Atheists And Science

Well, that’s what happens when you let philosophers in the room. They screw up everything.No, our concepts of cause/effect are quite well documented right down into QFT. We know what happens when one particle (cause) hits another particle and we watch and see how everything reacts (effect). We have become so good at this physics stuff that’s not something we would have missed. And, to slap Hume on the pinky, we can discover causes years, millennia, eons, billions of years in the past just by studying the effects that still ripple through time. As far as I can tell these are all known issues that the consensus of the discipline isn’t so concerned about. Since we know what we’re talking about on these things a few skeptics don’t upset the balance. Avi Loeb is still looking for his aliens. We don’t care … until he finds ‘em.Nothing here impacts LambdaCDM.You seem to be fronting for an AI, yes? What does your AI suggest should replace our present models?

They are theoretically predicted and physically evidenced. How well does your claim that something can't come from nothing measure up with respect to theory and data? Theory and experiment have come a long way since Pauli and Schwinger raised their objections. Pauli died before the strength of the evidence from the Lamb shift and the Casimir effect became apparent, while Schwinger came to accept vacuum fluctuations, though preferring a different explanation for them than zero-point energy. Look up the Schwinger Effect (creation of electron/positron pairs from the vacuum), and Schwinger begun studying the Casimir effect late in his career.And the Pauli Exclusion Principle supports the view that the vacuum isn't truly nothing.But let's say that both Pauli and Schwinger went to their graves as stout opponents of vacuum fluctuations. It's still the generally accepted theory within science, while your view is just your religion. Certainly Pauli and Schwinger never said, "Something can't come from nothing," it isn't something they espoused, and if presented with it would likely disagree.Religious people who do successful science do it the same way as all scientists, using hypothesis, experiment, data gathering, attempted verification, rethinking, peer review, etc. If you want to demonstrate that something can't come from nothing then you'll have to use the same approach. Please tell us how well these reexaminations and views have been received by the relevant scientific community. Well don't leave us hanging. What does Mr. Marsh have to say? Or did you intend for us to read his paper and then formulate your arguments for you?--Percy

Throughout the history of our universe there was something, and nothing about the history of our universe requires it to come from nothing. Not sure what relevance this has. Some physicists have speculated that our universe arose from a quantum fluctuation in spacetime, but that's not nothing. That's something. Other's have propose that our universe came about through the collapse of a previous universe or previous massive object (e.g. black hole). It is entirely possible that humans will remain ignorant of some things, which could include how our universe came about. Why our universe formed could be the same as why clouds form.

Too many people have doused their brain in Richard Darkins (rip) - a nice guy, but B-O-R-I-N-G!Try reading that (atheist) guy who wrote:God and the MultiverseGod and the AtomAnd some other books.I think his name is Stenger (Viktor or Victor?)I knew the subject would quickly get turned into biology. I like Dawkins as a person, but he is really off topic (people who like him just don't understand how rudimentary he is), and I was shocked to watch a YouTube video where he mentioned the early universe - something he acts like he never heard of (his memory goes back about 4.6 million years into the Universe, then he sputters).He actually mentioned the simulation theory once, and I was shocked.Read Stenger, ignore Dawkins.

I just remembered something a bit after I posted. I remembered Dawkins saying that he accepts the Many Worlds Interpretation. I just looked it up. Plus he does talk about the larger universe and not just biology.My bad.I always was annoyed how Dawkins blathered about religious beliefs for far too long as then it seemed like most of his science was about biology. It annoyed me, but I think he was trying to respond to biological creationists and that was what he was marketing as his biggest selling point.Actually, he is not too bad, but I preferred Stenger's focus.

I had to look Stenger up.

Wiki:

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Victor J. Stenger was an American particle physicist, philosopher, author, and prominent religious skeptic. A professor at the University of Hawaii and later adjunct philosophy professor at the University of Colorado, he researched neutrinos, quarks, gluons, and cosmic rays. Known for works like God: The Failed Hypothesis and The Fallacy of Fine-Tuning, he critiqued intelligent design, pseudoscience, and theism from a scientific and philosophical perspective.

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Are you a religious skeptic? Personally, I strongly believe that God exists and is the God of all three Abrahamic religions. Without Jesus, all that is left is fundamentalism, however. And look where that got the Middle East!

It is also entirely probable that not only will the world turn against Israel(which it essentially has) but will soon lump Christian believers into that same corner. This is prophecy talk, not scientific except in terms of a global psychological conclusion.

You have that backwards. Israel turned against the world -- and lost a lot of respect.

So its ok to keep HAMAS, Hezbollah, and the current Iranian regime in power? They all hated Israel long before GAZA and long before October 7th.

Now that metaphysics is ditched completely, I see, then perhaps my admonition over biology was ill informed.Go ahead and debate YEC biology stuff.(Now that metaphysics has been ditched for Hamas & Israel)

Don't try to tell me what I believe. I do not support Hamas or Hezbollah.Nor do I support the Israeli murderous onslaught in Gaza, and now in Lebanon.

Biology and especially YEC was not mentioned at all.(This is not an excuse to bring up Israel - modern or biblical!)Let's leave the flood, days of creation, mankind, and any discussion of Israel out of this.I counted no more than five posts before the thread topic got run off its tracks.No more derailments! Do I have to scream it?