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Author Topic:   Kingdom on Earth (Re: Barack Obama comments)
macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 1 of 308 (426975)
10-09-2007 10:54 AM


ok so i've done a bit of reading (and i tried to find something on his website to no avail) about obama's words recently.
i'm personally quite disappointed and even more concerned because i can't find any elaboration on what he said or what he meant. so i'm gonna post some links and my thoughts on them specifically and then open the floor for a discussion of this concern of mine.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,300257,00.html
blah blah more paranoid crap. if you read the stories i found, you'll know he has gotten scrutiny over this.
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=YzhlZDM0NTQ2YzVk...
a brief and mildly amusing word.
Obama's Kingdom of Heaven on Earth
shorter than i expected and less amusing than the person who quoted him.
Obama: GOP doesn't own faith issue - CNN.com
tells a bit more. i'd really like to hear the rest of this speech.
WordPress.com
oh look. insanity and name calling.
http://www.conservativeblogger.com/...s_kingdom_on_earth.php
confiscatory. sounds like the most important part of his post is "scat".
Bosun's Sail Locker: Obama's Kingdom of God on Earth
i love how this guy sneakily accentuates his middle name.
Presidential candidates should run on issues and not what they think the public wants.
the most important point. but you know he doesn't mean it. if he did, he'd be railing on giulliani, too. what the public wants indeed.
Page not found -
long list of links with lots more name calling. look, we get it. his dad was an african muslim and his name is in arabic. stfu.
anyways. needless to say i've not found anything at all that makes for intelligent reading or for actually discussing what he actually said or what he might have meant.
anyways. i guess i wanted to share my frustration with him and the internet.
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Added "(Re: Barack Obama comments)" to topic title.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 12:58 PM macaroniandcheese has replied
 Message 6 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:05 PM macaroniandcheese has replied
 Message 31 by Buzsaw, posted 10-10-2007 1:02 AM macaroniandcheese has not replied
 Message 173 by riVeRraT, posted 12-01-2007 2:48 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 2 of 308 (427003)
10-09-2007 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by macaroniandcheese
10-09-2007 10:54 AM


Can you, um, elaborate on what you are talking about? Obama is the reason why I may actually vote republican next year, but I still don't know what you are talking about.

Disclaimer:
Occasionally, owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have used he/him/his meaning he or she/him or her/his or her in order to avoid awkwardness of style.
He, him, and his are not intended as exclusively masculine pronouns. They may refer to either sex or to both sexes!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 10:54 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 1:08 PM Taz has replied
 Message 7 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:10 PM Taz has replied
 Message 13 by crashfrog, posted 10-09-2007 3:18 PM Taz has not replied
 Message 25 by nator, posted 10-09-2007 10:53 PM Taz has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 3 of 308 (427004)
10-09-2007 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Taz
10-09-2007 12:58 PM


it might help if you read the articles...
but. while making a speech to some evangelical congregation or another, he closed his speech with "We're going to keep on praising together. I am confident that we can create a Kingdom right here on Earth."
it was a weak comment with no committment and no real context from what i can tell. he didn't define his kingdom and he didn't give any effort to tell us what he wants to build. i'm really displeased with the statement in any sense, because it should have been stated so much better even with the best of meanings.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 12:58 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 1:32 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 4 of 308 (427011)
10-09-2007 1:32 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by macaroniandcheese
10-09-2007 1:08 PM


bren writes:
it might help if you read the articles...
Yes, it might help if I read the articles. But I know it will definitely help if you spoon feed me
By the way, Percy seems to be refusing to change the picture of the month. We need something that will get his attention. Is the offer of your boobs still up?
Edited by Tazmanius Devilus, : No reason given.

Disclaimer:
Occasionally, owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have used he/him/his meaning he or she/him or her/his or her in order to avoid awkwardness of style.
He, him, and his are not intended as exclusively masculine pronouns. They may refer to either sex or to both sexes!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 1:08 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 1:39 PM Taz has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 5 of 308 (427014)
10-09-2007 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Taz
10-09-2007 1:32 PM



This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 1:32 PM Taz has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 308 (427022)
10-09-2007 2:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by macaroniandcheese
10-09-2007 10:54 AM


Winning the votes
i'm personally quite disappointed and even more concerned because i can't find any elaboration on what he said or what he meant. so i'm gonna post some links and my thoughts on them specifically and then open the floor for a discussion of this concern of mine.
It sounds like he's trying to win votes to me. Most candidates do this out of necessity. Even if they are mildly religious, or totally non-religious, they have to appeal to that crowd in America.
I think in general, both conservatives and liberals were taken aback when matters of faith and morals took primacy in 2004.
I'm a little unclear, though, on what exactly he said that irritated you. Can you elaborate on the point?
Are you upset that he used religious terminology?
Edited by Nemesis Juggernaut, : Edit to add

"It is better to shun the bait, than struggle in the snare." -Ravi Zacharias

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 10:54 AM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 2:26 PM Hyroglyphx has replied
 Message 26 by nator, posted 10-09-2007 10:57 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 308 (427024)
10-09-2007 2:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Taz
10-09-2007 12:58 PM


Throwing away your vote
Obama is the reason why I may actually vote republican next year, but I still don't know what you are talking about.
In chat, maybe a week ago, you mentioned your loathing of Obama. This kind of took me by surprise. What took me even more off guard was that you stated that you might actually vote Republican. There are other Democrat candidates though.
Do you think that you will be throwing your vote away for a Democrat candidate who you will believe will end up losing?

"It is better to shun the bait, than struggle in the snare." -Ravi Zacharias

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 12:58 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 2:32 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 8 of 308 (427026)
10-09-2007 2:26 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Hyroglyphx
10-09-2007 2:05 PM


Re: Winning the votes
I'm a little unclear, though, on what exactly he said that irritated you. Can you elaborate on the point?
i'm absolutely terrified by anything whatsoever that resembles in the slightest theocratic language. celebrate your faith, but don't talk about building any kind of kingdom. the point of our country was to avoid a monarchy of any sort like THE PLAGUE. i'm further irritated that it was so half-assed a comment. i'm personally annoyed by people who refuse to make a real committment and dance around shit.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:05 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:38 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Taz
Member (Idle past 3292 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 9 of 308 (427027)
10-09-2007 2:32 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Hyroglyphx
10-09-2007 2:10 PM


Re: Throwing away your vote
Nem writes:
Do you think that you will be throwing your vote away for a Democrat candidate who you will believe will end up losing?
I don't know if he will be losing or winning. But the fact that the democrats can't find someone better...

Disclaimer:
Occasionally, owing to the deficiency of the English language, I have used he/him/his meaning he or she/him or her/his or her in order to avoid awkwardness of style.
He, him, and his are not intended as exclusively masculine pronouns. They may refer to either sex or to both sexes!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:10 PM Hyroglyphx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:51 PM Taz has not replied
 Message 14 by crashfrog, posted 10-09-2007 3:21 PM Taz has replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 308 (427028)
10-09-2007 2:38 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by macaroniandcheese
10-09-2007 2:26 PM


Re: Winning the votes
i'm absolutely terrified by anything whatsoever that resembles in the slightest theocratic language. celebrate your faith, but don't talk about building any kind of kingdom. the point of our country was to avoid a monarchy of any sort like THE PLAGUE. i'm further irritated that it was so half-assed a comment. i'm personally annoyed by people who refuse to make a real committment and dance around shit.
Well, for face value, I can't disagree with you for being slightly disgusted by people who say things just to win votes. But I guess that is politics for you.
As for being afraid of theocracies, I think you needn't be concerned with Obama's. His "let's make a heaven here on earth," smacks of a very careful and deliberate phrasing attempting to appeal with religious folk, and yet, soft enough not to offend his irreligious fan base.
It reminds me when Kerry stated that while he considered himself religious, he didn't wear his religion on his sleeve. Like Kerry's speech, it sounds like very carefully chosen words to not to offend either group so that he can get both votes.

"It is better to shun the bait, than struggle in the snare." -Ravi Zacharias

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 2:26 PM macaroniandcheese has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 2:42 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 11 of 308 (427029)
10-09-2007 2:42 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Hyroglyphx
10-09-2007 2:38 PM


Re: Winning the votes
he didn't say heaven. he said kingdom.
smacks of a very careful and deliberate phrasing attempting to appeal with religious folk, and yet, soft enough not to offend his irreligious fan base.
that was probably his intent. he failed. also, irreligious is a stretch.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Hyroglyphx, posted 10-09-2007 2:38 PM Hyroglyphx has not replied

Hyroglyphx
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 308 (427038)
10-09-2007 2:51 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Taz
10-09-2007 2:32 PM


Re: Throwing away your vote
I don't know if he will be losing or winning. But the fact that the democrats can't find someone better.
Well, I don't think its so much that they can't find anyone better, so much as it is that not very many people are willing to take on that level of responsibility.
Being a president, while it certainly has its frills, must be more stressful than anything I could imagine. Many people in office are just not willing to invest that much of their lives to such a demanding job.
I always wanted Colin Powell to run. I think he's a quiet man with incredible resolve and wit. I think he has the knowledge and temperament to be a great president, who will rise above the politics of politics. But, he isn't willing to be president. There's nothing I can do about that.
Unfortunately, with many people who run for president, they have megalomaniacal tendencies, IMO. They really, really just want to be the Boss. It seems many of them are more interested in their personal motives for being president, than running a nation effectively. The latter almost seem like a perk to them.
As far as Democrats go, I wouldn't stab myself in the eyes if Obama were to become the next president. I think he's intelligent and genuinely concerned with the country. At the same time, I think he's prone to platitudes instead of actual solutions. I also feel that he is inexperienced. But I do have some respect for him, nonetheless.
I'm curious as to why you don't. And more than that, why you think none of the Democrat candidates are no good. Joe Biden?
Edited by Nemesis Juggernaut, : No reason given.

"It is better to shun the bait, than struggle in the snare." -Ravi Zacharias

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 2:32 PM Taz has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 13 of 308 (427055)
10-09-2007 3:18 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Taz
10-09-2007 12:58 PM


Obama is the reason why I may actually vote republican next year
Wait, what? This doesn't make a lick of sense. Assuming he wins the primary, which is only maybe 30% likely, he's up against either Romney or Giuliani, one of which is a senseless thug-o-crat and the other is a made-for-tv stuffed shirt.
You'd be cutting off your nose to spite your face. Is there any way for me to reach through your monitor and slap some sense into you?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 12:58 PM Taz has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by macaroniandcheese, posted 10-09-2007 3:22 PM crashfrog has not replied

crashfrog
Member (Idle past 1467 days)
Posts: 19762
From: Silver Spring, MD
Joined: 03-20-2003


Message 14 of 308 (427056)
10-09-2007 3:21 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Taz
10-09-2007 2:32 PM


Re: Throwing away your vote
But the fact that the democrats can't find someone better...
Better? What's wrong with Obama, exactly?
Specifically, what's wrong with him that, in your view, neither Clinton nor Edwards are superior?
Unlike Republicans this cycle, Democrats managed to field three great candidates. Republicans seem to have the choice between dumb, dumber, and dumbest. Perhaps if you could specify your concerns in terms of their actual policies and character, as opposed to nebulous phrasings about who you "like" better, you might actually demonstrate sufficient engagement in the process to deserve to vote, just a thought.
Edited by crashfrog, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 2:32 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Taz, posted 10-09-2007 5:01 PM crashfrog has replied

macaroniandcheese 
Suspended Member (Idle past 3928 days)
Posts: 4258
Joined: 05-24-2004


Message 15 of 308 (427057)
10-09-2007 3:22 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by crashfrog
10-09-2007 3:18 PM


this is what i feel like saying to "other option" people. as much as i'd love to vote for jimmy carter with all my heart, i know it wouldn't ever happen. i'm not going to be the person who splits the vote and elects the worst person for the job.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by crashfrog, posted 10-09-2007 3:18 PM crashfrog has not replied

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