fair trial?

As the celebrity trial of the century (a brave statement seeing we are only 5 years into it) gets underway, does anyone truly believe that Jackson can get a truly fair and unbiased trial?Child abuse allegations are bad enough at the best of times, but coupled with the media frenzy surrounding this how can this lead to an unbiased trial?

How about more of a hint? What trial is it you're talking about and is there some major legal precedent that might be decided?

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

He's talking about Michael Jackson's trial for alleged child sexual abuse. Can Jackson Get Fair Trial?. A lot of his supporters think it's impossible to pick a fair jury.No major legal precedents expected.I was astounded to hear on the news tonight that Jackson sat in court and smiled at the potential jurors all day, which the reporter interpreted as an attempt to "connect" with the jurors and convince them he's a nice guy. If I saw that gargoyle smiling aat me I'd be scared s***less.

Oh. I had heard something about that but I've never bothered reading any of the stories. Well, I hope they arrive at a reasoned conclusion.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

Here is what I think.Regardless if he is guilty or not, there is no doubt that he is really stupid.A few years back, he was accused of child molestation after he admittedly slept with some boys in the same bed. Why would a full grown man want to sleep with little boys is beyond me. Anyway, afterward, he again slept with boys in the same bed.When you are accused of something, you stop doing it. You don't keep doing it to be accused of it again unless you are a complete idiot.Jackson needs to grow up. Neverland needs to close down.

No, but I see the bias going the other way - with his fame, noteriety, and money, there's no way that he's going to face the consequences he deserves.

So you have him as guilty until proved innocent?Surely that should have been:There’s no way that he's going to face the consequences he would deserve if it was proved that he is guilty.So what is it that marks him down as guilty in your mind? The accusations, his stupidity at leaving himself open to such allegations, the fact he paid off the previous claimant, what?I’m not saying he is or isn’t guilty, just that I doubt this trial will be anywhere near what world normally be considered a normal trial.--edit-- changed some wording to clarify meaning --This message has been edited by ohnhai, 01 February 2005 14:20 AM

I think we need to see what comes out at the trial before we come to any judgements. He's clearly an oddball but that does not mean that he is a child molster*.* But my gut reaction from what I have seen and read is that he is.

I think Naive is a better word than stupid. The guys a freak, let's face it, but is being a freak a crime?

The legal system is under an obligation to consider him innocent until proven guilty; I am not. It's not so much that I know that he is; its that if he is guilty, there's no way that justice will be done. What will be done is celebrity justice.

ohnhai writes:

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So you have him as guilty until proved innocent?

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I do. Any guy who routinely sleeps with unrelated pubescent boys is probably molesting them.If I were actually sitting on that jury I'd have to refrain from passing judgement yet, but I'm not so I don't.Yes the guy's a freak, and yes he's guilty as hell. He deserves to spend the rest of his life in prison, just like any other child rapist.

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Keep America Safe AND Free!

See, this is what I mean about celebrity justice. We're supposed to believe that MJ is the only fully sexual man in existence (he's had what, two wives? And a kid or two?) who can sleep with and cuddle other people's children without any kind of sexual response or gratification?I don't buy it. If he was some kind of adult in a prolonged state of mental presexual childhood, I could buy it. But he's clearly a sexual adult.He's not just a freak. He's almost certainly a child molestor.

I would say that is normal¹ and that people who sleep with, or cuddle other people's children with any kind of sexual response or gratification are the one's with the problem. ¹Can perhaps being the operative word, it's not common in our society to sleep with anyone you're not after sex with.

MrJack quibbles:

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Can perhaps being the operative word, it's not common in our society to sleep with anyone you're not after sex with.

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There are instances I could see where it might be okay for an adult to sleep with an unrelated pubescent child without any presumption of sexual activity being made. One might be a group of hunters at a deer camp. Another might be survivors of a natural disaster sleeping together due to a lack of separate sleeping quarters.Nothing of the sort is the case with MJ. It seems obvious that he invited these boys to sleep in his bed with no other adults present. That's not normal, and as crash pointed out MJ is a sexual person. I have no problem whatsoever saying that MJ is guilty as hell of molesting little boys and that he should spend the rest of his life in prison for it.What's more, his assets should be liquidated and the proceeds donated to charities that do real work to help suffering children.Even if I were to concede that it is possible that MJ slept with boys without molesting them (which of course I am not conceding), he had a chance to stop doing this over a decade ago. He didn't.

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Keep America Safe AND Free!

I guess the OP has been proven. MJ can't get a fair trial, whether because of his celebrity status, or the social insanity regarding sex, sex and children... or even the allegation of sex and children. Interestingly Elvis slept with at least one young girl, and was not brought to trial for it. As it turned out the little girl became his wife later. Was she raped and her life ruined? Must we draw that conclusion because he did sleep with a young girl (why else would he?), and that we "know" sex must harm the young?So did Jerry Lee Lewis. He was also not brought up on charges, of course he got married to the little girl he was sleeping with. My guess is her life was ruined, but that was more because the guy was cruel (from what I heard) regardless of whether he had sex with her.So should we drag these skeletons out and try Elvis and J Lee Lewis too? What makes them different from Jackson accept for the different social expectations between then and now... or is it just that in this case it is boys and so MJ is a homosexual pedophile?Interestingly enough, has anyone heard about the damage and suffering the boys went through? I am not asking this sarcastically. As far as I know this has not been released. In that case how can anyone be talking about what they know is justice, not to mention if anything happened at all? It seems everyone has skipped both the trial and the sentencing phase.Poor Oscar Wilde... I mean Michael Jackson. Ironically, doesn't much of his wealth go to such charities? Neverland ranch is not a molestation center, even if it turns out he himself had molested a few children at his house.I do agree that MJ was living in fantasyland for not changing his ways once all the scandals kept breaking. Then again maybe he felt like the best course was to be in your face about his lifestyle just to prove his innocence? Kind of a defiant thing... very american, or foolish.He should have just moved to Europe where most of this wouldn't have even caused a problem. Not only are the laws different (in some places even if he had had sex it would have been legal), but the people don't get so hung up on hanging other people over sexual innuendo.It was not long ago that homosexuals were treated with nearly the same onesided treatment in the US, including the rush to judgment on nonhomosexuals.What the hell happened to Americans?Innocent until proven guilty, and justice according to the damage done if guilty. It will be a trial conducted by peers with evidence provided at that trial.None of us know anything at this point except that MJ looks really weird and he does some strange things that have landed him in court, for right or wrong.

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holmes
"...what a fool believes he sees, no wise man has the power to reason away.."(D. Bros)"...don't believe I'm taken in by stories I have heard, I just read the Daily News and swear by every word.."(Steely Dan)