The Historical Jesus: Did He Create the Universe?

Yep, That's why I ignore them, studies of imaginary characters in fictional books, as evidence for how the Universe started fails to provide useful knowledge.And I don't just mean in this narrow thread, but in my whole life I have never read anything by biblical scholars, because actual scientific discoveries demonstrated that almost everything in the bible is inaccurate and unverifiable and contradictory.When I was much younger I read the bible twice and the new testament a couple more times and and I still think "Holy Crap" how could anyone over 8 years old believe this shit?

He seems to think he's a great showman, but it's mostly ridiculous boasting.

Maybe you should have read something by Biblical scholars. At least the ones who are actual scholars. There’s a reason why people like Faith hate them.It was Biblical scholars who discovered the literary dependencies between the synoptic Gospels.It was Biblical scholars who showed that Daniel was about the period of the Maccabean revolt - and (at least mostly) written at that time.

You are missing my point. What they have to say doesn't interest me because the whole subject of the bible is of absolutely no interest to me. It is fiction written by ignorant bronze age goat herders, and as I said earlier I'm surprised (and embarrassed) anyone over 8 years of age believes any of it.The only reason I'm posting anything here is because I'm impatient waiting for ICANT to get to the point of the thread. So far, he's been bullshitting us, or peddling the wind as my grandfather used to say.

If you want to be prejudiced and ignorant that’s up to you. But it’s not a good thing.

You do bring up an interesting point. All we can do in this football game is kick the idea back and forth between a cosmological singularity being the whole of space, matter, energy or Jesus being that source.

Well, since I am well aware that I cannot possibly know everything I have chosen to study the subjects that interest me and to not worry about knowledge that I am unaware of, or that does not affect my life. I know a little bit about subjects I have studied, but EvC is the only place in my life where I even take minimal notice of any religious discussions, and my main participation in those is mostly pointing out hypocrisy and BS. Reading the bible was convincing that none of it would add anything positive in my life.

That would be fine if you didn’t go off spouting on about it. If you don’t know and don’t want to know anything about the subject you’re not going to have anything worth saying about it.

What? That may be your point, but it is not mine. My only point is impatience waiting for ICANT to present his cosmological model.He's demanding some sort of concession before he will start, which he is not going to ever get from me. He keeps telling us he's got something to tell us, but it's all BS.

I would argue that the life cycles of any living thing (including humans) be given a rational argument in support of Jesus, seeing as how the universe itself could give a rats ass about us (If IT indeed had a voice).Of course, none of you believe that Jesus even existed, so I don't know why you are here.Please stay, though. I need some practice rather than attempting to teach and convince through other people's videos or audio. (Though I think that all of you should at least hear some of R.C. Sproul, I can't force you to listen. )
The Nature Of ReligionI know that many of you have told me that you have no interest in listening to a preacher, but I would then ask you why you are even in ICANTS topic. Do you expect to expose him as a scientific fraud or as a fraud in general?So here we are all together in the Faith&Belief Forum. Do any of you have any faith in a "higher power"? A Creative force? Life itself? If humans go extinct would that be just how it is? Would that be natural?For these reasons, I think that discussing life cycles of life is very much on topic.
IF Jesus initially created all seen and unseen, He is very much pro-life and wants no life to go extinct without reason.

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I would argue that the life cycles of any living thing (including humans) be given a rational argument in support of Jesus, seeing as how the universe itself could give a rats ass about us (If IT indeed had a voice).

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That looks like a massive non-sequitur and off-topic, too. The stated topic is the historical Jesus so any argument should be using the methods of history. Which can’t show that Jesus was anything more than a man.

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Though I think that all of you should at least hear some of R.C. Sproul, I can't force you to listen

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I have, remember? It was awful. Though I don’t know why you can’t find written sources on the web.

Point taken. So do you personally have any belief or are you simply a numbers and data type of guy? ICANT knows that he is out of his league in the science of Cosmology. He knows that he is but a Theologian. Perhaps he is just encouraging you to think. Perhaps he wants only to have a conversation. Yeah, I don't have much-written commentary from him, but I usually form my beliefs through lots of conversations with lots of people.​

Keep in mind that ICANT has his small congregation as his priority, just as you have your life priorities and tasks to do. He, like us, finds time occasionally to engage in dialogue at EvC in his spare time. Time will tell if its all B.S. and speculation, which none of us will know until this thread dies and we stop talking.

Hi C2, ​
What law did they break
When will this take place as it has not yet? They are still in heaven and earth so when did they disobey Him? When were they cast down?
They are still running around on earth and have not been cast out of heaven yet. But He gave them no law, so how did they break any law? Yes and that is just what they have been doing running around earth enticing humans to commit sin.You can find in the book of Revelation when they will be cast down if you are interested. If you can't find it ask me for it.God Bless,

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Point taken. So do you personally have any belief or are you simply a numbers and data type of guy

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I have no religious belief.

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ICANT knows that he is out of his league in the science of Cosmology

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He’s further out of his league than he knows - some of his errors are painful to read. Not that he’s much better on the Bible, putting his own nutty ideas forward as facts and refusing to consider the problems with his (heterodox) readings.And cosmology has nothing to do with the historical Jesus, so he’s clueless on history and philosophy, too.