Fresh Problem with the Ark

with an irreducably complex mechanism LOL

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist

When your corner of science acknowledges the fact of the supernatural dimension you'll understand. A lot of intelligent creo scientists and physicists believe that there is a supernatural dimension in the universe. Scientists sweep the prophecies as evidence under the rug so to speak so as to avoid acknowledging the facts of their fulfillment as verified by history.

Ah yes. When in doubt about anything to say you can always fall back on the old {when you learn you'll understand} passive-agressive pseudo-superiority insults.As if you have the inside track (a belief not based on fact ... wait that's a tautology)

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist

Ah! I understand Buz. You recognize that it is necessary to have miricles involved. That this can not be covered by anything that pretends to be testable science.Fine, then you may be a creationist, but you are not a creation-scientist. There is, therefore, no room for this in science classes.That's all a lot of us ask. Just leave the science class alone.

You miss my point, Ned. If it exists, it should be in the classroom. Why should that which exists be forbidden in the classroom? That some, I say some scientists deny it's existence does not mean the others who do are wrong until it is proven that they indeed are wrong. It all depends on how you interpret things observed and that includes the fulfilled prophecies as well as archeology, etc. The classroom is very biased and one sided.

All it has to be done is proven by repeatable, independent tests or review of available evidence.As an example, we have people claiming to see ghosts(demons, angels whatever the heck). Since we "see" them I presume that our eyes are being affected by light from them.Ah, but then we want to do some independent observation -- nope somehow they don't photograph. If that is the kind of "proof" that is going to be offered you're just asking for laughter not serious consideration.Science deals with what can be observed, worked with etc. If you have something that exists be can not be treated in this way then all the processes of science that has been honed for centuries can do is wish you good luck with it. It is not part of what the processes can deal with.Ask an accountant to make courtroom comments about DNA parentage issues. S/he'll tell you that her/his tools don't work on that. Tell a scientists that you have something that can't be measured in any existing way and you'll get the same answer.To science, with it's specific, designed in limits, this thing doesn't exist. It is not something that is designed to deal with everything you can imagine, existing or not. It is designed to deal only with things that have the kind of evidence that it can deal with.Take it to someone else or find a way to repeatably measure it.

necrophilia exists - should there be class demonstrations?

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist

There is some evidence that civilization before the flood was fairly advanced. Think about it. If everyone and all the kids they had in their lives lived to be 800 years old, the population would be huge, and people would have a lot more time to figure out what things were about (living to be that old and all). I don't want to get in to any kind of conspiracy theory garbage or anything like that — some people would argue that I already have, but here it is: There are some creationist theories about ancient atomic knowledge. http://www.s8int.com/atomic1.htmlNow obviously this site may have some problems, as it cites some conspiracy theory organizations, but please read the article on ancient atomic explosions. It is very interesting, and explanations are there even if you do not believe in a creation or flood.I will post more later on the topic of history, as it very much relates to this debate. (I hope that this forum is not strictly science, because if it is, then history should be added)

Oh yea, my point was this:If people lived 800 years, then they would probably be able to figure out things like reverse osmosis.

Could just as easily be the observation of a meteor striking the earth with subsequent explosion on an atomic scale. This has occured several times within the archaeological past.I fail to see how Gen 6 shows advanced civilization.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist

Genesis 6 shows the possibility of a description of advanced warfare before the flood. It seems that if this was the case, then weapon technology development would escalate very quickly.

I think the key to showing that they were not talking about a meteor was this part: Gurkha was flying in a swift and powerful vimana. He hurled a single projectile.*
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*PS: this is really interesting as well: The letters in the mosaic are "KROKODILOPARDALIS" which translate as "crocodile leopard."Think harder. Ancient Dinosaur Depictions | Genesis Park [This message has been edited by mf, 03-27-2004]

That "excerpt" doesn't appear in any version of the Mahabharata that I can find. Seems to have been pieced together from the various books by/for UFO conspiracy theorists. Here's a few lines I've found from another translation. But anyway, back to the ark... If technology really was advanced back then, why build the ark from wood and pitch? Genesis doesn't suggest anything more advanced than that.

Ned, no matter how remarkable the best of the Biblical prophecies, secularist education absolutely refuses to hear of it, much less acknowledge the fact of it regardless of the historical evidence.

and yet there is no evidence of any people living that long everno fossils that support that story at allin fact the trend is the other way -- the further back you go the lower the average and maximum age at death parameters become until you get to hominids that were lucky to get to twenty.IF is a very big word.

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we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand RebelAAmerican.Zen[Deist