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Author Topic:   Divine rain vs. meteorological precipitation
Mallon
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 14 (292649)
03-06-2006 9:31 AM


I recently read an excellent book entitled "Paradigms on Pilgrimage" (it's a critical look at the creationist perspective, written by both a palaeontologist and a pastor). One of the chapters in the book raises the issue of 'divine rain vs. meteorological precipitation.' The authors essentially question why there is no creationist movement working against modern meteorology, as it has come to explain the phenomenon of rain without an appeal to God (e.g. related to adiabatic, orographic, pressure effects, etc.). According to the Bible, however, rain is clearly brought forth only by God's doing (e.g. Gen 2:5; Lev 26:4; Deut 28:12; 1 Sam 12:18; Matt 5:45; etc.). I would love to know from the creationists on this board if and why they have come to accept the scientific interpretation of rain, but not the scientific interpretation as to the diversity of life on earth. Why the double-standard?

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminSchraf, posted 03-06-2006 9:56 AM Mallon has not replied
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 10:45 AM Mallon has replied
 Message 8 by Chiroptera, posted 03-06-2006 12:11 PM Mallon has not replied

  
AdminSchraf
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 14 (292666)
03-06-2006 9:56 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Mallon
03-06-2006 9:31 AM


Where would you like this to go?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Mallon, posted 03-06-2006 9:31 AM Mallon has not replied

  
Mallon
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 14 (292674)
03-06-2006 10:07 AM


wherever
You're the admin... you tell me where it goes!
Maybe Miscellaneous? Not sure where else to put it...

  
AdminSchraf
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 14 (292678)
03-06-2006 10:11 AM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 5 of 14 (292690)
03-06-2006 10:45 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Mallon
03-06-2006 9:31 AM


Science says how, God superintends why. For all of it. Why the rain came this way but not that, why the winds went that direction and not this, why the temperature dropped here but rose there etc. Meteorologists can't know the whys beyond the most immediate cause and effect and even then circumstances are always changing on them.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Mallon, posted 03-06-2006 9:31 AM Mallon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by sidelined, posted 03-06-2006 10:52 AM Faith has replied
 Message 7 by Mallon, posted 03-06-2006 11:04 AM Faith has replied
 Message 9 by nator, posted 03-06-2006 2:13 PM Faith has replied

  
sidelined
Member (Idle past 5930 days)
Posts: 3435
From: Edmonton Alberta Canada
Joined: 08-30-2003


Message 6 of 14 (292695)
03-06-2006 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Faith
03-06-2006 10:45 AM


Faith
Science says how, God superintends why. For all of it.
Then you accept that the physics we have is correct in explaining how the world operates yes?
This message has been edited by sidelined, Mon, 2006-03-06 08:53 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 10:45 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
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Mallon
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 14 (292700)
03-06-2006 11:04 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Faith
03-06-2006 10:45 AM


quote:
Science says how, God superintends why.
So you accept, then, the scientific explanation as to how rain forms and falls. Why do you not also accept the scientific explanation as to how life diversifies? Why the double standard? You never really answered my question. You just supported my initial assertion.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 10:45 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 3:16 PM Mallon has not replied

  
Chiroptera
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 14 (292737)
03-06-2006 12:11 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Mallon
03-06-2006 9:31 AM


Genesis 1:7:
And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which [were] under the firmament from the waters which [were] above the firmament: and it was so.
This seems to indicate that the author of Genesis accepted the belief common in the Middle East at this time that the sky was a solid dome that separated waters in heaven from the waters on the earth.
In case there is any doubt, we also have Genesis 7:11:
In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
So there you have it. Heaven has windows, and rain is caused when those windows are opened, allowing the waters in heaven to fall onto the earth. Again, consistent with the cosmology of the peoples in this area.
So, a literal interpretation of the Bible would lead one to believe that the sky is a solid dome and rain occurs when these windows are open.
Of course, these days we have the hydrology cyclists attempting to compromise the Word of God, but they are doing Satan's work. After all, which will you believe, the Eternal, Unchanging Word of God, or scientists who change their theories every year?

"Intellectually, scientifically, even artistically, fundamentalism -- biblical literalism -- is a road to nowhere, because it insists on fidelity to revealed truths that are not true." -- Katha Pollitt

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Mallon, posted 03-06-2006 9:31 AM Mallon has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2191 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 9 of 14 (292770)
03-06-2006 2:13 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Faith
03-06-2006 10:45 AM


quote:
Science says how, God superintends why.
So, does this mean that you accept that DNA is the basis of all heredity, as Biologists and Geneticists do?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 10:45 AM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Faith, posted 03-06-2006 3:13 PM nator has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 10 of 14 (292784)
03-06-2006 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by nator
03-06-2006 2:13 PM


Of course. But the idea of descent from one kind to another is a misinterpretation of DNA.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by nator, posted 03-06-2006 2:13 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 11 of 14 (292785)
03-06-2006 3:13 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by sidelined
03-06-2006 10:52 AM


Of course.

This message is a reply to:
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Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 12 of 14 (292787)
03-06-2006 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Mallon
03-06-2006 11:04 AM


So you accept, then, the scientific explanation as to how rain forms and falls. Why do you not also accept the scientific explanation as to how life diversifies? Why the double standard? You never really answered my question. You just supported my initial assertion.
I think the explanation as to how life diversifies, meaning the ToE I suppose, is bad science. No double standard. The ToE is unverifiable and unfalsfiable, nothing but an imaginative self-validating construct, all interpretation with no point at which one can enter and say for sure it is right or wrong. Bad science. Or not science at all.
I have to be gone for a while so if I don't get back to future answers for a day or two I will eventually.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Mallon, posted 03-06-2006 11:04 AM Mallon has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 13 of 14 (292792)
03-06-2006 4:17 PM


People, let's focus on rain and meteorology
This is not in any way a biology topic.
Any mention of biology, biological evolution, or the theory of (biological) evolution is off-topic.
Adminnemooseus
This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 03-06-2006 04:18 PM

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nator
Member (Idle past 2191 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 14 of 14 (292808)
03-06-2006 5:25 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Faith
03-06-2006 3:13 PM


quote:
But the idea of descent from one kind to another is a misinterpretation of DNA.
Are you willing to explain how it is a misinterpretation if I start another thread?

This message is a reply to:
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