with popularity.
Message 226
Again, you are a disingenuous ass. What do you think the "court of public opinion" is? Just a plaything for your fantasies? It's a popularity contest and your side is sucking hind tit. That means it ain't doing so good in the "we believe/support you" categories.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 231 by marc9000, posted 11-29-2023 7:21 PM marc9000 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(5)
Message 253 of 378 (914083)
12-23-2023 2:34 AM


In October Hamas attacked Israel. That attack caused about 1100 dead (Israeli citizens, security forces, foreigners).
As of today the Israeli army has killed about 20,000 Palestinians, mostly civilians.
When is the blood of retribution enough?
This is not a war for security. This is ethnic cleansing of the Bosnian type. Israel is committing crimes against humanity.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 326 of 378 (918407)
04-30-2024 3:50 PM
Reply to: Message 323 by Percy
04-30-2024 8:20 AM


Re: Santayana
It is right that Israel's actions and our support for Israel are being protested, and university leadership today is following the same path of university leadership over half a century ago, hence the subtitle of this message.
It’s been a while since the American college community, disparate and fragmented across thousands of campuses, had a national focus this strong. Unjust wars and the “Powers That Be” supporting such is a strong motivator to the idealistic youth of this society.
But, the more the crackdown, the harsher the reaction of “The Establishment” to protests of their war, the more the protest fervor will spread and harden. Bad actors will be found in the student’s orbits and will be used as the excuse for all protestors to be labeled and brought down for subversion causing more reaction and sparking more protest.
This has happened before with great social shock to this society.
Regardless of political correctness the “jewish lobby” is a powerful political and social force in the power structures of American society. Their support and protection of Israel in all things can be extreme. In this war of ethnic cleansing, Israel’s massive overreaction to an unjustified attack, any criticism of Israel is labeled as unwarranted and is considered anti-Semitic, a step on the slippery slope toward Auschwitz.
This is meant to stop the criticism of an ongoing atrocity. That’s not going to work in this world today.
I was part of an old world protest from some generations ago. Kent State was real. Every protestor killed, hurt, fired, abused created three more. That spread across the society till it took down Lyndon Johnson then Richard Nixon.
Today, Israel’s control of the narrative is broken. Anti-Semitic is now like woke. The insult means nothing.
The best way to handle individual campus protests is to let them happen. Keep them safe, fed and clean. Give them plenty of space to shout and rant. Acknowledge their concerns. Let it burn itself out.
We’re Americans. When we get in the mood to protest you can fight us and we’ll fight you back. Or you can humor us, placate our emotions, and we’ll lose interest soon enough.

“There’s simply no polite way to tell people they’ve dedicated their lives to an illusion,”
-Daniel Dennett
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 323 by Percy, posted 04-30-2024 8:20 AM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 328 by Percy, posted 04-30-2024 10:08 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


Message 330 of 378 (918414)
05-01-2024 4:51 AM
Reply to: Message 328 by Percy
04-30-2024 10:08 PM


Re: Santayana
If there is a similar outcome to last time the schools across this country may well erupt.
"A little revolution now and then is a healthy thing, don't you think?" from The Hunt for Red October.

“There’s simply no polite way to tell people they’ve dedicated their lives to an illusion,”
-Daniel Dennett
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 328 by Percy, posted 04-30-2024 10:08 PM Percy has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 331 by Percy, posted 05-01-2024 8:32 AM AZPaul3 has replied
 Message 333 by Phat, posted 05-03-2024 9:43 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8593
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 4.5


(1)
Message 332 of 378 (918420)
05-01-2024 10:33 AM
Reply to: Message 331 by Percy
05-01-2024 8:32 AM


Re: Santayana
Yes, not having hundreds of your friends and family coming home every month in body bags is a significant difference. This war is not slapping you in the face every waking hour. USofA participation in this present atrocity is hidden in the shipping containers of bombs and bullets we supply to both sides.

“There’s simply no polite way to tell people they’ve dedicated their lives to an illusion,”
-Daniel Dennett
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 331 by Percy, posted 05-01-2024 8:32 AM Percy has not replied

  
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