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Author Topic:   Cosmology 101
Force
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 79 (472172)
06-20-2008 9:29 PM


Greetings
I am interested in discussing the BBT and the related phenomena like inflation, relativity, blue-shift, red-shift, black holes, stars, and so on. I am also interested in discussing the other theories related to the "beginning of the universe" other than what is in the mythological realm such as the Christian Bible. The reason I would like to discuss the BBT and all the related Scientific phenomena, instead of just read about it elsewhere, is because I am a kinesthetic learner and I learn typically via interaction with subjects.
www.AllAboutScience.org writes:
Big Bang Theory - The Premise
The Big Bang theory is an effort to explain what happened at the very beginning of our universe. Discoveries in astronomy and physics have shown beyond a reasonable doubt that our universe did in fact have a beginning. Prior to that moment there was nothing; during and after that moment there was something: our universe. The big bang theory is an effort to explain what happened during and after that moment.
According to the standard theory, our universe sprang into existence as "singularity" around 13.7 billion years ago. What is a "singularity" and where does it come from? Well, to be honest, we don't know for sure. Singularities are zones which defy our current understanding of physics. They are thought to exist at the core of "black holes." Black holes are areas of intense gravitational pressure. The pressure is thought to be so intense that finite matter is actually squished into infinite density (a mathematical concept which truly boggles the mind). These zones of infinite density are called "singularities." Our universe is thought to have begun as an infinitesimally small, infinitely hot, infinitely dense, something - a singularity. Where did it come from? We don't know. Why did it appear? We don't know.
After its initial appearance, it apparently inflated (the "Big Bang"), expanded and cooled, going from very, very small and very, very hot, to the size and temperature of our current universe. It continues to expand and cool to this day and we are inside of it: incredible creatures living on a unique planet, circling a beautiful star clustered together with several hundred billion other stars in a galaxy soaring through the cosmos, all of which is inside of an expanding universe that began as an infinitesimal singularity which appeared out of nowhere for reasons unknown. This is the Big Bang theory.
Big Bang Theory
Error 404 (Not Found)!!1
Please do not participate in this thread if you're going to try and attempt to disprove the BBT or any of the related phenomena.
Edited by Force, : video
Edited by Force, : edit -change thread title from: Bing Bang Theory 101 to Cosmology 101 so that a broader conversation on outer space can occur

Thanks

  
AdminNosy
Administrator
Posts: 4755
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Joined: 11-11-2003


Message 2 of 79 (472176)
06-20-2008 9:45 PM


Thread moved here from the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 79 (472186)
06-20-2008 10:11 PM


Greetings,
it is my understanding that our universe started as an infinitely small-dense-hot singularity that expanded to what we have today. What evidence does cosmology have that theorizes the start of our universe from such a strange phenomena?
P.S. I realize that I could search for links on the internet but I have found a lot better links through discussion on the EVC Forum.
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit

Thanks

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 10:18 PM Force has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3547 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 4 of 79 (472187)
06-20-2008 10:18 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by Force
06-20-2008 10:11 PM


Universal Expansion
Cosmic Background Radiation

I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 10:11 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 10:31 PM Taz has replied

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 79 (472189)
06-20-2008 10:31 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by Taz
06-20-2008 10:18 PM


Taz,
How did cosmologist determine that the universe is expanding? How do cosmologist know that the universe is expanding from a singularity? How is cosmic background radiation detected?
Edited by Force, : grammar
Edited by Force, : grammar
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit

Thanks
To believe in "Force" is to believe in Love, Wisdom, Intelligence, Force, Agility, and Charm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 10:18 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 10:44 PM Force has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3547 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 6 of 79 (472193)
06-20-2008 10:44 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Force
06-20-2008 10:31 PM


Almost universal red shifts. Basically, everywhere they looked, everything was red shifted. The further away the objects, the more red shifted they were.
If everything is expanding at an accelerated speed right now in every direction, it doesn't take a genius to work it backward to a lot smaller and compact universe.
The BBT predicted a very hot, very dense universe near the beginning. If so, an afterglow of this early condition should be found everywhere we look. I can't remember off the top of my head the guys that first discovered it. What happened was they kept picking up a background noise in their instruments. At first, they thought the instruments were faulty, but they couldn't find what was wrong. Then they decided to point the radio telescope to a different direction and they got the same background noise. In fact, everywhere they looked they saw the same thing. BINGO! They found the "afterglow" predicted by the BBT.

I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 10:31 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 10:51 PM Taz has replied

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 79 (472196)
06-20-2008 10:51 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by Taz
06-20-2008 10:44 PM


Taz,
Taz writes:
Almost universal red shifts. Basically, everywhere they looked, everything was red shifted. The further away the objects, the more red shifted they were.
So in all directions, external to our planet, all stars are red shifted?
Taz writes:
If everything is expanding at an accelerated speed right now in every direction, it doesn't take a genius to work it backward to a lot smaller and compact universe.
I suppose anything is possible but how do cosmologist know that the universe is expanding outward from a point instead of just simply moving in a single direction like a current?
Taz writes:
The BBT predicted a very hot, very dense universe near the beginning. If so, an afterglow of this early condition should be found everywhere we look. I can't remember off the top of my head the guys that first discovered it. What happened was they kept picking up a background noise in their instruments. At first, they thought the instruments were faulty, but they couldn't find what was wrong. Then they decided to point the radio telescope to a different direction and they got the same background noise. In fact, everywhere they looked they saw the same thing. BINGO! They found the "afterglow" predicted by the BBT.
So the cosmic background radiation is a glow, noise, or both?

Thanks
To believe in "Force" is to believe in Love, Wisdom, Intelligence, Force, Agility, and Charm.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 10:44 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 11:07 PM Force has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3547 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 8 of 79 (472200)
06-20-2008 11:07 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Force
06-20-2008 10:51 PM


Force writes:
So in all directions, external to our planet, all stars are red shifted?
No, not all stars. Remember that we are talking in cosmic scales here. Stars are insignificant. We are talking about galaxies, globular clusters, etc.
I suppose anything is possible but how do cosmologist know that the universe is expanding outward from a point instead of just simply moving in a single direction like a current?
Because everywhere we look things are accelerating away from us.
So the cosmic background radiation is a glow, noise, or both?
Hahahahahaha
It's an electromagnetic "noise". It's not sound wave if that's what you mean. It's within the electromagnetic spectrum, specifically microwave.
I referred to it as "noise" because in a sense it is noise. Imagine yourself in a party with a lot of people. Every direction you could hear background noises, and clearly these background noises aren't coming from any single source you could identify. That's what the cosmic background radiation is. It's clearly not coming from any single source that we could see. Yet, everywhere we look it's there at 3K.

I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 10:51 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 11:21 PM Taz has replied
 Message 21 by Force, posted 06-21-2008 2:15 PM Taz has not replied

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 79 (472202)
06-20-2008 11:21 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Taz
06-20-2008 11:07 PM


Taz,
Taz writes:
No, not all stars. Remember that we are talking in cosmic scales here. Stars are insignificant. We are talking about galaxies, globular clusters, etc.
Ok
Taz writes:
Because everywhere we look things are accelerating away from us.
Ok, so cosmologist can determine that due to the red-shift.
Taz writes:
Hahahahahaha
It's an electromagnetic "noise". It's not sound wave if that's what you mean. It's within the electromagnetic spectrum, specifically microwave.
I referred to it as "noise" because in a sense it is noise. Imagine yourself in a party with a lot of people. Every direction you could hear background noises, and clearly these background noises aren't coming from any single source you could identify. That's what the cosmic background radiation is. It's clearly not coming from any single source that we could see. Yet, everywhere we look it's there at 3K.
LOL. I have been reading about this stuff but it is a little difficult to grasp. So, effectively, cosmic microwave radiation is a "noise" in a frequency range that can't be heard via the ear but can be seen via a electromagnetic detecting device. LOL...
Edited by Force, : edit

Thanks

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 11:07 PM Taz has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 11:46 PM Force has replied

  
Taz
Member (Idle past 3547 days)
Posts: 5069
From: Zerus
Joined: 07-18-2006


Message 10 of 79 (472206)
06-20-2008 11:46 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Force
06-20-2008 11:21 PM


Force writes:
So, effectively, cosmic microwave radiation is a "noise" in a frequency range that can't be heard via the ear but can be seen via a electromagnetic detecting device.
Just to get something clear, no part of the electromagnetic spectrum can be "heard" by the ear.

I'm trying to see things your way, but I can't put my head that far up my ass.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 11:21 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 11:53 PM Taz has not replied

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 79 (472208)
06-20-2008 11:53 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Taz
06-20-2008 11:46 PM


Taz,
Taz writes:
Just to get something clear, no part of the electromagnetic spectrum can be "heard" by the ear.
I realized that(freq range way to high to hear with ear) I just like to be formal and discuss things. . I seem to get a better understanding of things when I use the FAQ format. I am sure it makes me look like an idiot. LOL. Oh well. I have my learning cap on. LOL. So, based on the current cosmological understanding everything in post 9 is correct, right?
I would also like to discuss the phenomena of a infinite or finite universe. I understand that whether or not the universe is infinite or finite depends on the omega value, right? Which means we have no idea as of right now, right? However, reason would dictate a finite universe since the universe had a begining, right?
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : grammar

Thanks

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Taz, posted 06-20-2008 11:46 PM Taz has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Son Goku, posted 06-21-2008 8:31 AM Force has replied

  
Son Goku
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 79 (472233)
06-21-2008 8:31 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Force
06-20-2008 11:53 PM


It's light.
I realized that(freq range way to high to hear with ear)
I just wanted to state that the frequency range is not the reason you cannot detect electromagnetic radiation. Electromagnetic radiation is light, which you never "hear". A more accurate way of thinking about it is that this "noise" is only there in colours you can't see.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Force, posted 06-20-2008 11:53 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Force, posted 06-21-2008 12:53 PM Son Goku has not replied

  
Force
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 79 (472254)
06-21-2008 12:53 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Son Goku
06-21-2008 8:31 AM


Re: It's light.
Son Goku,
What kind of device was used to detect it?
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit
Edited by Force, : edit

Thanks

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Son Goku, posted 06-21-2008 8:31 AM Son Goku has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by cavediver, posted 06-21-2008 1:20 PM Force has replied

  
cavediver
Member (Idle past 3899 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 14 of 79 (472261)
06-21-2008 1:20 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by Force
06-21-2008 12:53 PM


Re: It's light.
Hi Force...
What kind of device was used to detect it?
Originally this:
And in more modern times, this
And most recently, this
The radiation itself looks like this...
Bugger, you try to be clever, and look what I've just found
Edited by Admin, : Reduce image width.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by Force, posted 06-21-2008 12:53 PM Force has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by Force, posted 06-21-2008 2:04 PM cavediver has replied

  
Agobot
Member (Idle past 5785 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 15 of 79 (472264)
06-21-2008 1:57 PM


Multiverse
The strentgh of the fundamental forces in the universe(force of gravity, speed of light, strong nuclear force, weak nuclear force, proton mass, etc.) is so finely tuned(to support life?), that the only good explanation for the existence of these finely tuned conditions besides god, would be a multiverse and multiple big bangs giving rise to multiple universes.

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by Force, posted 06-21-2008 2:09 PM Agobot has not replied
 Message 20 by Rahvin, posted 06-21-2008 2:14 PM Agobot has not replied
 Message 22 by Alasdair, posted 06-21-2008 2:26 PM Agobot has replied
 Message 38 by Taz, posted 06-21-2008 8:12 PM Agobot has replied

  
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