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Author | Topic: The Divine signature in the Torah | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Eliyahu Member (Idle past 1091 days) Posts: 288 From: Judah Joined: |
Bs'd
Some people doubt the fact that the Torah is of divine origin. Fortunately, for those we have the divine signature in the Torah, something that is totally unique to the Torah, namely the codes woven into the Torah. They have been the subject of much debate, books have been written about them, people tried to debunk them, they have been published in high grade peer reviewed scientific journals like for instance "Statistical Science", people tried to debunk them in that self same journal, but when everything is said and done, one conclusion is inescapable, the codes exist. This can be checked by everybody who takes a few minutes to check them out. Hebrew texts of the Torah are available online, the Hebrew alphabet can be found in many places, for instance here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrew_alphabet, and that is enough to see the codes for yourself. For instance, the Torah starts with the word “bereshiet”, which means “in the beginning”. The last letter of that word is a tav, the Hebrew equivalent of the English T. When we skip from that tav 49 letters after it, (49 being 7 x 7, and 7 is a special number in Judaism) then we get a waav, a W, which in some cases is used to indicate a vowel, an oa like in boat, or an oo like in book. The same thing we see in the second book of the Torah, Exodus. There, from the first tav jumping 49 letters, we get again “Torah”. In the fourth book we see Torah with the same skip, but now spelled backwards: H-R-O-T. And in the fifth book, Deuteronomy, we again see the word “Torah” spelled backwards, from a hey in the beginning of the chapter, and from there every 49th letter. So in the first two books we see “Torah” spelled straight, and in the last two of the five books of the Torah we see “Torah” spelled backwards. And in the third, the middle book, we don't see “Torah” encoded. However, wat we see there, from the first yot, with a skip of seven, is the four-lettered name of God “Y-H-W-H”. So the words “Torah” encoded in the first two and the last two books of the Torah, are “facing” the name of God. Another interesting easy to check code is in the beginning of Genesis 2, this text is recited by every religious Jew on Friday night, for the sanctification of the shabbat. “Thus the heavens and the earth were completed in all their vast array. There is no debate necessary about these codes, because everybody can check them out, they are there. They are a fact. And of course there are much deeper, longer, and more mind blowing codes. The Torah codes just refuse to die. Peer reviewed articles keep on being published about them. They are here to stay. "The only reality is mind and observations." Richard Conn Henry, professor Johns Hopkin department of physics
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AdminPhat Administrator Posts: 1984 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: |
Thread copied here from the The Divine signature in the Torah thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.
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Larni Member Posts: 3999 From: Liverpool Joined: |
With the right 'code' you can get it to say anything.
And if your god is so brilliant why did he piss about in code rather than writing out exactly what he meant?
Mean anything? Edited by Larni, : The above ontological example models the zero premise to BB theory. It does so by applying the relative uniformity assumption that the alleged zero event eventually ontologically progressed from the compressed alleged sub-microscopic chaos to bloom/expand into all of the present observable order, more than it models the Biblical record evidence for the existence of Jehovah, the maximal Biblical god designer. -Attributed to Buzsaw Message 53 The explain to them any scientific investigation that explains the existence of things qualifies as science and as an explanation Does a query (thats a question Stile) that uses this physical reality, to look for an answer to its existence and properties become theoretical, considering its deductive conclusions are based against objective verifiable realities.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
How about a pointer to this stuff. Claims of this type, if they are not to be dismissed as numerology at best, have a high threshold to meet before they will be considered credible. Given that we are in the science forums, I would have expected that the vetting process would be a little heavier on the evidence side. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 5732 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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A Lie That Won't Die.
You continue to misrepresent the truth. You lie. quote: quote: You ignore the overwhelming body of evidence that your bible codes are false and can be duplicated in many other works your god had nothing to do in creating ... unless you think both Melville and Tolstoy are gods. You lie. Why? Is your faith that weak?
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Eliyahu Member (Idle past 1091 days) Posts: 288 From: Judah Joined: |
Bs'd Please show me that "overwhelming body of evidence". I have shown you the codes, they are there for everybody to see. Now show me comparable codes in any other text. "The only reality is mind and observations." Richard Conn Henry, professor Johns Hopkin department of physics
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Coragyps Member Posts: 5550 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined:
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Does a bereshiet in the woods?
That is the more serious question.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 5732 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 4.8
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You didn't even bother with the source I provided, did you.
Here's another for you to ignore. Be sure not to look through all the links at the bottom. And yet another with lots of links to ignore, especially the "Expert Opinions" link toward the bottom where there are a dozen links to studies each with links to more studies. You want overwhelming? You got it. You really are an imbecilic silly little excuse for a jew, aren't you. Your rabbis must cringe with embarrassment every time you show up on Shabbat.
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 47 days) Posts: 16112 Joined:
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But even if we suppose that all these things like you've described were the result of an intelligent stunt to hide or bury words in subtle ways included into Biblical texts, I still wonder why you would think this was utterly divine. By what sign could we all conclude that this literature was designed by the Omnipotent instead of a determined man? But perhaps you doubt that a clever chap could ever manage such a thing. This paragraph indicates that yes he could. Butevenifwes Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.
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sfs Member (Idle past 1364 days) Posts: 464 From: Cambridge, MA USA Joined: |
Or this famous, decidedly non-divine, episode.
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Eliyahu Member (Idle past 1091 days) Posts: 288 From: Judah Joined: |
Bs'd Yes, I mean something like that, but then woven into an existing text that actually makes sense. So show me. "The only reality is mind and observations." Richard Conn Henry, professor Johns Hopkin department of physics
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Eliyahu Member (Idle past 1091 days) Posts: 288 From: Judah Joined: |
Bs'd I'm not asking for links, I'm asking examples of codes, worked into an existing text. Since the claim is that are found in "War and Peace", and in "Moby Dick", they cannot be so hard to find.
Nobody is perfect. "The only reality is mind and observations." Richard Conn Henry, professor Johns Hopkin department of physics
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Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 47 days) Posts: 16112 Joined: |
That text does exist and actually makes sense. How about you answer it?
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Taq Member Posts: 8482 Joined: Member Rating: 6.3 |
The Bible Codes boil down to a fancy Sharpshooter Fallacy where you paint the bull's eye around the bullet hole. No one predicted beforehand that specific phrases would be found in the Torah. Instead, they manipulate the Torah until they get something, and then claim after the fact that the Torah meant to say that all along.
What would have been much more impressive is if the codes were predicted before any manipulation was done, but that isn't the case.
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Eliyahu Member (Idle past 1091 days) Posts: 288 From: Judah Joined: |
Bs'd
The codes I showed you guys, four or five lettered words with a skip between 7 and 50, can. with a bit of patience, be integrated in a text. No divine intervention needed for that one. Still, they are good examples to show that the codes are there, because everybody can check it out for himself. Also, the myth about the Bible that the shepherds were laying around the campfire at night, being bored, and decided to put some old myths on paper, is with the existence of those codes shown to be wrong. There definitely is something going on with that text. That's for sure. That's why the Bible codes don't wanna die, because they are right there, alive and kicking. So now time for some more serious stuff. For this I have to give some background information, for the sake of those who were raised without any knowledge of their Biblical heritage. And now the code. It just happens to be so that the word “esther” pops up in the Torah (the Torah is the first five books of the Tanach; Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy, that is the most holy part of the Jewish Bible) only once, and that is in Genesis 4:14. Isn't that amazing? Edited by Eliyahu, : No reason given. "The only reality is mind and observations." Richard Conn Henry, professor Johns Hopkin department of physics
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