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Author Topic:   Phat Unplugged
Phat
Member
Posts: 18430
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 301 of 352 (916591)
03-07-2024 8:14 AM
Reply to: Message 295 by Rahvin
03-06-2024 3:30 PM


Are We Soft On Crime or Harsh On Judgement?
Rahvin writes:
Punishment is intended to prevent crime. If there is no crime, there should be no need for punishment. It's supposed to be a deterrent...unless you also get an emotional dose of dopamine from seeing transgressors suffer. I'd challenge you to take some time to consider your feelings and motivations on criminal justice.
For many many months we (employees) would see the same transgressors come in, usually with a backpack that was clearly empty , and watch them leave through the security gate (which beeps and snaps a photo) with bulging bags. Not only that, we would often catch them in the act of ripping open a box of large garbage bags, stealing one or two empty bags, and stuffing them full of various products frequently stolen. We were not allowed to engage them in any way. It was frustrating as these repeat offenders would often steal more in product than we were paid in a week!!
It was also frustrating to see them do it again and again and again! Finally, after turning in a bunch of incident reports, our store manager was able to get corporate loss prevention (as opposed to our usual security guard who too could only observe) and 2 of them showed up one week, 3 the next week, and 4 the week after that! All told they were there one month. They caught and recovered several carts FULL of expensive products and meat EVERY DAY! Our store officially reported losses approaching over $4,000.00 a day. How hurtful would it be if I lost my job because others were allowed to steal?
Rahvin writes:
I'd challenge you to take some time to consider your feelings and motivations on criminal justice.
I do not believe that people should be led to believe that there are no consequences beyond a misdemeanor. Most of the time they do not even get that. Our store is one block off of the Colfax corridor and organized criminals (yes, they are criminals in my mind) utilize the bus system to hit many stores a day every day of their lives. To be fair, many of them are drug addicts and are feeding a habit, so I would as much like them to receive help. At the same time, I and others believe that there should be consequences for stealing. This means rich people too! *cough* Trump*cough*. Occasionally we would see a middle-class non-addicted couple conveniently *forget* to press pay. Of course, as they were on their way out the door they never heard us shouting "sir! sir! You forgot to pay!
It's bad enough that inflation is eating up our discretionary income. To see so many others feel justified at stealing adds insult to injury.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 295 by Rahvin, posted 03-06-2024 3:30 PM Rahvin has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18430
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 302 of 352 (916592)
03-07-2024 8:19 AM
Reply to: Message 300 by Theodoric
03-07-2024 8:09 AM


Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
How about just being responsible and honest? How about trying to work for a living as many of us have had to do? How about taking ownership of your own country rather than feeling entitled to some sort of reparations in life? I'm talking about America today.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:09 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 304 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:25 AM Phat has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9342
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 303 of 352 (916593)
03-07-2024 8:23 AM
Reply to: Message 299 by Phat
03-07-2024 3:52 AM


Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
It only matters to me if it is a way to dampen speculative freedoms.
Does it? How?
The jury is out at the moment.
So no evidence' problem. Just some youtuber made some amorphous argument that maybe. Hint, it does not. It is to make accounting easier so they do not have to recalculate every day as the gold market fluctuates. If you have evidence of something nefarious either present it or admit you know nothing about this subject.
Gold and the dollar are countercyclical. Pumping liquidity into the markets is a method of control. Personal initiative is squashed in favor of group consensus and the "needs of the many." If they want to help Americans they could fix (and pay back) social security, let the markets fail and self-correct, and get off their soapbox. In an airplane with no oxygen, you put on your own mask first before trying to help others.
Do you know what this means? It seems to me that people that can afford to invest are doing quite well. You won't do better if the rich do better. They are only going to continue giving you crumbs. Who is "they" you talk about?
I was going to suggest you take some courses on economics and finance, but I am sure that is going to go as well as the course on critical thinking. As soon as your world view is threatened you will quit.
As Percy said you are hopeless. Clueless too.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 299 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 3:52 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 305 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:39 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9342
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.7


Message 304 of 352 (916594)
03-07-2024 8:25 AM
Reply to: Message 302 by Phat
03-07-2024 8:19 AM


Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
How is today different than any previous eras?
Not sleeping? In your manic phase?

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:19 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 306 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:45 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18430
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 305 of 352 (916595)
03-07-2024 8:39 AM
Reply to: Message 303 by Theodoric
03-07-2024 8:23 AM


Priorities
Theo writes:
It is to make accounting easier so they do not have to recalculate every day as the gold market fluctuates. If you have evidence of something nefarious either present it or admit you know nothing about this subject.
I have no degree in economics so, according to your standards, am no expert. I do see a wide variety of facts.
  • The precious metals markets are manipulated by not so much the government but by private banks such as JP Morgan Chase and other "big fish" investors. Among other tricks, these entities employ dishonest tactics such as *spoofing* as well as legal yet greedy tactics such as betting on short positions, keeping the metals from ever being a bubble. My guess is that these big fish enjoy the benefits of a system that is hopelessly rigged in their favor. I predict that there will come a day when the public-at-large will jump on the bandwagon and buy precious metals again...in large quantities. One must note that precious metals should never be thought of as an investment...like bitcoin and its many bubbles. What they are is an insurance policy against the decline in purchasing power of the US Dollar, be it digital or paper.
    Speaking of paper, ask me about paper silver vs the real deal.
    Theo writes:
    It seems to me that people who can afford to invest are doing quite well. You won't do better if the rich do better.
    True. You have a good point. We will always have the rich among us as well as the poor. One Texas woman recently bought 55 million dollars worth of physical silver. Her biggest worry will never be going broke. Mine might be.

  • This message is a reply to:
     Message 303 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:23 AM Theodoric has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 307 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:58 AM Phat has replied
     Message 313 by Taq, posted 03-07-2024 10:51 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Phat
    Member
    Posts: 18430
    From: Denver,Colorado USA
    Joined: 12-30-2003
    Member Rating: 1.0


    Message 306 of 352 (916596)
    03-07-2024 8:45 AM
    Reply to: Message 304 by Theodoric
    03-07-2024 8:25 AM


    Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
    Theo writes:
    How is today different than any previous eras?
    Hopefully we as a nation have learned a little bit about ourselves.
    Theo writes:
    Not sleeping? In your manic phase?
    TBH I am in a bit of a manic phase every day, though I have not been diagnosed with manic depression. I Do acknowledge both my manic phases as well as my depressive phases. I have been sober fom gambling for a couple of months and am reading differing opinions rather than remaining in my echo chambers. My friends have many differing opinions and likely would never get along in the same room.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 304 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:25 AM Theodoric has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 308 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 9:01 AM Phat has replied

      
    Theodoric
    Member
    Posts: 9342
    From: Northwest, WI, USA
    Joined: 08-15-2005
    Member Rating: 2.7


    Message 307 of 352 (916597)
    03-07-2024 8:58 AM
    Reply to: Message 305 by Phat
    03-07-2024 8:39 AM


    Re: Priorities
    You are still clueless and this is irrelevant. You are throwing shit against the wall to
    see if anything sticks. If you want to go back to discussing US pricing of gold I will discuss, but not going down your whirlpool of crazy.

    What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

    Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

    "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

    If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 305 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:39 AM Phat has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 309 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:31 AM Theodoric has replied

      
    Theodoric
    Member
    Posts: 9342
    From: Northwest, WI, USA
    Joined: 08-15-2005
    Member Rating: 2.7


    Message 308 of 352 (916598)
    03-07-2024 9:01 AM
    Reply to: Message 306 by Phat
    03-07-2024 8:45 AM


    Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
    You started gambling again? I kind of assumed, based upon your upped level craziness in posts over the last year. You need to get your addictions and diabetes under control or you are dying soon. How old are you now?

    What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

    Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

    "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

    If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 306 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:45 AM Phat has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 310 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:35 AM Theodoric has replied

      
    Phat
    Member
    Posts: 18430
    From: Denver,Colorado USA
    Joined: 12-30-2003
    Member Rating: 1.0


    Message 309 of 352 (916599)
    03-07-2024 9:31 AM
    Reply to: Message 307 by Theodoric
    03-07-2024 8:58 AM


    Re: Priorities
    Theo writes:
    You are still clueless and this is irrelevant.
    How come you get to call me out on personal attacks and yet make them with impunity? Note the topic we are in. Phat Unplugged. Or perhaps your fancy college degree can clue me in on what *you* think to be relevant. I await with bated breath.
    Phat writes:
    Gold and the dollar are countercyclical.
    Theo writes:
    Do you know what this means?
    Do you? Here is a clue. Gold backs money. Money does not back gold. Perhaps a good question to research is precisely how Treasury Secretary Connally (1970)separated gold and the dollar and what it meant since then.
    Theo writes:
    If you want to go back to discussing US pricing of gold I will discuss, but not go down your whirlpool of crazy.
    I don't expect you to. We are simply having a discussion. Note that you are buying breakfast, however...not me. I am the poor one here.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 307 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 8:58 AM Theodoric has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 311 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 9:53 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Phat
    Member
    Posts: 18430
    From: Denver,Colorado USA
    Joined: 12-30-2003
    Member Rating: 1.0


    Message 310 of 352 (916600)
    03-07-2024 9:35 AM
    Reply to: Message 308 by Theodoric
    03-07-2024 9:01 AM


    Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
    Theo writes:
    You started gambling again? I kind of assumed, based on your upped level of craziness in posts over the last year.
    WTF are you talking about? I rarely gamble anymore. It's been two months since I even looked at a machine.
    Theo writes:
    You need to get your addictions and diabetes under control or you are dying soon. How old are you now?
    64 and 6 months. I am still working. My goal is to get to full social security (66 and 10 months) and keep working part-time. If I quit working and sat around hre brooding on the internet I would likely die far sooner.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 308 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 9:01 AM Theodoric has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 312 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 9:54 AM Phat has replied
     Message 314 by Percy, posted 03-07-2024 2:25 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
     Message 315 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 3:36 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
     Message 317 by Percy, posted 03-07-2024 3:50 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Theodoric
    Member
    Posts: 9342
    From: Northwest, WI, USA
    Joined: 08-15-2005
    Member Rating: 2.7


    Message 311 of 352 (916601)
    03-07-2024 9:53 AM
    Reply to: Message 309 by Phat
    03-07-2024 9:31 AM


    Re: Priorities
    How come you get to call me out on personal attacks and yet make them with impunity?
    Because it is not a personal attack. It is a rational observation based upon the fact that you spout on about subjects you gave no clue about.
    Note the topic we are in. Phat Unplugged. Or perhaps your fancy college degree can clue me in on what *you* think to be relevant. I await with bated breath.
    It does not matter what topic we are in if your response is irrelevant to what I posted. Your response needs to actually address what the poster is talking about, not veer off onto subjects unrelated and a Gish gallop of nothingness.
    Here is a clue. Gold backs money. Money does not back gold.
    How about instead of spouting nonesense how about provideng facts and data? This is a mantra not a factual look at finance and currency. Gold has not backed US currency since 1934.
    Going back to a gold standard is impossible and if it was our economy would be at the whims of countries and autocrats around the world. China or Russia could manipulate our economy by manipulating the prices of gold.
    We are simply having a discussion.
    Not about the subject matter. You are changing things every post. Get your mania under control. Stop blaming the diabetes. Your mental health controls your diabetes, diabetes does not control your mental health.
    I like you Phat. In a weird, odd way I like you. Your intransigence and ignorance are extremely frustrating, but at the end of the day I like you. Deal with your mental health.

    What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

    Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

    "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

    If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 309 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:31 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Theodoric
    Member
    Posts: 9342
    From: Northwest, WI, USA
    Joined: 08-15-2005
    Member Rating: 2.7


    Message 312 of 352 (916602)
    03-07-2024 9:54 AM
    Reply to: Message 310 by Phat
    03-07-2024 9:35 AM


    Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
    How many times have you quit gambling in the 20 years you have been posting here?

    What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

    Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

    "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

    If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 310 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:35 AM Phat has replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 324 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 7:13 PM Theodoric has replied

      
    Taq
    Member
    Posts: 10191
    Joined: 03-06-2009
    Member Rating: 3.1


    Message 313 of 352 (916607)
    03-07-2024 10:51 AM
    Reply to: Message 305 by Phat
    03-07-2024 8:39 AM


    Re: Priorities
    Phat writes:
    One must note that precious metals should never be thought of as an investment...like bitcoin and its many bubbles. What they are is an insurance policy against the decline in purchasing power of the US Dollar, be it digital or paper.
    Buying a commodity with the hope that it will make you wealthier in the future is called an investment. Buying precious metals is just as much an investment as buying stocks, bonds, or real estate.
    True. You have a good point. We will always have the rich among us as well as the poor. One Texas woman recently bought 55 million dollars worth of physical silver. Her biggest worry will never be going broke. Mine might be.
    Millions of retirees are living the good life right now because of their investments in market index funds and bonds.

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 305 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 8:39 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Percy
    Member
    Posts: 22679
    From: New Hampshire
    Joined: 12-23-2000
    Member Rating: 3.8


    (4)
    Message 314 of 352 (916608)
    03-07-2024 2:25 PM
    Reply to: Message 310 by Phat
    03-07-2024 9:35 AM


    Re: The Problem With Excessive Government
    You've been in cycles of dependency with gambling and conspiracy theories and in a cycle of neglecting your health issues for a very long while now. And this is the first time I've noticed you mention mania as an issue, which seems to be current.
    Let me briefly describe what we've been observing: You tell us you're dealing with certain issues, you describe the progress you're making then you don't mention them for a while and we think everything's okay, then you suddenly reveal you've been dealing with these issues again. Over and over.
    A couple years ago you seemed self-aware about the seriousness of your issues. Now you seem intent on pretending they're no big deal.
    Please, get some help.
    --Percy

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 310 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:35 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

      
    Theodoric
    Member
    Posts: 9342
    From: Northwest, WI, USA
    Joined: 08-15-2005
    Member Rating: 2.7


    Message 315 of 352 (916609)
    03-07-2024 3:36 PM
    Reply to: Message 310 by Phat
    03-07-2024 9:35 AM


    Mental health
    I posted a couple messages on Facebook that dealt with mental health today. You prompted them.
    We just saw Jason Isbell and the 400 Unit in concert in Duluth, MN on Tuesday night. Phenomenal.
    My post.
    This song is pretty hard hitting on this. I suffer from anxiety. It is not debilitating for me. but it has altered my life in profound and subtle ways. In the last 5 years I have gotten therapy and medication for it. Both were great. I don't think one would have been effective without the other.
    I know people that suffer from anxiety. From mild to extreme. The best advice I can give is to go get it treated. Self-medication does not really help. You feel like it does, but it is right there, even worse, when you sober up.

    What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

    Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

    "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

    If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


    This message is a reply to:
     Message 310 by Phat, posted 03-07-2024 9:35 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 316 by Theodoric, posted 03-07-2024 3:40 PM Theodoric has not replied

      
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